Co-Dominium's Deep Armed Explorer ship

[waresky (OP)]

Earth CO-Dominium

01/05/2156
from our Naval bureau of R&R,Terra Admiralty

not so better Warship..but a mix and a New posture on Survey And Explore naval doctrine.
Stop in "Peacefull" survey vessel

Code: [Select]

Discovery IV J class Deep Space Survey Ship    25000 tons     2229 Crew     5914.5 BP      TCS 500  TH 497.25  EM 0
1326 km/s    JR 3-50     Armour 2-76     Shields 0-0     Sensors 495/11/2/3     Damage Control Rating 74     PPV 9
Annual Failure Rate: 91%    IFR: 1.3%    Maintenance Capacity 9058 MSP    Max Repair 2500 MSP
Magazine 237    

J25000(3-50) Military Jump Drive     Max Ship Size 25000 tons    Distance 50k km     Squadron Size 3
Nuclear Pulse Engine E7.6 ARM-1 (17)    Power 39    Fuel Use 76%    Signature 29.25    Armour 1    Exp 5%
Fuel Capacity 850,000 Litres    Range 80.5 billion km   (702 days at full power)

CIWS-80 (2x8)    Range 1000 km/s     TS: 8000 km/s     ROF 5       Base 50% To Hit
AS GB Launcher 6 Mk7 (75% Reduction) (2)    Missile Size 6    Rate of Fire 55
XL7 Missile Fire Control FC84-R20 (1)     Range 50.4m km    Resolution 20
Maverick AS-N 6 (39)  Speed: 27,200 km/s   End: 23m    Range: 37.5m km   WH: 12    Size: 6    TH: 181 / 108 / 54

AS30 Active Search Sensor S360-R18 (1)     GPS 6480     Range 64.8m km    Resolution 18
LongArea Thermal Sensor TH45-495 (1)     Sensitivity 495     Detect Sig Strength 1000:  495m km
EM Detection Sensor EM1-11 (1)     Sensitivity 11     Detect Sig Strength 1000:  11m km
Gravitational Survey Sensors (2)   2 Survey Points
Advanced Geological Sensors (1)   3 Survey Points

Missile to hit chances are vs targets moving at 3000 km/s, 5000 km/s and 10,000 km/s

This design is classed as a military vessel for maintenance purposes

[Andrew]

It is huge and is still a bad survey ship built one warship half this size and a number of small survey ships and you will have ships which do everything better.
As a warship it only mounts 2 launchers which will almost always fail against any antimissile defenses including it own as a salvo if 2 is just too smal, nice missiles though . Armour is thin for my tastes on a 25000 ton ship, I would rather increase the hull armour than armour the engines
I would take out the survey instruments and offensive missiles improve its armour and call it a jump cruiser, then give it sisterships on the same tonnage eith no jump drive and effective missile armements.
Then build a few smaller and faster survey ships to actually do survey work.

[waresky (OP)]

Someone think am play at Aurora from 1 or two days am see:))

In dozens (more than DOZENS in fact) of full campaign am use every type of survey,from layerBuoy,to little puny fastest touch-and-go Scout/Survey 1000tons ships..And sometimes am use this strange hybryd ship.
in long run Survey "RolePlaying" style and in a Low minerals,low fuel,low resources Governement,this strange "Cruiser" (Moties novel'like) Surveyor are a nice "DIFFERENT" and NO "perfect" ship at all..but r more.."realistic:)..

NASA r more dumb for me,than my strangeies designs:))

[Beersatron]

I think what Andrew is maybe trying to say is that in designing a 'Jack of all trades' you are actually reducing the overall feasibility of the design. Although, I realize that you are roleplaying 'dumb designers'  

What size in tons is that thermal sensor? Can you create a smaller one? And then with the saved space try to fit more missile launchers?

To be honest, I don't think that 2 missiles every 55secs is going to be able to damage any attacking ship of substance. I do not have Aurora on this machine so can't show you a design of mine, but I have a 6000 ton Destroyer that could probably catch and destroy your survey ship.

If I recall correctly, it has:
1 CIWS (so has a good chance of knocking down your 2 missile salvo)
6 armour
6 shields
4 size 8 launchers with missiles of WH4 that do ~20000km/s
ion engines for total speed of 3000km/s

Your 2 CIWS might actually save you from this design as I think I only have the one fire control. But, I operate these destroyers in groups of 3 or 6 and so would any NPR or Precursor that you run into.

I have never felt that need for an armed geo and grav survey ship, but I might try and design one when I get home and see how it compares to yours.

[waresky (OP)]

This r a very "Newbee RolePlaying Designers pre-testing In Space" for my "governors:)..

WE all know how r very nasty,the Steve's Univers around:DDD

but for my Engineers..the Space r SAME as Earthlike REAL sensations atm..= peacefull,beautifull,VOID:).
And in this design another very lack r,for a "DEEP Survey" high purpouse:D..the Fuel efficiency.
in some months this MonsterConsumerofFuel r capable to consume all reserve.

So in fact this r "Absolutely NOT to construct" design:..eheheh

[Hawkeye]

Holy camoly! This is one hell of a thermal sensor, I bet this baby could see someone light a cigarette on Alpha Centaurie from old earth  

I understand this is roleplaying ship design, but even with a low resource/money/manpower/whatever, this ship doesn´t make a lot of sense (I think). In terms of minerals/money it is a huge waste.
Hm, I could see it work as a first (horrible) attempt at designing an armed survey ship.
Once it gets blown away by the first FAC it encounters, the company CEO designing it gets taken out and shot and new, more sensible designs start to appearing.


Something totally unrelated with this design itself. This line:

CIWS-80 (2x8)    Range 1000 km/s     TS: 8000 km/s     ROF 5       Base 50% To Hit

The Range uses an km/s, which doesn´t look right

[waresky (OP)]

True,all true:)

Wall r ready for designers..

[Steve Walmsley]

Something totally unrelated with this design itself. This line:

CIWS-80 (2x8)    Range 1000 km/s     TS: 8000 km/s     ROF 5       Base 50% To Hit

The Range uses an km/s, which doesn´t look right

Well spotted. I have fixed it for the next version.

Steve

[Paul M]

As I tend to be a proponent of jack-of-all-trades ships in general, I want to comment a bit on not so much what is wrong with the design but how if you were going to produce such a ship you could make it more useful.

1. its passives should be slightly increased.  It is far to expensive in terms of build points and such to not allocate more that way.
2. its maintenance stock is rather low, it looks large but it has a 2500 max repair cost, though this is a minor aspect and depends largely on what is the maintenance capacity of the re-supply ships it rendezvous with regularly.  But I've quite often had multiple occurrences of jump drive failures.  This is one that is a matter of taste I suppose but it is not a trivial consideration since I've had survey missions out for 7 years (beating the five year mission by 2).
3.  The fuel capacity is probably too large but again this is a matter of taste and jump point connections plus re-fueling bases and ships.
4.  Nothing wrong with the fire control.
5.  The missiles are a different story.  Since only 39 can be carried 6 should be self guiding, and capable of launch at point blank range (1-2 million Km only).  A further 6 should be long range (full 50.4 km) of the guidance system.  The remaining should be stock.  All missiles should be armoured with 2 pts (requiring 3 intercepts to kill).  Given the speed of the missile there is a good chance it won't get hit 3 times so it will impact even against moderate densities of anti-missile defenses.  To make the most of the limited launchers you need specialized missiles.  You could also put in place 2 stage missiles which launch counter missiles I suppose though I'm not sure that would work in reality.  ECM would also help but they have such high speed I'm dubious that many other missiles could intercept them easily depending on the tech level which I find hard to determine.
6.  The sensor suite really needs a lot of work.  Most alien planets will show up with EM rather than Thermal sensors so make them the primary passive.  Your thermals only need to see drives at 60 m Km or even less.  Also EM sensors warn if you are being scanned so they are far far more critical than thermals.
7.  I would seriously look at using commercial drives they are considerably more fuel efficient and they have a higher power output even with their higher mass you may benefit.  Or not, mind you, but it is worth checking out.

I also wonder why the ship is damn big.  My survey ships were only 4000 tons, doubling this with weapons and so on would make them only a third the size of these monsters and that makes a huge difference in terms of jump drives and conventional drives.  I honestly don't see what most of the mass of the ship is being used for beyond the sensors perhaps.  Also I don't see the point of the "Gun Boat" launch system on a 25000 ton ship.  Put a full sized launcher in there instead, this is a false economy.

Also ask yourself what you plan on fighting with this ship and plan the missiles accordingly.  I would also carry 40 of them giving you 20 launches...sufficient to either win against lighter smaller ships.

I think that until you have a big fleet and all that entails that having GP ships makes a lot of sense since specialist ships imply you have sufficient numbers to have them not being effective at all.  But on the other hand Steve's construction rules may make this impossible.

[waresky (OP)]

90 years later,DeepSurvey are change very deepest in every aspect.
In fact the Discovery V J are born in early Space Era of my confederation.
Now r totally evolved.
And more more little.

In fact,the DSS-25000 tons Class was a merely sardonic bad example on "Imperial idiotism"..