Aurora 4x
C# Aurora => Development Discussions => Topic started by: xenoscepter on October 03, 2019, 03:05:41 AM
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--- Exactly what it reads on the tin, could we maybe have the ability to spend Missile Size Points on Cryogenic Berths and use missiles to shoot our colonists around? I mean, I think it would be cool, and at least plausible. Have techs for it under Missiles / Kinetic Weapons; with increments for 10 / 100 / 1000 / 10000 Colonists per MSP? I think it would add some depth to the game.
--- Also, Terraforming Missiles would be an interesting idea... but probably hella complicated to code.
Cheers!
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Missiles are... not very big, I don't think your idea makes sense unless you are also proposing some sort of colonist compression technology.
Though it does bring up the idea of automated colony ships, like one shot vessels that bring colonists to a planet and then are converted into infrastructure/installations or something, which is an idea I could get behind.
As for terraforming missiles I sort of like the idea of loading up gases into missile and firing them at the planet you want to change from billions of km away, it seems like it would be incredibly inefficient though, and also a good way to use terraforming to kill populations without harming installations. So I think maybe it won't be happening sadly.
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One use colony ships is something that could make sense and also save on micromanagement from moving them around, refitting etc.
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I mean, I think it would be cool, and at least plausible. Have techs for it under Missiles / Kinetic Weapons; with increments for 10 / 100 / 1000 / 10000 Colonists per MSP? I think it would add some depth to the game.
One HS = 50 ton
One HS = 20 MSP
This means 1 MSP = 2.5 ton
How do you propose fitting 10000 colonists into something that is somewhere in size between a large car or smaller freight container and argue that this is plausible?
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For that matter, fitting 10 people in that space along with the needed support equipment would be a bit of a trick. Current cryogenic transport rules does support it being possible as the smallest transport system fits 200 in 1 HS (or 20 MSP), but that's on the basis it's mounted on a ship and supported by crew.
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Missiles are... not very big, I don't think your idea makes sense unless you are also proposing some sort of colonist compression technology.
I did the math once and I think the numbers I came up with was that even a size 2 missile was about the size of a shipping container. Which makes sense considering that given their range they're probably like small starships in their own right, and explains why limited missile ammo is always a big concern in Aurora compared to other games.
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Yeah but a shipping container is still nowhere near big enough to house 1000 people, regardless of being in cryogenic sleep or not. In that context missiles are not large, despite being bigger than most of our current military missiles.
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I just pulled those numbers outta my ass for the sake of brainstorming. The idea of 10 Colonists per MSP was what I had in mind originally, with 100 being a better version.
On the subject of cramming 10,000 people into a 2.5 Ton sardine can... it depends what that can is made of.
2.5 tons of Lead and 2.5 Tons of Helium weigh the same, but occupy drastically different amounts space to achieve that.
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@Panopticon
--- Would be cool if there were modules for the installations; that way you could make a colony ship with multiple installations.
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Okay so you make a 50 MSP missile with 10 MSP of it being engine and rest colonist transport. That's 400 settlers. You'll have to build a lot of those to move any significant number. I get that it would be kinda cool from a RP standpoint, but it just seems like a lot of extra work for Steve for an extremely marginal feature that hardly anyone would ever use.
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I just feel like it doesn't make any real sense either, colonists need infrastructure and installations otherwise they don't do anything and probably die, so unless we are loading those into missiles too then you have to send ships to the planet anyway, and if we are sending ship to the planet anyway then we my as well send a colony ship too.
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Hullsize in tons is less an absolute measure of mass and more a measure of volume. IIRC it's based on approximate volume of an equal size steel ship's water displacement.
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Hullsize in tons is less an absolute measure of mass and more a measure of volume. IIRC it's based on approximate volume of an equal size steel ship's water displacement.
Liquid hydrogen, as I recall.
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There's a suggestion thread already, featuring far better suggestions deserving of their own thread than this one...
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Now we are having a perfectly nice discussion here.
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A perfectly nice discussion of putting colonists inside a missile and shooting it at a planetoid. Not gonna lie, it sounds rather cool (if rather tedious) to do EVERY action with missiles. Survey, Terraform, Transport, Colonize, Garrison.
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@Ranged66
That's rather unhelpful... and rude.
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@Ranged66
Yeah I am gonna pile on here, this ain't 4Chan man, be nice, if you don't like the idea then either just ignore it and move on or do what some of the rest of us are doing and either suggest modifications that might be neat or have fun with how ridiculous the idea is, there is no call for put downs.
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I question the actual usefulness, but the idea of an opposed colonization effort does sound vaguely hilarious to me.
e: so it just hit me, what about missile drop pods for infantry and such? that could be pretty cool, thematically speaking. huge launch tubes filled with mechs and tanks and troops and stuff.
https://youtu.be/kyIMegaOxyg?t=42 (https://youtu.be/kyIMegaOxyg?t=42)
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I question the actual usefulness, but the idea of an opposed colonization effort does sound vaguely hilarious to me.
e: so it just hit me, what about missile drop pods for infantry and such? that could be pretty cool, thematically speaking. huge launch tubes filled with mechs and tanks and troops and stuff.
https://youtu.be/kyIMegaOxyg?t=42 (https://youtu.be/kyIMegaOxyg?t=42)
I assume that's just the combat drop pod modules.
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@Tree
I was just about to say that.
@All
Yeah, I thought it was a nifty idea for an after-project, once Steve finishes C#. I like the idea of a giant orbital MLRS that launches these to budding planets, it's pretty cool. As for a use-case, Missile Tubes are weapons, Cryogenic Transport Modules are not. From colonizing to ass-kicking with the swap of a mag.
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I mean, insofar as you don't have as much control over those as you do missiles.
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Now you are making me imagine ways one could weaponize Cryogenic Transport Modules.
Stasis missile, anyone?
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You'd need a damn lot of missiles is all I'll say.
Though a nifty way to get intelligence teams onto an enemy colony...
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My first reaction to the idea is why exactly would they need to be missiles with their own propulsion and other guidance system launched at destinations?
We're already launching thousands upon thousands of tons of minerals at a time from mass drivers from one planet to another and having them arrive safely at the destination. So if a civilisation was so inclined why wouldn't they simply develop more sturdy shipping coffins that hold 1 person with enough internal systems just to keep the occupant alive. And then the planetary mass drivers could launch thousands of colonists at a time at the destination.
At the end of the day, solving the 'surviving launching people in space coffins from mass drivers' engineering problem would probably be more efficient and practical then developing a consumable one-use intelligent human missile system approach.
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My first reaction to the idea is why exactly would they need to be missiles with their own propulsion and other guidance system launched at destinations?
We're already launching thousands upon thousands of tons of minerals at a time from mass drivers from one planet to another and having them arrive safely at the destination. So if a civilisation was so inclined why wouldn't they simply develop more sturdy shipping coffins that hold 1 person with enough internal systems just to keep the occupant alive. And then the planetary mass drivers could launch thousands of colonists at a time at the destination.
At the end of the day, solving the 'surviving launching people in space coffins from mass drivers' engineering problem would probably be more efficient and practical then developing a consumable one-use intelligent human missile system approach.
Well without another mass driver to catch them, mass driver packets are orbital bombardment...
Hmmm an option to just launch packets of rock from mass drivers, use them for Actual Moon is a Harsh Mistress style bombardment...
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Sorry. Aurora Mass Drivers can't move 'rock'. The trans-newtonian physics they operate on can only hurl TN elements. You'll have to bombard your enemy with expensive minerals, not free dirt.
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Good point, but as long as the minerals can be recovered again after there are no more aliens infesting the planet that is still a way better investment than building ships & missiles out of them to do the same job.
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Sorry. Aurora Mass Drivers can't move 'rock'. The trans-newtonian physics they operate on can only hurl TN elements. You'll have to bombard your enemy with expensive minerals, not free dirt.
why?
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Sorry. Aurora Mass Drivers can't move 'rock'. The trans-newtonian physics they operate on can only hurl TN elements. You'll have to bombard your enemy with expensive minerals, not free dirt.
And if you have a human meatbag encased in a single occupant sized TN element composed space coffin?
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Sorry. Aurora Mass Drivers can't move 'rock'. The trans-newtonian physics they operate on can only hurl TN elements. You'll have to bombard your enemy with expensive minerals, not free dirt.
why?
'Cause them's the rules.
Presumably because it was considered unbalancing to allow cheap dirt.
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Sorry. Aurora Mass Drivers can't move 'rock'. The trans-newtonian physics they operate on can only hurl TN elements. You'll have to bombard your enemy with expensive minerals, not free dirt.
And if you have a human meatbag encased in a single occupant sized TN element composed space coffin?
Given the number of tons of TNE in a mass driver packet, the human (or other species) meatbag is a rounding error.
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Sorry. Aurora Mass Drivers can't move 'rock'. The trans-newtonian physics they operate on can only hurl TN elements. You'll have to bombard your enemy with expensive minerals, not free dirt.
And if you have a human meatbag encased in a single occupant sized TN element composed space coffin?
Given the number of tons of TNE in a mass driver packet, the human (or other species) meatbag is a rounding error.
Mass driver packet sizes when launching minerals have nothing to do with anything in this scenario.
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Sorry. Aurora Mass Drivers can't move 'rock'. The trans-newtonian physics they operate on can only hurl TN elements. You'll have to bombard your enemy with expensive minerals, not free dirt.
why?
'Cause them's the rules.
Presumably because it was considered unbalancing to allow cheap dirt.
That's not the reason they only do TN-Minerals