Electronic Counter Measures

[ExChairman (OP)]

Hmmm, does the firing ship have to have ECCM to counter the enemy ECM or is it possible to have one ship with ECM and a active sensor lead the rest of the ship(s)?
Or can the fighter scout with the active sensor paint the target and then let the fighter squadron with only fire controls fire its missiles??

[3_14159]

To my knowledge, every ship firing at an ECM protected enemy needs one ECCM per fire control. . .  or you simply use oversized fire controls for them, which should be cheaper and you don't need to research them.  At least for missile fire controls this should be a quite viable tactic.  For example, in the game I'm playing at the moment, my destroyers are using fire controls with double the necessary range and therefore size.  They are, however, only 100 tons, while controlling 3 launchers each, with 900 tons at all.  So, by going from 950 to 1000 tons (a about 5% increase) I'm countering up to ECM-5.  And I just had to spend 210RP once to research the bigger FCs.
Because ECM only affects fire controls (less range for missile fire controls, less accuracy for beam fire controls) but not sensors and such.

The second idea is quite feasible, as far as I know nearly anybody is using it when operating fighters: One dedicated scout fighter with only an active sensor (or reduced armament and a sensor), and some fighters with only a fire control.
This actually would also be possible with normal sized ships, although I myself equip each ship with actives nonetheless, to ensure that they remain able to fight even if my sensor ship decides to explode.  Again, doesn't have to be big, my destroyers of 10,000 tons each are mounting 200 tons of sensor in total, allowing them to fight at their normal missile range and detecting enemy missiles hopefully soon enough (They're not combat tested, at least not against anything firing back).  And, if necessary, it should allow them to fight on their own.

[Charlie Beeler]

Hmmm, does the firing ship have to have ECCM to counter the enemy ECM or is it possible to have one ship with ECM and a active sensor lead the rest of the ship(s)?
Or can the fighter scout with the active sensor paint the target and then let the fighter squadron with only fire controls fire its missiles??

You need 1 ECCM per fire control on the firing ship.  Fighters are paticularly handicapped in that that smallcraft versions of both ECM and ECCM are limited to being at least 2 generations behind full size units and are expensive to research.

[LtWarhound]

Hmmm, does the firing ship have to have ECCM to counter the enemy ECM or is it possible to have one ship with ECM and a active sensor lead the rest of the ship(s)?

Yes, the firing ship needs the ECCM, no the ECCM on the active sensor ship doesn't help.

ECM and active sensors don't interact.  Regardless of how much ECM an enemy ship has, the active sensor will still detect it at the range the radar is made for.

Firing at the ship, that's when the ECM comes into play.  If your Missile Fire Control (MFC) can get a firing solution out to 50m km normally, and the enemy ship has 10 ECM, then you might need to get to as close as 45m km (roughly) before you can fire.

Each ECCM works for the MFC its assigned to.  If you have three MFCs, then you will probably want three ECCMs, one for each.

The 'cheap' way to get around ECM for missiles is to overengineer the MFC.  If your active sensor reachs out to 50m km, and your missiles go out to 50m km, then you may want your MFC to reach out to 60 or 75m km.  Then when the enemy ECM cuts your MFC range down, you still can fire.

With Beam Fire Controls, ECM affects your beam weapon's chance to hit.  Again, you want an ECCM unit for each BFC.  Over-engineering BFC doesn't help like it does with MFCs, so strongly consider ECCM if you are going with beam weapons.

Or can the fighter scout with the active sensor paint the target and then let the fighter squadron with only fire controls fire its missiles??

Ignoring ECM/ECCM for the moment, this works, in the sense that you only need one active sensor that can see a target before you can fire on it, and that sensor can be anywhere - on the firing ship, another ship in the same fleet, a ship in a different fleet on the other side of the system, on a PDC, anywhere, as long as it can detect the target. 

The fighters will still need ECCM or overengineered MFCs to counter enemy ECM, or suffer the penalties.

[blue emu]

Actually, since the to-Hit chance of a Beam FC depends on the fraction of maximum range at which you engage the target, over-engineering your Beam FCs (for increased range) does indeed reduce the effect of ECM.

[TheDeadlyShoe]

in practice, combat-competitive beam FCs are typically maxed on range, and therefore cannot be engineered further.  Even where they arnt, increasing a beam FCs size has a much higher mass cost than most MFCs, especially when multiplied by the tracking speed modifier. 

basically, ECM/ECCM has a far bigger impact on beam combat than it does on missile combat. If you plan on fighting in beam range, its probably a good idea to invest in ecm/eccm technology.  But if you plan to use all missiles, you can probably get away without any.

[Arwyn]

Just to add to this, ECM is a very handy defensive measure for your ships, since its reducing enemy ability to lock on at range. While a lot of human players "game" the system by over engineering their fire controls, the AI has a much more measured response.

High levels of ECM let you reduce the enemy ships ability to fire AT you. So assuming all things are equal, but you have higher ECM, you will be able to engage and fire on his ships sooner than he can shoot at you.

In Aurora, he who shoots first wins!