Author Topic: Personal Log: Senior Captain He Yab Fong (16)  (Read 4776 times)

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Offline Steve Walmsley (OP)

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Personal Log: Senior Captain He Yab Fong (16)
« on: September 04, 2007, 07:28:37 AM »


Personal Log: Senior Captain He Yab Fong

14th February 2157
Although it has been over two years since our last battle with the Agar Imperium, the war is still at the forefront of every imperial officer?s thoughts. Our losses to date include seven Manchu class battlecruisers, three Xian area defence cruisers, four destroyers, three survey cruisers and fifteen thousand dead officers and crew. The rebuilding of the fleet is still undeway and it has been a long and hard road. Seven Manchu III class battlecruisers are now in active service with the Imperial Fleet and nine more are under construction, along with six Luda class destroyers. We have underestimated the Agar in the past but when we return to Yunan to avenge our dead comrades, we will do so in overwhelming force. My own ship Fengning, the only surviving battlecruiser in the Second Battle of Yunan, is currently undergoing a refit to the new Manchu III standard and will be ready in three months. The only drawback of our building programme is that it initially concentrated on capital ships so there are no light warships to patrol the approaches to either the Agar home system or the Beijing system. As the Agar are four transits away and apparently had no jump drive capability two years ago, that should not be a significant problem.

Code: [Select]
Manchu III class Battlecruiser    10000 tons     1192 Crew     1711 BP      TCS 200  TH 840  EM 1440
4200 km/s     Armour 1     Shields 48-300     Sensors 1/0/0/0/0     Damage Control 0-0     PPV 56
Replacement Parts 10    

Ion Engine (14)    Power 60    Engine Efficiency 0.70    Armour 0    Exp 5%
Fuel Capacity 150,000 Litres    Range 92.6 billion km   (255 days at full power)
Gamma R300/14 Shields (24)   Total Fuel Cost  336 Litres per day

Fusion Torpedo Launcher (6)    Range 200,000km     TS: 4200 km/s    Power 15-4    ROF 20        6 6 6 6 6 6 6 6 6 6
12cm C4 Ultraviolet Laser (2)    Range 160,000km     TS: 4200 km/s    Power 4-4    RM 4   ROF 5     4 4 4 4 3 2 2 2 1 1
Fire Control 128K-3200 (2)    Max Range: 256,000 km   TS: 3200 km/s     96 92 88 84 80 77 73 69 65 61
Gas-Cooled Fast Reactor (4)     Total Power Output 36    Armour 0    Exp 5%

Active Sensor H1250-6M (1)     GPS 600     Range 6.0m km    Resolution 25
18th February 2157
In August last year, the Han class jump cruiser Qin was exploring the jump points of the Qingdao system, three transits from both Sol and Beijing, when she found an extremely rare ideal world in a system her commander named Shanxi. Given the vital nature of this information, he immediately brought his ship back to the JGN system of Kunming and informed naval operations on September 26th 2156. Fleet Admiral Long Shan De ordered the ship back to Shanxi to investigate the habitable world. Normally this would be handled by geological survey ships but the three Houjians lost in Yunan several years ago have yet to be replaced. Two Houjians are now under construction but the first will not be ready until August 2157. In the following three months there was no further contact from Qin so in mid-December the Admiral sent a second Han, the Shang, to investigate. Her commander was given strict instructions to transit into Shanxi and withdraw immediately if there was no sign of Qin. Three hours ago, Shang entered Kunming with news that her sister ship had seemingly vanished without a trace.

There are several possible explanations, the most worrying of which is that the ideal world is home to another hostile race. However, if the Agar have surveyed their home system system and developed jump technology, it is possible she may have run into one of their warships. It could even be a Commonwealth or US sneak attack, destroying one or our ships while it is out of contact. Its even possible, abelit unlikely, that Qin suffered a catastrophic maintenance failure. Whatever the reason, another imperial ship has been lost, along with over seven hundred crew. Fleet Admiral Long Shan De has decreed that an armed force will be sent to investigate. Three Manchu III battlecruisers, along with the Xian class area defence cruiser Pinyin, with be sent from Beijing to rendezvous with Shang in Kunming. They will return to Shanxi, search for Qin and make a close inspection of the habitable world.

22nd February 2157   09:45  
Deep Space Tracking on New Beijing has just detected a small thermal sensor contact at 150m kilometers, on a course from the Quanzhou jump point. The thermal signature and speed are identical to that of the small scout ships encountered in the Agar home system. As Quanzhou is the first system on the route to the Agar homeworld, it is almost certainly an Agar scout, which leads to several worrying conclusions. The Agar Imperium has obviously developed jump drive technology and as the scout is too small for its own jump drive, there must be an Agar jump ship somewhere in the Beijing system. In addition, the Agar must have surveyed their own system, the Konghou system, which only has two jump points, the Haikou system and at least some of the nine systems connected to Haikou, including Quanzhou. They are moving very fast. The question for Imperial Intelligence is how many warships the Agar have available and if they are able to commit them against Beijing. Its possible their jump ship is only capable of escorting survey ships and it seems very unlikely they have a jump ship capable of escorting their 18,000 ton battleships. In any event, the mystery of Qin?s disappearance will have to wait. The four warships en route to the Chongqing jump point have been recalled and the fleet is getting ready to leave orbit. To my intense frustration I will left behind on Beijing because Fengning is still in the shipyard. At least I been have invited to fleet operations to observe and advise as required.

The scout is moving at 5500 km/s so it will be impossible for any of our ships to catch. However, we must prevent it getting any closer to New Beijing so the four Manchu IIIs in orbit will spread out and attempt to intercept. Meanwhile, the three Manchu IIIs and the Xian which left orbit four days ago, will head directly for the Quanzhou jump point. Unfortunately they are eight billion kilometers away and it will take twenty-four days for them to arrive but we need to secure the jump point as soon as possible.

18:00
With the battlecruisers still 60m kilometers from intercept, the alien contact has reversed course, either because it has detected their approach or it has picked up emissions from New Beijing.

23rd February 2157   04:30  
Contact with the scout has been lost, although as it was on a direct course for the Quanzhou jump point its intention seems clear. Fleet Admiral Long has ordered both of our task forces to converge on the jump point and secure it against any further incursions. In case things do not go according to plan, two tankers and two jump gate construction ships in orbit of New Beijing have been ordered to head for the Sol system where they should be reasonably safe.

04:50
After receiving his orders, Captain Pan Song De of the battlecruiser Qingyuan II contacted operations and suggested that our forces should gather in New Beijing orbit rather than move out to the jump point. The two Hegu class PDCs would provide missile cover in any engagement and if the Agar decline to attack, we would have two additional battlecruisers and six Luda class destroyers by early June. He pointed out that by engaging in deep space, we could give the Agar a tactical advantage if they have maintained their speed advantage. His suggestion seemed reasonable but Fleet Admiral Long has overruled him on the basis that the new Manchus are faster than the Agar?s battleships and although the Agar?s destroyers are capable of 4900 km/s, they are outranged by the Manchu IIIs. Captain Pan perservered, noting that the Empire has introduced more capable classes in the last two years and the Agar may have done the same. From what little I know of Admiral Long, he used to be far more cautious but he has come under great pressure from the Emperor in the last few years to be aggressive in his prosecution of the war. He may see this incursion as a way to score a quick victory for the Empire. Whatever his reasons, he ordered Captain Pan to proceed immediately to the jump point or be relieved of his command.

Code: [Select]
Hegu class Planetary Defence Centre    44500 tons     3220 Crew     6175 BP      TCS 178  TH 0  EM 0
Armour 10     Sensors 40/48     Damage Control 0-0     PPV 240
Troop Capacity 4 Divisions    Magazine 6600    

PDC Missile Launcher S12 (20)    Missile Size 12    Rate of Fire 90
Missile Fire Control S03-090 (2)    Range: 900k km
ICBM (200)  Speed: 16,000 km/s   Endurance: 1 secs    Range: 16k km   Warhead: 12    Size: 12
GL-1 Anti-Ship Missile (200)  Speed: 16,000 km/s   Endurance: 29 secs    Range: 464k km   Warhead: 5    Size: 12
GL-2 Anti-Ship Missile (150)  Speed: 12,000 km/s   Endurance: 38 secs    Range: 456k km   Warhead: 5    Size: 12

High Resolution Thermal Sensor HRT5-40 (1)     Sensitivity 40     Detect Signature 100: 4m km
Active Sensor H1250-12M (1)     GPS 1200     Range 12.0m km    Resolution 25
Active Sensor H4000-38M (1)     GPS 3840     Range 38.4m km    Resolution 80

20:15
Although I initially regretted being left behind when the fleet left orbit, spending time in operations is allowing me to gain far more insight into the running of our naval forces. The latest development is that the governor of New Beijing, Vice Admiral Tsien, has suggested that we should consider alerting the Commonwealth and the United States to the danger presented to the human race as a whole by the Agar Imperium. As the Commonwealth already knows the location of New Beijing, it would be possible to request assistance without sacrificing too much in terms of security. Fleet Admiral Long has dismissed the suggestion and reprimanded Tsien for defeatism.

8th March 2157
It is now fifteen days since contact with the Agar scout was lost and the closest ships are still one point six billion kilometers from the jump point to Quanzhou, which is seven billion kilometers from the Beijing primary. The other group of four Manchurian ships is 900m kilometers astern so Fleet Admiral Long has reluctantly ordered them to concentrate before moving on the jump point. The combined force is designated as the Second Battle Squadron under Captain Pan Song De.

15th March 2157  22:12
Another tense week has passed as the nine ships of the Second Battle Squadron closed on the Quanzhou jump point. Finally, at a range of nineteen million kilometers, the H4000-19M Active Sensor on the Xian class cruiser Pinyin picks up five contacts directly on the jump point. Assuming the Agar do not have access to some type of stealth technology, the cross-section on the contacts suggests a 5000 ton ship and four 4650 ton ships. Although the 5000 ton ship could be the previously encountered Agar destroyer class, that seems unlikely given that it is larger than the other ships and that there is no evidence the Agar had jump drives two years ago. It is far more likely that the 5000 ton contact is a new jump-capable class. The smaller contacts do not match the cross-section of any known Agar ship type.

23:02
A sixth contact, with a cross-section of 1450 tons, has been detected at six million kilometers by the Pinyin?s secondary H1250-6M Active Sensor. Although the H1250-6M has only a third the range of the H4000-19M, it is capable of locating targets as small as 1250 tons, compared to 4000 tons for the H4000-19M. This new contact appears to be the scout that approached New Beijing before fleeing to the jump point. Suddenly, the 5000 ton contact and two of the smaller contacts vanish. Twenty seconds later, the 5000 ton contact returns, appearing 40,000 kilometers from the jump point and moving to join the three remaining Agar ships.

23:03
Once again the 5000 ton contact vanishes, along with the other two 4650 ton contacts. The Agar are obviously pulling out of the Beijing system. Within a minute, the ship returns for a second time and escorts the scout into Quanzhou. Fleet Admiral Long orders Captain Pan to pursue immediately. Captain Pan requests that Admiral Long reconsider as he has only one jump ship, Han, which is capable of escorting only two other ships in a jump. Han plus two others would  transit, arriving up to 50,000 kilometers from the jump point then Han would have to move to the jump point, jump back to Beijing, again arriving up to 50,000 kilometers away, rejoin the fleet on the jump point and then repeat the process until all ships were in Quanzhou. As Captain Pan points out as politely as possible, there is no way to know what awaits on the Quanzhou side and the Manchurian ships would be jumping in piecemeal, with each pair of battlecruisers arriving in different locations and up to thirty seconds apart. This could quite easily be an Agar trap. Fleet Admiral Long warns Pan that he will tolerate no more insubordination and insists that he begin transiting his battlecruisers as soon as he arrives at the jump point.

23:25
The jump freighter Han, Captain Pan?s battlecruiser, Quinyang II and the area defence cruiser Pinyin all transit the Quanzhou jump point. Ten seconds later they are all back in Beijing with very worrying news. An Agar fleet of five 5000 ton ships and fifteen 4650 ton ships was waiting directly on the Quanzhou ? Beijing jump point. Fortunately, the small squadron arrived only 5000 kilometers away so they were able to escape before the Agar ships could open fire. Arriving more than 20,000 kilometers from the jump point would have been disasterous and in that case it is unlikely that any of the ships could have escaped. Details of the Agar fleet are relayed directly to the Fleet Admiral by an icily polite Captain Pan.

It would appear our hope of an overwhelming superiority in ships against the Agar was a forlorn one. In two years they have apparently developed jump ships, explored a number of systems, built a powerful fleet and brought it almost to the capital of the Empire. The only remaining question is why they waited in Quanzhou rather than advancing on New Beijing. It is possible they do not want a deep space fight for some reason or perhaps they were baiting a trap to reduce our forces before moving into Bejing. Fleet Admiral Long has ordered the fleet to remain within weapon range of the jump point in an attempt to destroy any transiting Agar ships but he appears to have abandoned any thoughts of an assault on Quanzhou.

The Agar action and our inability to force the Beijing ? Quanzhou jump point has effectively cut off twenty systems, reducing Manchurian space to just twenty-eight systems. Fortunately we have no colonies in the affected area but it does contain several valuable mineral deposits and a number of potential terraforming sites. With a hostile fleet on our doorstep, the Empire will have to concentrate all its efforts on defending the capital and preparing to push the Agar back to their home system. Unfortunately this will leave no resources to determine the fate of the Qin, at least for the moment.

Steve
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 06:00:00 PM by Steve Walmsley »
 

Offline MWadwell

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Re: Personal Log: Senior Captain He Yab Fong (16)
« Reply #1 on: September 11, 2007, 12:43:31 AM »
The fact that there was no pickets in the systems between the Agar or Beijing, or even on the Quarzhou-Beijing Jump Point, would mean that if I was a member of the Chinese Admiralty, I would want Admiral Long to be hung......
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 06:00:00 PM by MWadwell »
Later,
Matt
 

Offline Steve Walmsley (OP)

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Re: Personal Log: Senior Captain He Yab Fong (16)
« Reply #2 on: September 11, 2007, 05:57:45 AM »
Quote from: "MWadwell"
The fact that there was no pickets in the systems between the Agar or Beijing, or even on the Quarzhou-Beijing Jump Point, would mean that if I was a member of the Chinese Admiralty, I would want Admiral Long to be hung......

It was a little dumb but I plead two factors for the defence. The Manchurians were pretty much out of ships and had no light units left. Their building program concentrated on battlecruisers, which they didn't want to risk as pickets. What they probably should have done was recall their survey units and use them as pickets, which is what the United States did with their own alien encounter. The second reason is that in Starfire you can picket warp points indefinitely but in Aurora, the ships use up spares and eventually need to be recalled so the easy route is to leave ships at colonies with maintenance facilities until they are needed.

The Manchurians have now built the first four units of the Xining class, with which they are picketing the Beijing - Quanzhou jump point (leading to the Agar), the jump point to Commonwealth territory and the Kunming - Qingdao jump point, one jump from Shanxi where the Qin vanished.

Code: [Select]
Xining class Scout Frigate    2400 tons     225 Crew     397 BP      TCS 48  TH 240  EM 0
5000 km/s     Armour 1     Shields 0-0     Sensors 40/0/18/0/0     Damage Control 0-0     PPV 0
Replacement Parts 5    

Ion Engine (4)    Power 60    Efficiency 0.70    Signature 60    Armour 0    Exp 5%
Fuel Capacity 50,000 Litres    Range 128.6 billion km   (297 days at full power)

High Resolution Thermal Sensor HRT5-40 (1)     Sensitivity 40     Detect Signature 100: 4m km
Active Sensor H4000-38M (1)     GPS 3840     Range 38.4m km    Resolution 80
Active Sensor H1250-9M (1)     GPS 900     Range 9.0m km    Resolution 25
EM Detection Sensor EM3-18 (1)     Sensitivity 18     Detect Strength 100: 1.8m km

Steve
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 06:00:00 PM by Steve Walmsley »
 

Offline Doug Olchefske

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Re: Personal Log: Senior Captain He Yab Fong (16)
« Reply #3 on: September 11, 2007, 08:30:12 AM »
Quote from: "Steve Walmsley"
It was a little dumb but I plead two factors for the defence. The Manchurians were pretty much out of ships and had no light units left. Their building program concentrated on battlecruisers, which they didn't want to risk as pickets. What they probably should have done was recall their survey units and use them as pickets, which is what the United States did with their own alien encounter. The second reason is that in Starfire you can picket warp points indefinitely but in Aurora, the ships use up spares and eventually need to be recalled so the easy route is to leave ships at colonies with maintenance facilities until they are needed.

The Manchurians have now built the first four units of the Xining class, with which they are picketing the Beijing - Quanzhou jump point (leading to the Agar), the jump point to Commonwealth territory and the Kunming - Qingdao jump point, one jump from Shanxi where the Qin vanished.

Code: [Select]
Xining class Scout Frigate    2400 tons     225 Crew     397 BP      TCS 48  TH 240  EM 0
5000 km/s     Armour 1     Shields 0-0     Sensors 40/0/18/0/0     Damage Control 0-0     PPV 0
Replacement Parts 5    

Ion Engine (4)    Power 60    Efficiency 0.70    Signature 60    Armour 0    Exp 5%
Fuel Capacity 50,000 Litres    Range 128.6 billion km   (297 days at full power)

High Resolution Thermal Sensor HRT5-40 (1)     Sensitivity 40     Detect Signature 100: 4m km
Active Sensor H4000-38M (1)     GPS 3840     Range 38.4m km    Resolution 80
Active Sensor H1250-9M (1)     GPS 900     Range 9.0m km    Resolution 25
EM Detection Sensor EM3-18 (1)     Sensitivity 18     Detect Strength 100: 1.8m km
Steve


For a picket I would have had a lot more spares; 10-15. My ships seem to break down all too frequently.  :(
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 06:00:00 PM by Doug Olchefske »
 

Offline Steve Walmsley (OP)

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Re: Personal Log: Senior Captain He Yab Fong (16)
« Reply #4 on: September 11, 2007, 11:17:56 AM »
Quote from: "Doug Olchefske"
For a picket I would have had a lot more spares; 10-15. My ships seem to break down all too frequently.  :(

The chance of breakdown is based on ship size. As the scout is only 2400 tons (48 HS), 5 spares should last several years. The actual formula involved is:

// chance of system failure
BaseFailureChance = ClassSize / 2
YearsSinceOverhaul = (GameTime - LastOverhaul) / SECONDSPERYEAR
       
// failure chance mutiplied by 1000 to bring 3 decimal places into play
FailureChance = (BaseFailureChance * YearsSinceOverhaul) * (IncrementLengthInSecs/SECONDSPERYEAR) * 1000
       
// modify according to crew grade
FinalFailureChance = FailureChance * 1 - (Int(Sqr(ShipGradePoints) - 10) / 100)

Assuming basic crew grade, the chance for a failure on this scout is 24% in year 1, 48% in year 2, 72% in year 3, etc,

Steve
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 06:00:00 PM by Steve Walmsley »
 

Offline MWadwell

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Re: Personal Log: Senior Captain He Yab Fong (16)
« Reply #5 on: September 11, 2007, 05:52:18 PM »
Quote from: "Steve Walmsley"
Quote from: "MWadwell"
The fact that there was no pickets in the systems between the Agar or Beijing, or even on the Quarzhou-Beijing Jump Point, would mean that if I was a member of the Chinese Admiralty, I would want Admiral Long to be hung......
It was a little dumb but I plead two factors for the defence. The Manchurians were pretty much out of ships and had no light units left. Their building program concentrated on battlecruisers, which they didn't want to risk as pickets.


They still could have used a BC as a picket to the Quarzhou-Beijing Jump Point in Beijing - especially considering how vital Beijing is to the Manchurians.....

Oh well, spilt milk and all that.....
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 06:00:00 PM by MWadwell »
Later,
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Offline Doug Olchefske

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Re: Personal Log: Senior Captain He Yab Fong (16)
« Reply #6 on: September 11, 2007, 10:30:43 PM »
Quote from: "Steve Walmsley"
Quote from: "Doug Olchefske"
For a picket I would have had a lot more spares; 10-15. My ships seem to break down all too frequently.  :shock:
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 06:00:00 PM by Doug Olchefske »
 

Offline sloanjh

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Re: Personal Log: Senior Captain He Yab Fong (16)
« Reply #7 on: September 11, 2007, 10:50:47 PM »
Quote from: "Doug Olchefske"

For a picket I would have had a lot more spares; 10-15. My ships seem to break down all too frequently.  :(


I crank my academy level up to 5 - this gives me a decent while before things start to break.

John
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 06:00:00 PM by sloanjh »
 

Offline Steve Walmsley (OP)

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Re: Personal Log: Senior Captain He Yab Fong (16)
« Reply #8 on: September 12, 2007, 07:30:56 AM »
Quote from: "Doug Olchefske"
I ascribe to the Dan K theory of probability.  :)

Steve
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 06:00:00 PM by Steve Walmsley »
 

Offline TrueZuluwiz

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« Reply #9 on: September 12, 2007, 08:45:34 AM »
The Demon Mur-fee seems to be striking the Manchurians with great regularity. I wonder why they haven't tried to develop a battleship hull, since their opponents are operating them and they are clearly superior to battlcruisers in everything except speed. Another question is why the Agar had such a strong fleet in the first place if they hadn't been doing any exploration and were confined to their home system.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 06:00:00 PM by TrueZuluwiz »
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Offline Steve Walmsley (OP)

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« Reply #10 on: September 12, 2007, 09:05:58 AM »
Quote from: "TrueZuluwiz"
The Demon Mur-fee seems to be striking the Manchurians with great regularity. I wonder why they haven't tried to develop a battleship hull, since their opponents are operating them and they are clearly superior to battlcruisers in everything except speed. Another question is why the Agar had such a strong fleet in the first place if they hadn't been doing any exploration and were confined to their home system.

There are no hull types as such in Aurora. You can build any hull size at any time and give them whatever name you like. The problem for the Manchurians is that although they could build a 18000 ton equivalent to the Agar Jihad class battleships, they have no jump drive capable of escorting such a ship through a jump point. Without the ability to transit jump points lacking a jump gate, any such battleships would be purely defensive. If the Manchurians wanted a jump drive with that capability, it would have the following stats (using their existing technology).

J17750 Jump Drive
Max Ship Size: 355 (17750 tons)     Max Squadron Size: 3     Max Dist: 50
Jump Engine Size: 71    Efficiency: 5    Jump Engine HTK: 14
Cost: 1260    Crew: 355
Materials Required: 252x Duranium  1008x Sorium
Development Cost for Project: 12600RP

This would be a considerable development cost and very expensive to include in a ship. As the Manchurian's technology increases, they will be able to design smaller and less expensive jump drives with the same capabilities and larger jump-capable warships become economically viable.

In comparison, the United States, which has superior jump technology (eff 8 vs eff 5) due to a fortunate discovery in some ruins could design and build the following jump drive

J18000 Jump Drive
Max Ship Size: 360 (18000 tons)     Max Squadron Size: 3     Max Dist: 50
Jump Engine Size: 45    Efficiency: 8    Jump Engine HTK: 9
Cost: 506    Crew: 225
Materials Required: 101.2x Duranium  404.8x Sorium
Development Cost for Project: 5060RP

I think the Agar's original fleet was three 17500 ton battleships and three 5000 ton destroyers. The battleships were so large because the Agar didn't have any jump tech at all and didn't realise the disadvantages of large ships when it comes to jump points. They have built a lot more ships since then due to the incursion of the Manchurians but the new ships are all 5000 tons or less due to their own jump technology which is still inferior to the Manchurians. The Jihad class battleships are stuck in the Agar home system.

Steve
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 06:00:00 PM by Steve Walmsley »
 

Offline Kurt

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Re: Personal Log: Senior Captain He Yab Fong (16)
« Reply #11 on: September 12, 2007, 09:46:20 AM »
Quote from: "Doug Olchefske"
Quote from: "Steve Walmsley"
Quote from: "Doug Olchefske"
For a picket I would have had a lot more spares; 10-15. My ships seem to break down all too frequently.  :shock:


That 'conversation' still gives me a headache.  Imagine having an entire debate, online, that lasts for, I don't know, ten days or so, only to have the other guy claim he didn't believe in statistics when you try, one last time, to explain your position.  

AHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Kurt
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 06:00:00 PM by Kurt »
 

Offline Erik L

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Re: Personal Log: Senior Captain He Yab Fong (16)
« Reply #12 on: December 20, 2007, 08:33:54 AM »
Quote from: "Kurt"
That 'conversation' still gives me a headache.  Imagine having an entire debate, online, that lasts for, I don't know, ten days or so, only to have the other guy claim he didn't believe in statistics when you try, one last time, to explain your position.  

AHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Kurt


47.2 % of all statistics are made up :D
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 06:00:00 PM by Erik Luken »