Change to Transit Detected Interrupts

[Steve Walmsley (OP)]

I have recently started a multiple Earth start game with five player races. One thing I have noticed is the number of unnecessary interrupts due to transit detected events from ships of neutral or friendly races. Therefore, for the next version I have made some changes.

1) All detected transits of hostile vessels will still cause an interrupt

2) Detected transits for neutral, friendly or allied vessels will only generate an interrupt event under two circumstances:

a) This is a previously undetected jump point

b) This is a previously undetected ship

The above applies to active and transponder contacts. Passive-only contacts will still generate interrupts for transits

It's a fairly minor change but I am on a 'reduce unnecessary interrupts' crusade at the moment

Steve

[sloanjh]

The above applies to active and transponder contacts. Passive-only contacts will still generate interrupts for transits

It's a fairly minor change but I am on a 'reduce unnecessary interrupts' crusade at the moment

Comment 1: Yeah!!!

Comment 2:  I'd like to renew my request that passive contacts also have identifying signatures, i.e. you can tell race/class from a passive contact, similar to narrow-band sonar identification.  This would put passives on the same footing as actives for ship identification, but would still require actives in order to generate firing solutions.  

One of the things I like to do is have an EMCON picket ship powered down at every WP to see if any bad guys transit within my empire.  With the interrupt criteria you described above, I'll have to leave any of them that are on a WP that neutral/friendly shipping goes through on active so that said shipping doesn't generate interrupts.  This feels like the game's interrupt algorithms are guiding my tactics, which doesn't feel right.  It also doesn't feel right that I have to announce my presence (by going active) to any alien ship that I wish to ID.

John

[a1s]

It also doesn't feel right that I have to announce my presence (by going active) to any alien ship that I wish to ID.

how do you see this working from an in game (or as some say, Role Playing) perspective? If your ships are meant to be close enough for visual identification, they would probably be detected as well, while a thermal/EM signature, even if it could Identify the ships class at close ranges, would most certainly not be enough to distinguish individual ships...

[sloanjh]

It also doesn't feel right that I have to announce my presence (by going active) to any alien ship that I wish to ID.

how do you see this working from an in game (or as some say, Role Playing) perspective? If your ships are meant to be close enough for visual identification, they would probably be detected as well, while a thermal/EM signature, even if it could Identify the ships class at close ranges, would most certainly not be enough to distinguish individual ships...

Read my post in the suggestions thread (in response to Steve's).  When I wrote the above, I contemplated introducing the idea of two types of passives: broad-band and narrow-band, with narrow-bad able to give an ID.  The reason I didn't go there is that, given the hull sizes, trying to cram yet another sensor (actually two of them) on board would pop my pickets over the 1Kton limit (although Steve might like this idea) - I thought it easier to consider these combined in the same system.

As for identifying thermal signatures from a long way away - that's what astronomers do with stars all the time :-)

John

[welchbloke]

It also doesn't feel right that I have to announce my presence (by going active) to any alien ship that I wish to ID.

how do you see this working from an in game (or as some say, Role Playing) perspective? If your ships are meant to be close enough for visual identification, they would probably be detected as well, while a thermal/EM signature, even if it could Identify the ships class at close ranges, would most certainly not be enough to distinguish individual ships...

Read my post in the suggestions thread (in response to Steve's).  When I wrote the above, I contemplated introducing the idea of two types of passives: broad-band and narrow-band, with narrow-bad able to give an ID.  The reason I didn't go there is that, given the hull sizes, trying to cram yet another sensor (actually two of them) on board would pop my pickets over the 1Kton limit (although Steve might like this idea) - I thought it easier to consider these combined in the same system.

As for identifying thermal signatures from a long way away - that's what astronomers do with stars all the time :-)

John

This can already be done with both IR and ELINT sensors in the real world.  Look up Specific Emitter Identification for the EM technique.  Look up what SBIRS and DSP can do in regards to IR identification.

[Hawkeye]

This can already be done with both IR and ELINT sensors in the real world.  Look up Specific Emitter Identification for the EM technique.  Look up what SBIRS and DSP can do in regards to IR identification.

I´m with you on this (not that I have any knowledge of the stuff you are talking about    )

@ a1s:
You might have seen "Hunt for Red October". If you have, you may remember how the sonar officer on the US sub tried to identify the Red October due to the unique sound, her screws/hull made. I´d imagine something similar for the drive-plume of a space engine. Small irregularities in the exhaust nozzles and stuff would modify that plume and create something like a fingerprint.
At least that is as I would imagine it.

[Another]

@ a1s:
You might have seen "Hunt for Red October". If you have, you may remember how the sonar officer on the US sub tried to identify the Red October due to the unique sound, her screws/hull made. I´d imagine something similar for the drive-plume of a space engine. Small irregularities in the exhaust nozzles and stuff would modify that plume and create something like a fingerprint.
At least that is as I would imagine it.

I think that a better analogue in this case would be trying to identify cars by their sound. While subs are not exactly identical (each one has a proper personal name for a reason) and modern spacecraft sure have unique nearly hand-made nozzles I suppose that sci-fi spacecraft is standartized and is produced at an assemby line like any modern popular car model.

With this car analogy I believe it is reasonable to only be able to extract information about current speed, total tonnage and basic engine technology with any kind of passive sensor.

[Father Tim]

I don't care so much for identifying unique ships, as tracking ship classes.  If a vessel with the Thermal signature of known freighter class and with an EM signature of 'no shields, no active sensors' comes wandering past, I'm perfectly happy with my picket ship classifying it as a 'Mule class freighter' and just letting it go.  If it turns out to have been a hostile alien pretending to be a freighter, well, good for them.  They earned that free passage and I have no problem giving it to them.

[sloanjh]

I don't care so much for identifying unique ships, as tracking ship classes.  If a vessel with the Thermal signature of known freighter class and with an EM signature of 'no shields, no active sensors' comes wandering past, I'm perfectly happy with my picket ship classifying it as a 'Mule class freighter' and just letting it go.  If it turns out to have been a hostile alien pretending to be a freighter, well, good for them.  They earned that free passage and I have no problem giving it to them.

You've clearly stated what I'm asking for with respect to passives....

John

[Steve Walmsley (OP)]

Identifying via passives will be in the next version. This is going to be a little messy as I will have to change some of the core detection and display routines so I hope I won't screw up anything too badly . It might take a patch or two to ensure I haven't missed anything but the bulk of the change will be in v5.0, which will be the next version as this and the active sensor change need some DB changes.

Steve