Author Topic: New colony must haves and have nots  (Read 1672 times)

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Offline undercovergeek (OP)

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New colony must haves and have nots
« on: January 01, 2024, 05:37:46 AM »
My brightest and bravest have finally arrived on io, mercury and ceres with instructions to get drilling as soon as possible - earth is running out of minerals

Do my new colonists automatically don a miner lamp and start singing Hi Ho or do I have to build them mines, and to build them mines do I have to build construction factories

Is there a do and don’t list for starting off the new places with a look to getting minerals off them asap?
 

Offline Pedroig

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Re: New colony must haves and have nots
« Reply #1 on: January 01, 2024, 06:29:46 AM »
1.  Not every colony needs to be populated.  Mercury and Venus are both "better served" with Automated Mines and either Mass Driver or a Cargo Shuttle Hub depending on how many minerals one needs in a certain amount of time.

2.  Specialize colonies, and that does not mean from the start.  A place like Mars can start with Terraforming and as the colonization cost goes down, one can add more/other focus to it with the ideal is to create a worker shortage for the last year or two of terraforming and then take the terrafomers to the next colony, and the workers will shift to the other industries (to a point).
   
    a)  Typical things are a Financial Center on Luna, Construction/Shipbuilding hub at least one per Sector, "Fortress Worlds", and then there is the RP element of putting Ground Force Construction in colonies of the appropriate type for the perks, Extreme Temp/Grav, Mountains, Rift Valley, etc.

3. For populated colonies, Infrastructure first, Material Transfer second, Terraforming (if needed), and then whatever one wants on there, the population will "adjust" to the employment needs over time.
si vis pacem, para bellum
 
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Offline Panopticon

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Re: New colony must haves and have nots
« Reply #2 on: January 01, 2024, 02:00:52 PM »
My brightest and bravest have finally arrived on io, mercury and ceres with instructions to get drilling as soon as possible - earth is running out of minerals

Do my new colonists automatically don a miner lamp and start singing Hi Ho or do I have to build them mines, and to build them mines do I have to build construction factories

Is there a do and don’t list for starting off the new places with a look to getting minerals off them asap?

The civs will not create their own mines, or really anything you need. You will need to ship in mines/factories yourself, however once mines are on site they will work automatically assuming the population for them is there. However you should be aware that the higher CC worlds will likely require more workers than you might think and it is often preferable to use automines on those worlds since they require no population.
 
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Offline Garfunkel

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Re: New colony must haves and have nots
« Reply #3 on: January 01, 2024, 05:29:20 PM »
Don't let civilian shipping lines accidentally empty Earth of its population. If you let them, they will ship everyone off to your new colony/colonies.
 
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Offline undercovergeek (OP)

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Re: New colony must haves and have nots
« Reply #4 on: January 01, 2024, 05:46:34 PM »
That’s good to know - is there a way of stopping them?

I found they’d robbed me of my best administrators for their mining companies that I needed for the new colonies but took them back
 

Offline captainwolfer

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Re: New colony must haves and have nots
« Reply #5 on: January 01, 2024, 05:51:38 PM »
That’s good to know - is there a way of stopping them?

I found they’d robbed me of my best administrators for their mining companies that I needed for the new colonies but took them back
In the civilian tab you can set a colony to only send, recieve, or not do either for civ colony ships. If colony has less than 25 million it is locked to recieve only
 
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Offline Xkill

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Re: New colony must haves and have nots
« Reply #6 on: January 03, 2024, 02:05:04 PM »
Specializing colonies is vital. The greater the population, the more foci they can have. I aim for growing colonies up to around 60 million people, at which point they are "complete". This allows for one specialization since a colony of 60m will have 35% or 21m of those dedicated to the manufacturing sector. Enough for 84 terraforming installations or 21 labs or 1 spaceport and 400 units of basic factories (construction, mines, ordnance, fighters, fuel, financial). Spreading the workforce around leads to gross inefficiencies, even more so for small colonies.
 

Offline Froggiest1982

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Re: New colony must haves and have nots
« Reply #7 on: January 03, 2024, 02:35:46 PM »
Due to its nature, a standard Aurora TN game, favors a Tall game most of the times. Unless you are prepared to invest several (500+ hours) in one game and get lucky enough to find a habitable world with Homeworld spawn of minerals, you will have some small specialized worlds to support Earth (mostly). You need to see it pretty much as the core world and colonies setup of GalCiv Supernova.

Colonies are people farms, as the more you progress the more your bigger issue will become population.

I recently started to include maintenance facilities in all habitable colonies as it can be handy to have the ability to park a few ships around for security reasons. Mines as well, if there are minerals, regardless of accessibility, better to have a few. If pop is an issue, go automated unless you have RP reasons to do not do so.

Planets or moons with large sorium deposits should have refineries on them. You should have spares once Earth runs dry and relies on Gas Giants.

Offline Jorgen_CAB

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Re: New colony must haves and have nots
« Reply #8 on: January 03, 2024, 02:37:46 PM »
I agree you want to specialize colonies but not entirely in my opinion. I want colonies to be self sufficient in terms of production as it grows it's population. Therefore I almost always deploy construction factories first until they have enough to keep growing and constructing the factories and other facilities they need. It is far more efficient to just send the minerals rather than facilities to colonies around the empire. I want to dedicate my transport fleet to facilitate new colonies and auto mining operations. At least you want one colony in each system with good construction capability. If you have multiple colonies in the same system then transporting facilities between them probably is more efficient.
 
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Offline nuclearslurpee

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Re: New colony must haves and have nots
« Reply #9 on: January 03, 2024, 04:59:20 PM »
Due to its nature, a standard Aurora TN game, favors a Tall game most of the times.
[...]
Colonies are people farms, as the more you progress the more your bigger issue will become population.

Actually the population mechanics promote spreading out as much as possible, not only for people-farming purposes but also because smaller colonies make more efficient use of manufacturing population. The reason for this is that the fraction of population dedicated to the Services sector increases as the population increases, capping at 70% for a population of 240m. Therefore a smaller colony can dedicate a larger proportion of its population to manufacturing; for example, a colony of only 60m as Xkill suggests dedicates "only" 50% of its population to Services and so, depending on colony cost, can dedicate approximately twice the fraction of its population to manufacturing.

There are of course several caveats. On one hand, the ability to place smaller colonies is limited by the number of suitable bodies for colonization, even more so when you have a specific requirement such as particular mineral concentrations or exploiting Ancient Constructs for research boosts. Furthermore, as Jorgen has pointed out it is not as simple as saying "colony here", you must ship infrastructure and installations and provide ground + naval units for local defense as necessary.

On the other hand, larger colonies (more precisely, colonies with larger absolute manufacturing populations) maximize the benefit from quality governors. A CC=0.0 world with 240m pop may have a manufacturing sector of only 25% relatively, but that means 60m absolute manufacturing population that benefit from a skillful governor, while a CC=0.0 world with only 60m pop may have a manufacturing sector of 45% relatively but only 27m absolute manufacturing population thus deriving half as much benefit from the same governor. There is surely a mathematical optimum that depends on the skill of that governor but rarely is this mathematical result of great value due to the other considerations above.
 
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Offline smoelf

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Re: New colony must haves and have nots
« Reply #10 on: January 04, 2024, 05:10:33 AM »
So, for the specific situation of OP, I agree that automated mines and probably the way to go, but there is also a greater question of extrasolar colonies and what to do, when you have colonies far away. In a recent game, I tried to work towards self-sufficiency as much as possible and it actually not as difficult as I had thought. All you need to population, construction points, and minerals.

The first part is easy enough as others have already pointed out, so I'm not going to comment more on that, except to add that I had several 300 million population colonies in other systems that were well on their way to supplying their own system with mines and ground forces.

For construction points, I used to think that I needed to establish a population first, send construction factories, and then start building, but this is really a terribly slow option, especially if you cannot supply the population fast enough to service all the construction factories. Inspired by an off-hand comment in one of Steve's AAR's, I have instead started mass producing engineering brigades. This is an incredibly efficient way of servicing a frontier colony with building capability. They don't require any population and in terms of build points, they are only slighly less efficient than construction factories for the same amount of construction capacity. They use vendarite instead of duranium and neutronium, which can be an advantage if you have a crunch and I never seem to use all my vendarite. They also allow you to construct them in parallel to construction factories since they use different facilities and won't take up construction capacity to build your mines, for example. For most colonies I would probably ship around 200.000 tons of vehicles with construction modules as a start. I don't have the numbers on me right now, but this was often enough to get started. Then as I build construction factories, the engineering brigades could be redistributed to newer colonies.

But they also need minerals. If you have a specialized colony, it is easy to send the right minerals, but I always get annoyed at setting up the logistics orders to get the exact minerals needed and the amount I can hold in the mineral transports, so I tried a more universal approach. Using mineral transports with cargo capacity of 5.000 tons, I can hold 220 of each mineral type. I would set up a template to load 220 of mineral type on earth. This saves a lot of micro management, because then I would set a reserve for each mineral at the new colony (usually 1.000), unload/load to reserve level, go back to Earth to unload and refuel and set the order to cycle. This ensures a steady supply of all minerals and with the unload/load to reserve level order you also ensures that you don't just drain Earth of resources. Once the reserves have been filled, the mineral transport will only unload those minerals that have been used since last arrival.

Because construction is slow in the beginning it is easy enough to get the full reserve before getting construction up to task, but later you might want to set up a second mineral transport or just manually set up one-time deliveries of a single mineral trains fast. I had this issue multiple with boronide for fuel refineries, where I never updated the reserve level, but when I had enough construction capacity to build them, the boronide drained much faster than my mineral transports could keep up with.

Once you have colonies multiple systems, it gets a bit more tricky. The further distance away from Sol, the longer it takes the minerals to get there, which is problem when you build a lot. I haven't quite solved this. One option is simply to set up more mineral transports proportional to the distance, so the delivery relative to travelling time is the same. Another is to set up chains of deliveries, but that reduces the advantage of the template to reduce micro management, and it is a bit more tricky to make sure that the intermediary colonies get the mineral they need and that they are not just transported away immediately. If you have colonies A, B, and C and set up transport A-B and B-C to reduce travelling time, then the 220 duranium from A gets to B, but is then immediately picked up by another transport and transported to C. So you would need to set up 2 transport A-B and then one transport B-C, but I'm not sure how much more efficient this is.

None of this of course takes into account the actual minerals mined in each system, which is, after all, the main purpose.
 
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Offline bankshot

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Re: New colony must haves and have nots
« Reply #11 on: January 05, 2024, 11:29:05 AM »
Absent a dire need for a particular mineral I normally populate bodies in Sol in order from easiest to hardest to terraform:
Luna
Mars
Europa/Io/Callisto/Ganymede
Mercury (may not be fully terraformable depending on eccentricity)
Titan (raise hydrosphere to >65% before going above -30C and triggering the melt)

I don't normally send colonists anywhere else in Sol - I use automines for all other mining as I haven't gotten the hang of using orbital habitats yet.  Mass drivers help make it low maintenance.

Initially everything is on Earth.  Mines are shipped to any planets that can use.  Otherwise send construction factories and minerals and build most stuff on-site.  Civilian transport is used to move infrastructure from CC 0 worlds to new ones as needed.  As the game progresses colonies become more specialized, with my current game having the following specialties:

Earth: Construction for export, and Shipbuilding
Luna: Ordinance and Fighter building, minor construction, minor mines
Mars: Kinetics Research and mining (Ancient Construct)
Europa: finance center
Callisto/Ganymede: research centers
Io: Finance and research construction for the other three moons.  One freighter permanently assigned to Jupiter to handle logistics.
Mercury: Troop training and export of construction factories
Titan: still terraforming, will eventually be a finance center.
 
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Offline undercovergeek (OP)

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Re: New colony must haves and have nots
« Reply #12 on: March 05, 2024, 08:53:41 AM »
I have instead started mass producing engineering brigades. This is an incredibly efficient way of servicing a frontier colony with building capability. They don't require any population and in terms of build points, they are only slighly less efficient than construction factories for the same amount of construction capacity. They use vendarite instead of duranium and neutronium, which can be an advantage if you have a crunch and I never seem to use all my vendarite. They also allow you to construct them in parallel to construction factories since they use different facilities and won't take up construction capacity to build your mines, for example. For most colonies I would probably ship around 200.000 tons of vehicles with construction modules as a start. I don't have the numbers on me right now, but this was often enough to get started. Then as I build construction factories, the engineering brigades could be redistributed to newer colonies.

about to embark on this process and experiment - presumably when theyre built there is an order in their menu for constructing - or when i task a colony to build something it automatically uses these guys?

did you build a troop transport for 200k tons or send them over in bits?