Author Topic: First Military Design - need some advices  (Read 2336 times)

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Offline Tiax (OP)

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First Military Design - need some advices
« on: February 04, 2011, 05:31:45 AM »
Hi everyone!

I've finally finished my first military design, and I wanted to know if there was any fundamental flaws (I'm especially not sure about the sensor and the fire control). 
Quote
Arbiter class Battlestar    15350 tons     1310 Crew     2808 BP      TCS 307  TH 112  EM 0
1042 km/s     Armour 10-55     Shields 0-0     Sensors 1/1/0/0     Damage Control 130     PPV 60
Annual Failure Rate: 4%    IFR: 0.  1%    Maintenance Capacity 17717 MSP
Flag Bridge    

Magneto-plasma Drive 35% E10 ARM-1 (4)    Power 80    Fuel Use 100%    Armour 1    Exp 5%
Fuel Capacity 800,000 Litres    Range 93.  8 billion km   (1041 days at full power)

Gauss Cannon R1-100 (10)    Range 10,000km     TS: 1250 km/s     Power 0-0     RM 1    ROF 5        1 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0
Fire Control S04 60-32000 (1)    Max Range: 120,000 km   TS: 32000 km/s     92 83 75 67 58 50 42 33 25 17

Active Search Sensor MR36-R150 (1)     GPS 9000     Range 36.  7m km     Resolution 150

This design is classed as a military vessel for maintenance purposes

Thanks for your help!

EDIT: Ok, from what I just read it was *dumb dumb dumb* to use Gauss cannons on this ship.  I'm gonna switch to railguns or torpedoes.
« Last Edit: February 04, 2011, 05:36:45 AM by Tiax »
 

Offline DatAlien

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Re: First Military Design - need some advices
« Reply #1 on: February 04, 2011, 06:47:44 AM »
It could be trickie to get in firing range with that low speed, four engines is a bit low for a ship of this size.

One question, is this ship intend to operate in a mixed group or as your only warship class?
Per se ad astra
 

Offline Hawkeye

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Re: First Military Design - need some advices
« Reply #2 on: February 04, 2011, 07:05:53 AM »
Way, and I mean waaaaaaay too much maintenance. Don´t look at the Annual Failure Rate, but at the "Est. Time" entry in the design screen. Around 3 years, perhaps a bit more should be enough.

A Flag Bridge, as the name implies, is where your Admiral is sited. I wouldn´t put that on a regular Line-Of-Battle unit but only on a dedicated flagship or perhaps on a combat-jumpship.

Your ship is terribly slow. Personally, I go for 25% of mass (i.e. 1 engine per 1000t) for engines on missile ships and a bit more, up to 35%, on beam armes units.

Your armor is very strong. Perhaps too strong, if you have not researched at least 4 levels of armor (ceramic comosite, I belive).

As you noted yourself, the gauss cannons are pretty much useless
If you look at the firecon for them, you´ll notice a tracking speed of 32.000 whereas the cannons only track at 1.250. The thing is, only the lower of the two counts. Therefore they should match as much as possible or you´re either wasting resources (if the FCon is overengineered) or weapons potential (if the FCon can´t track as fast as your guns)

Your active sensor can see ships of 7.500t and up good, but has trouble seeing smaller ships and is virtually blind vs. missiles. A small res-1 sensor might help you out here.

You don´t have any passive sensors. This means, if you don´t want to notice an enemy only once you start taking damage, you´ll have to run with your sensors ON all the time. Trouble is, the sensors emissions are visible over a longer range than you can see with them (thinks submarines active sonar here).


A question aside from this:
Your FCon has a tracking speed of 32.000km/s, indicating you have researched Beam Tracking Speed 8.000km/s. To my knowledge, this should then also be the tracking speed of your gauss cannons. I am a bit confused here.
Ralph Hoenig, Germany
 

Offline Tiax (OP)

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Re: First Military Design - need some advices
« Reply #3 on: February 04, 2011, 07:37:15 AM »
Well, I just realised after re-reading the warship tutorial that this whole ship is a total failure.

Thanks a lot for your help though, there's some precious info in your post!

I'll start something new from scratch.
 

Offline Steve Walmsley

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Re: First Military Design - need some advices
« Reply #4 on: February 06, 2011, 04:57:43 PM »
Well, I just realised after re-reading the warship tutorial that this whole ship is a total failure.

Thanks a lot for your help though, there's some precious info in your post!

I'll start something new from scratch.
Don't worry about your first design effort having some flaws. This game has very complex ship design and it will take a while before you get designs you are happy with. Besides, there is no 'correct' design as such. You will find that as you progress through a campaign you will create designs based on your needs and experience in that campaign and your designs may vary considerably in different campaigns depending on the situation.

Steve
 

Offline Tiax (OP)

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Re: First Military Design - need some advices
« Reply #5 on: February 12, 2011, 12:00:10 PM »
Hehe, thanks for your nice words of wisdom.  ;)

Here's another attempt, once again I'm trying to have a decent, general purpose warship:

Quote
Vigilante class Battlestar    22,850 tons     2721 Crew     6358 BP      TCS 457  TH 256  EM 90
3501 km/s     Armour 10-71     Shields 3-600     Sensors 22/22/0/0     Damage Control Rating 160     PPV 96
Annual Failure Rate: 69%    IFR: 1%    Maint Capacity 10433 MSP    Max Repair 320 MSP    Est Time: 9. 18 Years

Magneto-plasma M Drive E10 ARM-1 16% (20)    Power 80    Fuel Use 100%    Signature 12. 8    Armour 1    Exp 5%
Fuel Capacity 1,300,000 Litres    Range 102. 4 billion km   (338 days at full power)
Epsilon R600/30 Shields (1)   Total Fuel Cost  30 Litres per day

20cm C4 Far Ultraviolet Laser (12)    Range 320,000km     TS: 3501 km/s     Power 10-4     RM 5    ROF 15        10 10 10 10 10 8 7 6 5 5
10cm C4 Far Ultraviolet Laser (8)    Range 150,000km     TS: 3501 km/s     Power 3-4     RM 5    ROF 5        3 3 3 3 3 2 2 1 1 1
Fire Control S08 160-4000 (1)    Max Range: 320,000 km   TS: 4000 km/s     97 94 91 88 84 81 78 75 72 69
Stellarator Fusion Reactor Technology PB-1 AR-1 Size 3 (1)     Total Power Output 18    Armour 1    Exp 5%

Active Search Sensor S20 MR35-R1 (1)     GPS 320     Range 35. 2m km    Resolution 1
Active Search Sensor S20 MR352-R100 (1)     GPS 32000     Range 352. 0m km    Resolution 100
Active Search Sensor S20 MR497-R200 (1)     GPS 64000     Range 497. 8m km    Resolution 200
Thermal Sensor TH2-22 (1)     Sensitivity 22     Detect Sig Strength 1000:  22m km
EM Detection Sensor EM2-22 (1)     Sensitivity 22     Detect Sig Strength 1000:  22m km

ECM 40

This design is classed as a Military Vessel for maintenance purposes

I think the sensor array is sorted out this time, but I guess I still forgot about some other flaws.  Now to know which one. . .

 

Offline Erik L

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Re: First Military Design - need some advices
« Reply #6 on: February 12, 2011, 12:21:37 PM »
One fire control and two weapon systems with different engagement ranges.
You've also only got 1 shield system which will stop 3 points of damage and then require 10 minutes to recharge (not gonna happen in battle).
I think your total maintenance capacity is... lots. You can probably cut that down to 20% of current and be okay still.
You don't have sufficient power to power all the weapons you've got mounted. Your 20cm are pulling 36 power every 5 seconds, the 10cm are pulling 32 power. That's a deficit of 50 power.
Fuel could be considered a bit much if you are operating in a fleet with support. If this is meant to be a solo ship, then it's okay.

Offline Tiax (OP)

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Re: First Military Design - need some advices
« Reply #7 on: February 12, 2011, 12:35:32 PM »
Alright, I'm gonna add a few shields system, cut down the maintenance capacity, limit the number of fuel tanks and add 3 more fusion reactors.

As for the fire control system, you mean that I should also have a 150'000 km range FCS? I thought that the one I currently have would be sufficient for both the 10cm and the 20cm Lasers.

Hehe, at least I waited  for some opinions before sending the blueprint to production this time.
 

Offline Hawkeye

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Re: First Military Design - need some advices
« Reply #8 on: February 12, 2011, 01:20:00 PM »
Alright, I'm gonna add a few shields system, cut down the maintenance capacity, limit the number of fuel tanks and add 3 more fusion reactors.

As for the fire control system, you mean that I should also have a 150'000 km range FCS? I thought that the one I currently have would be sufficient for both the 10cm and the 20cm Lasers.

Hehe, at least I waited  for some opinions before sending the blueprint to production this time.

While your 320k FCS can be used for the 10cm lasers, each FCS can only "shoot" at a single target. Now, if you are fighting a similar Battlestar as your own, this is not much of a problem, you´ll concentrate fire on that target anyway. But what if you are attacked by a swarm of small ships, say fighters of FACs? Sure, each on targeted will be DEAD! But you can only swat a single fly at a time, and while you do that, the rest of the swarm will tear you appart.

Ralph Hoenig, Germany
 

Offline Erik L

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Re: First Military Design - need some advices
« Reply #9 on: February 12, 2011, 01:21:34 PM »
You've got 22 weapons and one firecontrol. With the differing ranges, almost half your weapons won't be firing at targets between 150k and 320k.

I prefer to have firecontrols matched to weapon ranges. If I mount a 150k range weapon, I've got a 150k range FC. Allows me to target multiple targets if necessary, or in a pinch, dedicate to (not overly good) point defense.

And what Hawkeye said ;)

Offline Tiax (OP)

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Re: First Military Design - need some advices
« Reply #10 on: February 12, 2011, 01:40:15 PM »
Damn, I missed this.

So basically, it would make sense to have something like 2 or 3 320'000 FCS for targeting of big ships at range and 8 150'000km FCS so each of my 10cm lasers can target a smaller & nearer object, as there  usually should be more of those?

 

Offline Erik L

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Re: First Military Design - need some advices
« Reply #11 on: February 12, 2011, 02:09:13 PM »
Damn, I missed this.

So basically, it would make sense to have something like 2 or 3 320'000 FCS for targeting of big ships at range and 8 150'000km FCS so each of my 10cm lasers can target a smaller & nearer object, as there  usually should be more of those?


That might be a bit on the overboard side. I'd go with 2-3 320k FC and 2, maybe 3 FC for the 150k.

Offline Tiax (OP)

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Re: First Military Design - need some advices
« Reply #12 on: February 12, 2011, 02:34:43 PM »
Thanks a lot for all the good info, I'm finally able to start the production of a decent ship thanks to you all. 

Kudos  ;)