Author Topic: any delay reloading from planetry stockpiles?  (Read 1838 times)

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Offline metalax (OP)

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any delay reloading from planetry stockpiles?
« on: November 14, 2011, 01:51:45 PM »
Is there any delay for reloading from planetry stockpiles for PDC's or for orbital bases?

I've done several searches and the only relevant post that I've found is http://aurora2.pentarch.org/index.php/topic,2166.msg20723.html#msg20723 in the exodus campaign. Which suggests that there was no delay at that point but has one ever been added?
 

Offline TheDeadlyShoe

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Re: any delay reloading from planetry stockpiles?
« Reply #1 on: November 14, 2011, 02:03:11 PM »
There is no delay for any ordnance reload. So magazines are not necessary on PDCs. However its pissant annoying micromanagement and sorta exploity, so I always put magazines on my AMM PDCs. And my ASM PDCs have 4000s reload times anyway so it doesnt matter.

You can also instantly reload from colliers in space, but again it is sorta exploity and your colliers are asking to be asploded.

*EDIT *

Actually i recall reading that PDCs cannot reload from stockpiles if they are under ground/boarding attack.  That's the only exception i know of.
 

Offline metalax (OP)

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Re: any delay reloading from planetry stockpiles?
« Reply #2 on: November 14, 2011, 02:48:53 PM »
Thanks, that matches what I though I remembered.

Just starting up a new game and was worried that the PDC's that are going to be the primary defence of earth in this game wouldn't be able to reload quickly. As I am deliberately keeping them from going over 2500 tons, there is no room for more magazines without stripping some of the armour.

Code: [Select]
Hedgehog class Planetary Defence Centre    2,500 tons     271 Crew     393.4 BP      TCS 50  TH 0  EM 0
Armour 10-16     Sensors 1/60     Damage Control Rating 0     PPV 20
Magazine 95   

PDC Missile Launcher S1 RoF 5 (20)    Missile Size 1    Rate of Fire 5
MFC S01 R001 MR 2,160 Ms6  235 (5)     Range 2.2m km    Resolution 1
Interceptor S1 AMM (95)  Speed: 32,200 km/s   End: 1.2m    Range: 2.3m km   WH: 1    Size: 1    TH: 182 / 109 / 54

ASS S05 R001 MR 3,600 Ms6 392 (1)     GPS 60     Range 3.6m km    Resolution 1

Missile to hit chances are vs targets moving at 3000 km/s, 5000 km/s and 10,000 km/s

This design is classed as a Planetary Defence Centre and can be pre-fabricated in 1 sections

Actually i recall reading that PDCs cannot reload from stockpiles if they are under ground/boarding attack.  That's the only exception i know of.

If they are under ground attack, I think I'll have run out of missiles before then  ;D

A couple of extra questions,

Is there anyway to repair PDC's? They can't have engineering spaces, so I'd assume they can't self repair like ships from maintainance supplies. Also any way to repair their armour once damaged?

Do refits of PDC's work, or do you still have to do the trick of unlocking and altering the class design?
 

Offline TheDeadlyShoe

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Re: any delay reloading from planetry stockpiles?
« Reply #3 on: November 14, 2011, 02:54:15 PM »
I don't think you can repair PDCs.   PDC designs seem to be completely unlocked even without SM mode for some reason. But I could never get refitting to work ??? Very weird.

You could probably strip some armor off that PDC and fit in some more stuff. My view is that if you take enough hits to blow through PDC armor your planet is kinda getting screwed anyway.  More AMMs!
 

Offline metalax (OP)

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Re: any delay reloading from planetry stockpiles?
« Reply #4 on: November 14, 2011, 03:20:45 PM »
True, by stripping off the armour I get space for another 2 missile batteries.

Code: [Select]
Hedgehog class Planetary Defence Centre    2,500 tons     363 Crew     393.8 BP      TCS 50  TH 0  EM 0
Armour 5-16     Sensors 1/60     Damage Control Rating 0     PPV 28
Magazine 103   

PDC Missile Launcher S1 RoF 5 (28)    Missile Size 1    Rate of Fire 5
MFC S01 R001 MR 2,160 Ms6  235 (7)     Range 2.2m km    Resolution 1
Interceptor S1 AMM (103)  Speed: 32,200 km/s   End: 1.2m    Range: 2.3m km   WH: 1    Size: 1    TH: 182 / 109 / 54

ASS S05 R001 MR 3,600 Ms6 392 (1)     GPS 60     Range 3.6m km    Resolution 1

Missile to hit chances are vs targets moving at 3000 km/s, 5000 km/s and 10,000 km/s

This design is classed as a Planetary Defence Centre and can be pre-fabricated in 1 sections

I could strip out the magazines entirely and rely on the reloading from planetry stockpile, which would give another missile battery, but it would probably be a bad habit to get into.
 

Offline blue emu

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Re: any delay reloading from planetry stockpiles?
« Reply #5 on: November 14, 2011, 03:23:04 PM »
Quote
Hedgehog class Planetary Defence Centre    2,500 tons     271 Crew     393.4 BP      TCS 50  TH 0  EM 0
Armour 10-16     Sensors 1/60     Damage Control Rating 0     PPV 20
Magazine 95    

PDC Missile Launcher S1 RoF 5 (20)    Missile Size 1    Rate of Fire 5
MFC S01 R001 MR 2,160 Ms6  235 (5)     Range 2.2m km    Resolution 1
Interceptor S1 AMM (95)  Speed: 32,200 km/s   End: 1.2m    Range: 2.3m km   WH: 1    Size: 1    TH: 182 / 109 / 54

ASS S05 R001 MR 3,600 Ms6 392 (1)     GPS 60     Range 3.6m km    Resolution 1

Missile to hit chances are vs targets moving at 3000 km/s, 5000 km/s and 10,000 km/s

This design is classed as a Planetary Defence Centre and can be pre-fabricated in 1 sections


Your res-1 PD search radar seems to have a very short range. The printed range (3.6 m-km) refers to a 1 HS, 50-ton target. Missiles are much smaller than that, and a size-1 to size-6 missile will typically approach about nine times closer before being detected. Then (on the next impulse) you need to fire the missile, and missiles don't actually MOVE on the same turn that they are fired. It isn't until the third impulse that it would move out towards intercept.

What it boils down to is that unless the incoming enemy missiles are moving slower than 30,000 kps or so, you will never actually get a shot at them with this search sensor. You only have a 50% chance of detecting a 32,000 kps missile in time to shoot at it, for instance.

I would at least double the sensor's size.

EDIT: we crossed posts... remove a layer of armor and double the sensor size instead.
« Last Edit: November 14, 2011, 03:28:13 PM by blue emu »
 

Offline metalax (OP)

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Re: any delay reloading from planetry stockpiles?
« Reply #6 on: November 14, 2011, 03:34:52 PM »
I know, thats what the figure after the Ms6 in the names of the fire controls and search sensors is, in this case the actives picking up missile size 6 at 392,000km. I put it in the name as it is only displayed normally in the component design window.

The short range is due to both this being a design right at the start before I've had time to research sensor tech (starting with em6 and active 12 as initial tech) and that these are the backup sensors. The primary sensor is located in it's own PDC.
 

Offline blue emu

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Re: any delay reloading from planetry stockpiles?
« Reply #7 on: November 14, 2011, 03:40:27 PM »
Even a back-up sensor ought to be strong enough to guarantee you at least one shot at an incoming missile. That sensor is marginally too weak. A 35% increase in range would be enough to guarantee one shot at a 35,000 kps missile.

Do you want to see the supporting math?
 

Offline metalax (OP)

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Re: any delay reloading from planetry stockpiles?
« Reply #8 on: November 14, 2011, 03:52:17 PM »
No, I agree that on it's own it wouldn't get off a shot at a missile at that speed. On it's own, it is primarily a placeholder for later refiting as sensor range improves quickly with the first couple of years research.
 

Offline TheDeadlyShoe

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Re: any delay reloading from planetry stockpiles?
« Reply #9 on: November 14, 2011, 03:55:18 PM »
You could leave it off then, save some money. 

Tho im still not sure if refitting works lawl. 
 

Offline blue emu

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Re: any delay reloading from planetry stockpiles?
« Reply #10 on: November 14, 2011, 03:58:41 PM »
When it comes to refitting PDCs with interchangeable components... replacing a 3 HS PD sensor with an improved 3 HS PD sensor, for instance... you can always make that change directly to the design in SM mode, if the game functionality for that is broken.
 

Offline metalax (OP)

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Re: any delay reloading from planetry stockpiles?
« Reply #11 on: November 14, 2011, 04:16:22 PM »
Indeed that is what I do. In order to do it 'properly' I'll assign the industry to refit the pdc's to a copy with the new design, then when that completes make the changes to the actual design and go through the ship details page for each pdc to update them.

You could leave it off then, save some money. 

That would result in a size change, which increases the refit cost for when you actually put the sensors on.
« Last Edit: November 14, 2011, 04:19:37 PM by metalax »
 

Offline TheDeadlyShoe

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Re: any delay reloading from planetry stockpiles?
« Reply #12 on: November 14, 2011, 05:20:05 PM »
@ blue - Like I was saying, you don't need to be in SM mode for PDCs...  probably a bug.   ;)

@ Metalax -  Ahh that makes sense.   Tho the question there is, is the size refit penalty more expensive than the money you save not building the component in the first place?  Electronics are pretty expensive for their size.
 

Offline Hawkeye

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Re: any delay reloading from planetry stockpiles?
« Reply #13 on: November 15, 2011, 12:56:58 AM »
Refitting PDCs is broken (for quite a while now, I might add)
The workaround is as follows:

Order a refit of the PDCs
Your industry will use the time/minerals needed for this, but the PDC will simly stay the same

After all PDCs of that type are "refitted", "unlock" the old design (design screen) and change it to the new design in SM mode

Open the "Individual Unit Screen" (F6)
Select each PDC once, so the design actually changes

Done

Ralph Hoenig, Germany