Author Topic: Race-specific passwords for better MP  (Read 887 times)

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Offline jatzi (OP)

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Race-specific passwords for better MP
« on: July 18, 2023, 01:01:27 PM »
So I've been doing a lot of multiplayer on aurora lately with a GM running things and we enter orders on discord.  It's fun.  Confusing at times and difficult but still fun.  I think multiplayer has the capability of producing the best stories in aurora, especially since AI doesn't limit things then and we can make full use of the mechanics of the game against each other, like ground fighters for instance although I know they don't work super well.         

So I've been thinking of how to make it better because right now its difficult.  Very time consuming for the DMs, and therefore heavily subject to real life disruptions like what happened to Somebody's MP game.  It's still going but at a much slower pace due to real life stuff getting in the way.  It can also be confusing as things get larger and larger.  If the game is confined to one solar system great.  If things are more spread out then things get more confusing when you can't see the game yourself.  So being able to see the DB is super helpful in these kinds of games.  The dream is ofc to not need a GM and just go play, at the same time, against someone like in Hearts of Iron or Stellaris or whatever.  I don't expect that to happen though, it doesn't fit the structure of the game and there'd need to be some drastic changes to make it work and I bet Steve doesn't care to make those changes.       

However, something simple would be just adding in race specific passwords.  With race specific passwords the GM could upload the DB to a file sharing site like github.  So my idea would look like this.  You check out the DB and boot up the game and it asks for a password, you enter your race-specific password and then you are locked to that race.  No switching to another race to peek at their stuff and cheat.  Then after youre done entering orders you check the DB back in to github or whatever we'd want to use.  A built in system would be cool but I don't expect that.  Maybe that could be a mod in the future.  There could be a GM mode of GM race that always has access to everything which is again locked behind a password.  And these passwords would be set during game creation, there could be a check in the race creation window for having a password.  Or there could a multiplayer mode that you enable and that enables the whole password system.       

This would in my opinion greatly help multiplayer.  The load on GMs would be greatly decreased.  With no need to enter orders for everyone they'd be free to manage the game, run time more often, and perhaps do fun things with spacemaster.  Add in surprises for the players and whatnot.         

One more thing is that the password system should probably lock you out of SM mode although that could lead to issues perhaps.  The GM could still have access to it and could maybe be free to mess with every race so that they can manage stuff and correct issues and whatnot, mistakes, that pop up.  The idea being to keep players from cheating with SM although that might not be necessary.  Since the GM would be able to see every race they could therefore be able to keep track of what's going and so they'd know if someone is cheating.       

So yeah, that's my idea for a simple thing Steve could add to the game that could help make MP games easier.  Maybe its not so simple, I am not good at programming (yet).  So let me know if this is harder than I'm thinking it is.  Thanks!
« Last Edit: July 18, 2023, 04:18:15 PM by jatzi »
 
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Offline nuclearslurpee

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Re: Race-specific passwords for better MP
« Reply #1 on: July 18, 2023, 06:37:59 PM »
I admit I'm more than a bit ignorant of the Aurora multiplayer scene, but what does this actually accomplish in practice? Right now, you can already have each player give orders, etc. on the honor system; however, if someone wants to cheat a race-specific password won't prevent that since they can simply open the DB and get all the information they could want anyways.

I think the only way to have "secure" Aurora multiplayer would be to rewrite the game to work on a client/server framework where the DB is obtained remotely from a server or host/GM, players input their orders, and the orders are sent back to the remote host. This way no one can just poke around in the DB although I imagine it is still possible to somehow introspect the running code if someone really wants to cheat - which kind of brings us back around to the honor system, frankly if you're playing with someone who wants to cheat if they can then why are you playing with them at all?  ???
 

Offline JacenHan

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Re: Race-specific passwords for better MP
« Reply #2 on: July 18, 2023, 08:08:54 PM »
I admit I'm more than a bit ignorant of the Aurora multiplayer scene, but what does this actually accomplish in practice? Right now, you can already have each player give orders, etc. on the honor system; however, if someone wants to cheat a race-specific password won't prevent that since they can simply open the DB and get all the information they could want anyways.
If nothing else, right now there is no way (AFAIK) to select a race before opening the game, so anyone you send the file to is going to get a big face full of spoilers before they can switch over to their player race, even if everyone is abiding by the honor system.
 
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Offline Zap0

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Re: Race-specific passwords for better MP
« Reply #3 on: July 18, 2023, 10:26:10 PM »
If nothing else, right now there is no way (AFAIK) to select a race before opening the game, so anyone you send the file to is going to get a big face full of spoilers before they can switch over to their player race, even if everyone is abiding by the honor system.

We mitigated that in an old test game a bit by having a dummy race be the one thats on top of the race list, so that that is the one thats always selected first.
 
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Offline jatzi (OP)

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Re: Race-specific passwords for better MP
« Reply #4 on: July 19, 2023, 11:54:08 AM »
The dummy race is certainly a fix to unintentional spoilers but being able to just switch to the other race is a bit different to rooting through the DB code and understanding what you're seeing and cheating that way.  I personally wouldn't know what to look for since I've never gone through the DB like that.  It's just an extra layer of effort.  The goal here though isn't to make a 100% secure multiplayer game.  The goal here is to make it easier for the GM to run the game so that they can focus their efforts on running the game and coming up with fun surprises or whatever the goal of the campaign is.  Ya know GM stuff.  With passwords they can feel reasonably comfortable releasing the main DB without worrying that players will cheat.  It still requires the honor system yes because people could just open up the DB but I feel that is less likely due to just being more effort.  It's a little bit easier to rely on the honor system imo when cheating isn't as easy as selecting a different drop-down option but requires 3rd party software to open up the code and whatnot.  Really even now with just sending orders in discord theres probably ways to cheat if you try hard enough.  As I said though the goal here isn't really to prevent cheating it's to reduce the GM workload by allowing us to input our own orders without it being incredibly easy to cheat.  I don't know any GM that'd release the DB rn for players to look at without editing it first.  With the passwords I think they would be more comfortable with the idea which would make MP games much easier for everyone involved. 

And I know Steve doesn't care a ton about MP games as he doesn't play them which is fine.  But theyre kinda like DnD and provide a lot of ways to roleplay and tell interesting stories with cool lore and whatnot.  There's all sorts of fun scenarios people have ideas about but the biggest barrier to MP games is the GM both having the time, the willingness, and knowledge, to manage players and input a ton of orders and handle everything.  It's a ton of work to be a GM so I just want to reduce that even a little bit to help.  And I think race-specific passwords help, they're not perfect, but its as simple a solution I could think of that might help.  Simple in concept anyways as I have no clue how to implement it. 
 
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