Author Topic: How Will C# Effect Carriers?  (Read 11804 times)

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Iranon

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Re: How Will C# Effect Carriers?
« Reply #45 on: August 10, 2019, 11:31:29 AM »
I really like having more unknowns to work with, the intent behind the changes and the intelligence gathering aspect of it sound great.
Thanks for responding to my concerns, Steve - and I really hope I'm wrong. But the tables you linked are what caused my concern in the first place. From a thread I made about this:

Quote
Current sensor system:
Assuming equal tech, a 250t scout fighter and a 1000t scout FAC devoting the same percentage to a resolution-10 sensor (the geometric mean of their respective sizes) will  detect one another at the same range.
The FAC will have 4x the sensor range against the designed 500t target.
If the size of opposing scout craft is known and the ideal sensor resolution is chosen instead, the FAC will detect the fighter from twice the range (at 4x the expense).

C# sensor system:
If both craft devote the same percentage to a resolution10-sensor, the 250t fighter will pick up the 1000t FAC at twice the range it's detected itself.
The FAC will have twice the sensor range against the designed 500t target.
If the size of opposing scout craft is known and the ideal resolution is chosen instead, the FAC will detect the fighter at 25% longer range (at 4x the expense).

In the new system, being smaller than expected seems a much bigger problem for the enemy than being larger and more capable than expected, where it's currently more symmetrical. Gaining a range advantage with larger ships hinges on getting things exactly right, and may be near-impossible with a small tech disadvantage.  Add cost considerations (which may translate into number of variants with different sensor configurations) and I see a race to the smallest practical craft. Stealth tech etc. will be an additional trump card eventually, but the game remains the same.

I'll have fun poking at things, looking for ways to defend against small craft without resorting to smaller craft will be an interesting challenge.
But things brought up as problematic in VB6 Aurora, like max-size fine-grained sensors, look less dominant and tend to be comparatively expensive in some way or other.
 

Offline Steve Walmsley

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Re: How Will C# Effect Carriers?
« Reply #46 on: August 10, 2019, 12:30:18 PM »
I will be keeping an eye on balance and if it does turn out to be a problem, I will change it.
 
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Offline Jorgen_CAB

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Re: How Will C# Effect Carriers?
« Reply #47 on: August 10, 2019, 04:44:05 PM »
In the new system, being smaller than expected seems a much bigger problem for the enemy than being larger and more capable than expected, where it's currently more symmetrical. Gaining a range advantage with larger ships hinges on getting things exactly right, and may be near-impossible with a small tech disadvantage.  Add cost considerations (which may translate into number of variants with different sensor configurations) and I see a race to the smallest practical craft. Stealth tech etc. will be an additional trump card eventually, but the game remains the same.

I'll have fun poking at things, looking for ways to defend against small craft without resorting to smaller craft will be an interesting challenge.
But things brought up as problematic in VB6 Aurora, like max-size fine-grained sensors, look less dominant and tend to be comparatively expensive in some way or other.

To be honest this is going to be more difficult and complex than it sounds. Sure... it is more expensive to build and research a bigger sensor but where do you put the boundary of too big and how small can you make them not to be detected by something bigger at longer range for a reasonable price. A really small fighter with a large res sensor can be detected at fairly long range now even with a sensor with quite a bit lower res than the size of that craft. If you have decent sized res 1 and say res 2, 6, 18, 80 sensors on say 750-1000t crafts then really small crafts can have trouble. You also can have 500t crafts easily outrange 150t scouts for a very cheap price.

So... where is the border and what is deemed too expensive, quality can be very important sometimes.

The point is to be cheap enough... then we also have passive sensors which also favours slightly bigger ships as well now with smaller signatures being easier to pick up.

Missile ranges is also going to be shorter.

This probably means that making your scouts too small can be dangerous so you might want to hedge with several types of scouting crafts of different shapes and sizes and base sensor resolutions on known enemy ship classes as much as possible.

Obviously keeping sensor system small means you can optimise them against enemy crafts more easily but that also has a price not only in resources but time to produce the ships and parts as well. If you need the system yesterday you need to use what you have. I think that keeping sensors at around 300-400t range should be affordable from a maintainability purpose and good enough to be competitive in most situations. But investing in some who are a bit larger could probably pay of as well. This would make mostly decently large fighters or FAC the best options for competitive scouting forces. It would not be prohibitively expensive to build and research a few 4-500t fighter classes with a wide array of resolutions.

This is also where my conversation on protecting scouts comes in. A small group of destroyers with hangars to house some different small scout crafts and good enough offensive fire-power can become very important. You will not scout with active sensors since they are easily detected with passives much further away than what they detect something. So once a scout is detected if you then have easy access to fire-power close by you can clear them out and withdraw the destroyers to a safe place, they might sometimes not even have been detected properly either, depends on the scout or scouts found I guess.
« Last Edit: August 10, 2019, 05:00:23 PM by Jorgen_CAB »