Author Topic: Shared ships classes per SY  (Read 137 times)

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Online vorpal+5

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Shared ships classes per SY
« on: November 10, 2017, 03:39:30 AM »
Do you have a predictable, low micromanagement way of predict a ship class will be compatible with another, SY wise? I usually end up navigating between the 2 ship classes, changing a few components over time until the 2nd is no more compatible, then backtrack (so to speak) to fine tune. It goes without saying, that's a pain.

And I never quite understood why if A allows B, B don't allows A. It should be reciprocal.

Bonus point for anyone providing a series of efficient designs for a freighter, colony ship and troop transport all on same SY :)

As much as I like the concept, hopefully it will be easier to do that in Aurora#
 

Offline Michael Sandy

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Re: Shared ships classes per SY
« Reply #1 on: November 10, 2017, 03:50:38 AM »
Other than going to the DAC page and checking the refit cost from the old class to the new, not really.

One of the reasons I put a hangar on every capital ship is so that I can 'refit' a lot of things by simply switching out some fighter pods.
 

Offline Michael Sandy

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Re: Shared ships classes per SY
« Reply #2 on: November 10, 2017, 03:53:19 AM »
All things being equal, you want the shipyard tooled to the more expensive components.  The more expensive the ship, the bigger a difference 20% of that cost is going to be.  On the other hand, making the tooling an excessively expensive version may make it more expensive and time consuming to retool.
 

Offline TheDeadlyShoe

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Re: Shared ships classes per SY
« Reply #3 on: November 10, 2017, 03:23:49 PM »
it's completely based on the refit cost, and it costs nothing to *remove* components.  So, if you have a cryo-ship and a freighter that use mostly the same components, the cryoship tooling will be able to build both because removing cryo-pods cost nothing and adding freight bays cost almost nothing.  But vice versa is not true, because adding cryo-pods costs alot.

so the easy way to do it is to make one design, copy it, remove expensive components and add cheap components. For military vessels, i generally find that trying to maintain flexible shipyards isnt usually worth it, although it can be a good idea to try to retain design similarities in order to keep retooling costs down.   The only military refit compatibilities i maintain are for updated versions of older vessels, so that a shipyard might refit older ships as well as make new ones of the same purpose.

One narrow category where it can be easy to make a multi-tool compatible version is military vessels equipped with commercial jump drives. These components are cheap but large; as long as you only remove components to make room you are virtually guaranteed to be tooling compatible. For example:

Code: [Select]
Adamant class Command Carrier    30 000 tons     590 Crew     3469.4 BP      TCS 600  TH 900  EM 0
1500 km/s     Armour 5-86     Shields 0-0     Sensors 50/80/0/0     Damage Control Rating 30     PPV 24
Maint Life 3.77 Years     MSP 2168    AFR 240%    IFR 3.3%    1YR 239    5YR 3579    Max Repair 192 MSP
Intended Deployment Time: 24 months    Flight Crew Berths 190   
Hangar Deck Capacity 9000 tons     

ASPD Naval Flux Turbine (3)    Power 300    Fuel Use 6.19%    Signature 300    Exp 5%
Fuel Capacity 1 200 000 Litres    Range 116.3 billion km   (897 days at full power)

2Gen Heavy Pulse Cannon (6)    Range 180 000km     TS: 3000 km/s     Power 6-3     RM 3    ROF 10        6 6 6 4 3 3 2 2 2 1
Point Defense Cannons (4x6)    Range 1000 km     TS: 12000 km/s     ROF 5       Base 50% To Hit
M03 Predictive Target Lock (2)    Max Range: 192 000 km   TS: 6000 km/s     95 90 84 79 74 69 64 58 53 48
Flux Reactor (5)     Total Power Output 22.5    Armour 0    Exp 5%

Capital DRAEDIS (1)     GPS 57600     Range 266.0m km    Resolution 300
Heritage Collision Sensor (2)     GPS 32     Range 2.6m km    MCR 279k km    Resolution 1
Telescope Array (1)     Sensitivity 50     Detect Sig Strength 1000:  50m km
PKT Surveillance Grid (1)     Sensitivity 80     Detect Sig Strength 1000:  80m km
STARCOM Suite (1)     Sensitivity 8     Detect Sig Strength 1000:  8m km

Strike Group
27x Z29 Striker   Speed: 9487 km/s    Size: 6.64

Code: [Select]
Ascendant class Command Carrier    30 000 tons     455 Crew     2530.4 BP      TCS 600  TH 900  EM 0
1500 km/s    JR 1-25(C)     Armour 3-86     Shields 0-0     Sensors 50/80/0/0     Damage Control Rating 28     PPV 12
Maint Life 4.65 Years     MSP 1476    AFR 257%    IFR 3.6%    1YR 111    5YR 1668    Max Repair 86 MSP
Intended Deployment Time: 36 months    Flight Crew Berths 165   
Hangar Deck Capacity 6000 tons     

Heritage Capital Hetch Drive     Max Ship Size 31500 tons    Distance 25k km     Squadron Size 1
Heritage Flux Turbine (3)    Power 300    Fuel Use 7.07%    Signature 300    Exp 5%
Fuel Capacity 1 500 000 Litres    Range 127.3 billion km   (982 days at full power)

2Gen Heavy Pulse Cannon (3)    Range 180 000km     TS: 3000 km/s     Power 6-3     RM 3    ROF 10        6 6 6 4 3 3 2 2 2 1
Point Defense System (1x6)    Range 1000 km     TS: 12000 km/s     ROF 5       Base 50% To Hit
M03 Predictive Target Lock (1)    Max Range: 192 000 km   TS: 6000 km/s     95 90 84 79 74 69 64 58 53 48
Flux Reactor (2)     Total Power Output 9    Armour 0    Exp 5%

Heritage Collision Sensor (2)     GPS 32     Range 2.6m km    MCR 279k km    Resolution 1
Telescope Array (1)     Sensitivity 50     Detect Sig Strength 1000:  50m km
PKT Surveillance Grid (1)     Sensitivity 80     Detect Sig Strength 1000:  80m km


It's also the case that commercial vessels are often compatible with military vessels of the same tonnage,simply because the military vessels cost so much more. 

Code: [Select]
Lojistik m.4 class Freighter    39 000 tons     124 Crew     427.4 BP      TCS 780  TH 900  EM 0
1153 km/s     Armour 1-102     Shields 0-0     Sensors 1/8/0/0     Damage Control Rating 1     PPV 0
MSP 7    Max Repair 27 MSP
Intended Deployment Time: 3 months    Spare Berths 0   
Cargo 25000    Cargo Handling Multiplier 15   

ASPD Efficient Flux Turbine (5)    Power 180    Fuel Use 1.73%    Signature 180    Exp 3%
Fuel Capacity 150 000 Litres    Range 40.0 billion km   (401 days at full power)

Navigational Transponder (1)     GPS 2400     Range 15.7m km    Resolution 150
STARCOM Suite (1)     Sensitivity 8     Detect Sig Strength 1000:  8m km

This design is classed as a Commercial Vessel for maintenance purposes
Code: [Select]
Bastion class Command Carrier    40 000 tons     735 Crew     4402.8 BP      TCS 800  TH 1200  EM 0
1500 km/s     Armour 6-104     Shields 0-0     Sensors 50/80/0/0     Damage Control Rating 41     PPV 28.8
Maint Life 5.05 Years     MSP 2820    AFR 312%    IFR 4.3%    1YR 184    5YR 2767    Max Repair 192 MSP
Intended Deployment Time: 24 months    Flight Crew Berths 201   
Flag Bridge    Hangar Deck Capacity 9000 tons     Troop Capacity: 1 Battalion    Cryogenic Berths 1000   

ASPD Naval Flux Turbine (4)    Power 300    Fuel Use 6.19%    Signature 300    Exp 5%
Fuel Capacity 1 600 000 Litres    Range 116.3 billion km   (897 days at full power)

Triple 2Gen Heavy Pulse Turret (2x3)    Range 180 000km     TS: 6500 km/s     Power 18-9     RM 3    ROF 10        6 6 6 4 3 3 2 2 2 1
Point Defense Cannons (8x6)    Range 1000 km     TS: 12000 km/s     ROF 5       Base 50% To Hit
M03 Predictive Target Lock (2)    Max Range: 192 000 km   TS: 6000 km/s     95 90 84 79 74 69 64 58 53 48
Flux Reactor (6)     Total Power Output 27    Armour 0    Exp 5%

Capital DRAEDIS (1)     GPS 57600     Range 266.0m km    Resolution 300
Heritage Collision Sensor (2)     GPS 32     Range 2.6m km    MCR 279k km    Resolution 1
Telescope Array (1)     Sensitivity 50     Detect Sig Strength 1000:  50m km
STARCOM Suite (1)     Sensitivity 8     Detect Sig Strength 1000:  8m km
PKT Surveillance Grid (1)     Sensitivity 80     Detect Sig Strength 1000:  80m km

Strike Group
27x Z29 Striker   Speed: 9487 km/s    Size: 6.64

This design is classed as a Military Vessel for maintenance purposes
The freighter can be manufactured by the carrier's shipyard, even though they have minimal part commonality;  the freighters cost is only 10% of the carrier's to begin with, so it falls within the permitted range.

 

Online Iranon

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Re: Shared ships classes per SY
« Reply #4 on: November 11, 2017, 07:31:44 AM »
Unfortuntely, things can become quite gamey if you play with the restrictions in mind.

I may actually want a sensor pod consisting of nothing but a huge sensor and 1 layer of armour, and this would allow me to build practically any ship of the same size or smaller (except, ironically, a sensor pod with a different sensor).

But tooling all shipyards for something consisting of the most expensive things you can make (usually hardened beam fire controls, sensors for civilian designs) and never retooling them ever again is just cheap.
 

 

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