Author Topic: C# Aurora v0.x Suggestions  (Read 351509 times)

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Offline Father Tim

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Re: C# Aurora v0.x Suggestions
« Reply #1980 on: February 23, 2020, 12:24:32 PM »
However, the governor of a 100m colony on the moon is not a civil serveant but a political figure in charge of a very large nation in modern real terms. Under most democratic government, this bloke would serve limited terms. If I am roleplaying as a democracy, I can't really imagine what the civilian administrators represent - are they elected politicians or senior civil serveants? is the governor of earth a presidential figure or the equivalent of like permanent undersecretary of some ministry?

The "Governor of Earth" is clearly a senior civil servant -- a Permanent Under-Scretary of State for <whatever> in Westminster-style democracies -- though I am going to use circular reasoning to assert that. . .  Because said governor is not replaced every election, and is not the one deciding 'build more construction factories, pause fuel production, etc.'

We the player are the elected governement, the Minister for Mining & Minerals or whoever.  The Civiilian Administator is responsible for carrying out our policies as efficiently as possible.  Ergo, senior civil servant.
 

Offline jonw

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Re: C# Aurora v0.x Suggestions
« Reply #1981 on: February 23, 2020, 12:54:05 PM »
We the player are the elected governement, the Minister for Mining & Minerals or whoever.  The Civiilian Administator is responsible for carrying out our policies as efficiently as possible.  Ergo, senior civil servant.

As you say, your reasoning is obviously circular here. If this is true, it would make sesne to have multiple administrators per colony to represent a broad staff of specialists, rather than 1 named person. There is a paralell in the c# naval command+control rules for this, in that now ships can have multiple lower ranking officers.

There is not one democracy I can imagine that would entrust the management of a multiple millions of people to 1 civil serveant, and if they did, any such single figure would become a de facto monarch very quickly, rather than a member of a civil service. The closest parallel I can think of to this would be proconsuls in the roman republic, but even their authority was time-limited.
 

Offline Hazard

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Re: C# Aurora v0.x Suggestions
« Reply #1982 on: February 23, 2020, 01:02:28 PM »
I think we might be speaking at crosspurposes here. I can imagine that the civilian adminstrator of a comet mining colony is a directly appointed civil serveant, fair enough - picking the guy with the best mining skill is a no-brainer, that colony represents a commercial not political interest and this is clearly a job best given to professionals who may serve professionally in that role for a long period of time. However, the governor of a 100m colony on the moon is not a civil serveant but a political figure in charge of a very large nation in modern real terms. Under most democratic government, this bloke would serve limited terms. If I am roleplaying as a democracy, I can't really imagine what the civilian administrators represent - are they elected politicians or senior civil serveants? is the governor of earth a presidential figure or the equivalent of like permanent undersecretary of some ministry?

As a player, I might want a governor who is going to increase construction and pop growth, and I would want that guy to serve indefinitely and get better over time. However, under a political process, the 100m electorate of the lunar colony might want to prioritize something else for their own local reasons which may appear irrational to the player (brexit? the lunar colony clearly needs shipyard bonii even though there are no shipyards, thats a campaign promise you can believe in!). And then 5 years in the future, the agenda would change, and a different set of debately releveant priorities would emerge.

Under the c# command rules, ships can have multiple officers and we have several commands over them. It might be fun to add a similiar level of complexity to civilian adminstrators, with some delineation between permanent appointed civil serveants working in professional roles, and temporary elected roles for colonies with larger population, or both on the same colony.

Actually, that guy in charge of a comet mining facility that is appointed?

Might not have a mining bonus. He might have a big enough political bonus however that rates how good he is at convincing the people making the decision that he is either knowledgeable enough or reliable and loyal enough to the people assigning him put him there for a variety of reasons, up to and including him being much less likely to cause a problem than mister rebellious mining genius who could also be assigned.

Or he might have screwed up so badly for whatever reason at a colony that despite his clear competence in managing shipbuilding projects he is kicked to a forgettable corner of the nation so that tempers can cool.


When political decision making gets involved, skill and competence often compete with how much the people making the decision think they themselves benefit or suffer from that decision. Assigning a mining genius to a colony whose main economical sector is mining may sound like a no brainer, but you may want them somewhere else for a number of different reasons.


That elected official of the Luna colony with the shipbuilding bonuses probably wouldn't be elected if he runs on a shipbuilding platform unless the Luna colony itself wants to do shipbuilding. It might also be that he ran on a manufacturing platform, which he may or may not be competent in but convinced enough people it was a good idea to elect him on that basis.

Simulating the political process and prioritization of a nation would be quite difficult and involved, while leaving it entirely randomized would be frustrating because of how powerful the bonuses can get, and how much a new roll of the dice can and most likely will skewer your long term plans. It's not helped by the fact that the game actually has a fairly slow pace on the strategic layer; ships often take a year or more to build, so you have to plan ahead by several years at a minimum just to be confident that you will have what you need at that point in time. If an election in the middle of that period craters mining of a critical mineral you need to build and maintain your ships and facilities, or majorly slows down ship construction so that every slip you could use is occupied and yet need to do major maintenance and refits in slips that should've been cleared and idle months earlier, that gets really annoying.

And sure, if you can assign administrators long term to a colony they can keel over dead and leave you with the same problem, but in that case you at least have the option of reassigning other administrators to plug the gap and catch the damage. That's not something you can do with what's effectively a randomized bonus selection system that allows no attempt to mitigate the damage without needing to completely overhaul your entire nation's building and personnel distribution.

It'd be less bad if the bonuses couldn't stack up so massively. Losing a 5% bonus is inconvenient but something you can cover for. Losing a 20% bonus is crippling.
 
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Offline Garfunkel

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Re: C# Aurora v0.x Suggestions
« Reply #1983 on: February 23, 2020, 01:16:10 PM »
The admin side has slowly grown over the years - your Fleet Admiral used to be your Civilian Administrator at the same time. I'd be happy wit growing the civilian administrator side, feature-wise, post C# release at some point and yeah, incorporating some elements from Crusader Kings and Stellaris, for example, could be useful.

As it is, you can RP your admin staff the way you want and I'd like to maintain that freedom. Your planetary governor can be your elected president in one game and a permanently appointed civil servant in another game and the executive program that your AI Hivemind obeys in a third. Any mechanisms added to it should be flexible.

For balance, I don't think it matters. Sure, the admin bonuses can get huge and in an even knife-fight they can be the difference between life and death, but that's a rare occasion. After all, it's entirely possible to have a successful game without any leaders whatsoever.
 
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Offline Rabid_Cog

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Re: C# Aurora v0.x Suggestions
« Reply #1984 on: February 24, 2020, 07:15:15 AM »
If you want to roleplay a democracy, just manually reassign whichever governor has the highest administration to each position every 5/10/whatever years. Bam. Instant democracy. Clearly "Administration skill" is a proxy for how many people are willing to follow this bloke and therefore his popularity.
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Offline Alsadius

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Re: C# Aurora v0.x Suggestions
« Reply #1985 on: February 24, 2020, 09:23:33 AM »
That would break the academy mechanic, due to conjuring civilian administrators out of thin air.

Not necessarily. You just have an election take place between existing admins. Heck, for a really basic system, you could just pick two admins of appropriate level at random, and let the player pick between them.

You can get into more advanced election mechanics - Victoria 2 comes to mind, since I've been re-playing that recently - but it's really not necessary, and it'd probably be a lot of work.

Offline Shuul

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Re: C# Aurora v0.x Suggestions
« Reply #1986 on: February 25, 2020, 08:55:08 AM »
Is it possible to get a new game parameter to configure energy weapon breakdowns chance? Reading from the post for me they seem to be too frequent (and too costly in MSP) and I would like to somehow change this.
 

Offline spudman1996

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Re: C# Aurora v0.x Suggestions
« Reply #1987 on: February 25, 2020, 10:31:39 AM »
On the Research section, change "Completion Date" to "Days to Completion".
And use "Days to Completion" in ascending mode.   

It is truly irritating to have the dates spread all over the board.     
« Last Edit: February 25, 2020, 11:24:37 AM by spudman1996 »
 

Offline Alsadius

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Re: C# Aurora v0.x Suggestions
« Reply #1988 on: February 25, 2020, 11:32:00 AM »
On the Research section, change "Completion Date" to "Days to Completion".
And use "Days to Completion" in ascending mode.   

It is truly irritating to have the dates spread all over the board.   

Or use Completion Date ascending, for a similar effect.

Offline Steve Walmsley

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Re: C# Aurora v0.x Suggestions
« Reply #1989 on: February 25, 2020, 11:55:25 AM »
Is it possible to get a new game parameter to configure energy weapon breakdowns chance? Reading from the post for me they seem to be too frequent (and too costly in MSP) and I would like to somehow change this.

I may change the frequency of breakdown based on play test (as I already did from 2% to 1%) but the breakdown itself won't be an option.

The breakdown is to counter the ability of beams to penetrate atmosphere in C#. Otherwise, you could simply kill everything on a planet from orbit given sufficient time.
 

Offline Steve Walmsley

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Re: C# Aurora v0.x Suggestions
« Reply #1990 on: February 25, 2020, 12:16:14 PM »
On the Research section, change "Completion Date" to "Days to Completion".
And use "Days to Completion" in ascending mode.   

It is truly irritating to have the dates spread all over the board.   

Or use Completion Date ascending, for a similar effect.

The projects are sorted by number of facilities descending. I've added an option to sort by completion date ascending.
 
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Offline L0ckAndL0ad

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Re: C# Aurora v0.x Suggestions
« Reply #1991 on: February 26, 2020, 12:31:39 PM »
Target Tracking Bonus from Multiple Sensors

I propose to give a slight bonus to target tracking (accuracy) based on the amount of sensors tracking the target. As ships are separated from one another and presumably data-linked into a single combat network create an array of radars and processing computers, having multiple radars tracking the target should allow some advanced processing techniques that can get you better accuracy. Or, this could be used somewhat differently, in terms of having more raw computing power being distributed among several ships simultaneously, allowing faster calculations, and maybe even better resolution(?). But a simple + accuracy bonus should do fine.

A bonus cap is required, obviously. Currently implemented solution for existing time/tracking bonus should work here just as well, I guess.

Why do this?
I was thinking about my older ship and fighter designs and future, more optimized designs, and when considering their sensor equipment I realized there's not that much purpose to have many sensors within the same formation of ships, except for redundancy. Why not figure a way to change that?. Giving an accuracy bonus for each radar in the formation (or all in the vicinity) will give an incentive to have sensors on all your ships (counter to "radarless designs meta"), while still being limited by the price of such equipment.

This is a reality-based idea that should promote realistic behavior and give an alternative to "pure meta" designs.
« Last Edit: February 26, 2020, 12:54:19 PM by L0ckAndL0ad »
 
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Offline Garfunkel

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Re: C# Aurora v0.x Suggestions
« Reply #1992 on: February 27, 2020, 11:36:39 AM »
I like it and I support it, especially if we can control individual active sensors instead of all or none. Currently, all sensors are on or all sensors are off on a hull.
 

Offline Father Tim

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Re: C# Aurora v0.x Suggestions
« Reply #1993 on: February 27, 2020, 01:10:54 PM »
I like it and I support it, especially if we can control individual active sensors instead of all or none. Currently, all sensors are on or all sensors are off on a hull.

Steve said C# Aurora would fix that, and you could turn individual sensors on and off, but I can't find a post in the Changes List indicating he's done it.
 

Offline Tikigod

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Re: C# Aurora v0.x Suggestions
« Reply #1994 on: February 27, 2020, 10:34:23 PM »
Bit of a niche use request, but a little check box on the production/colony management screen that allows us to mark a colony to be automatically abandoned once devoid of all population and installations would be kind of nifty.  ;D
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