Author Topic: danger ratings for systems  (Read 4811 times)

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Offline Rogtuok (OP)

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danger ratings for systems
« on: February 22, 2018, 01:51:50 PM »
I did a search only found it in your post.

About this"danger ratings for systems" will we be able to set it owerself or will the system set it.

And how will it work?

Link to your post.
http://aurora2.pentarch.org/index.php?topic=9843.0
 

Offline Steve Walmsley

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Re: danger ratings for systems
« Reply #1 on: February 22, 2018, 04:07:08 PM »
In VB6 it is called Security Status and appears as red numbers on the galactic map. When a race suffers damage, it is added to the danger rating. The rating slowly decreases over time.

Civilians and default orders will avoid systems where the protection value of friendly warships is lower than the danger rating. That avoids commercial shipping moving into dangerous areas.
 
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Offline Rogtuok (OP)

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Re: danger ratings for systems
« Reply #2 on: February 23, 2018, 12:16:42 AM »
Will we be able to manipulate it in some way like increase or degrees it.

So we can set certain systems to be of limit?
 

Offline Steve Walmsley

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Re: danger ratings for systems
« Reply #3 on: February 23, 2018, 04:40:35 AM »
Will we be able to manipulate it in some way like increase or degrees it.

So we can set certain systems to be of limit?

It is intended to portray a reluctance by civilians to enter dangerous areas so it won't be player controlled, as that would provide too much control over civilian traffic.
 

Offline Hazard

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Re: danger ratings for systems
« Reply #4 on: February 23, 2018, 04:55:05 AM »
It is intended to portray a reluctance by civilians to enter dangerous areas so it won't be player controlled, as that would provide too much control over civilian traffic.

Governments have denied access to civilians to (potentially) dangerous areas for a long time though. It should be possible to declare a system off limits, adding any allied PPV in system to the Danger Rating, and if possible add the PPV on the other end of a given JP as well for routing calculations.
 

Offline Steve Walmsley

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Re: danger ratings for systems
« Reply #5 on: February 23, 2018, 05:01:35 AM »
Governments have denied access to civilians to (potentially) dangerous areas for a long time though. It should be possible to declare a system off limits, adding any allied PPV in system to the Danger Rating, and if possible add the PPV on the other end of a given JP as well for routing calculations.

Agree that governments have restricted civilian traffic. However, in this case that could be abused to exactly direct civilian traffic to a desired destination bu placing every other route out of bounds. If you can come up with a mechanic to implement your suggestion on an emergency basis without the potential for full-scale abuse, then I will add something on those lines.
 

Offline Hazard

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Re: danger ratings for systems
« Reply #6 on: February 23, 2018, 06:44:08 AM »
Agree that governments have restricted civilian traffic. However, in this case that could be abused to exactly direct civilian traffic to a desired destination bu placing every other route out of bounds. If you can come up with a mechanic to implement your suggestion on an emergency basis without the potential for full-scale abuse, then I will add something on those lines.

Well, there's two problems here. The first is that for some systems you really want to more or less indefinitely keep them from being used by civilians. Like with Jumpgate linked systems when there's [spoilers] or an NPR making a mess of it when you've got colonies at either end. It would be inconvenient to have half your civilian cargo fleet commit suicide because the danger rating lapsed but you haven't managed to clear out the threat.

The other problem is that the ability to precisely define the interstellar movements of civilian ships is apparently not desired.

There's two possible solutions I see, both of which are to do with the cost of enforcing a danger rating. The first is that you add PVV/tonnage of friendly military ships to civilian routing/danger level calculations for restricted systems. The bigger the difference in distance the less civilian ships care about danger/restriction ratings, so as that difference increases you need to add more and/or bigger ships to maintain the barrier. Having to dedicate half your fleet on sitting on a system so civilians do not do something they're not supposed to do is inconvenient.

The other option is that restricting a system costs wealth to impose, and an escalating amount of wealth to keep up while cancelling a restriction causes a cooldown based on how long a system has been restricted before it can be restricted again without eating a massive wealth penalty.
 

Offline alex_brunius

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Re: danger ratings for systems
« Reply #7 on: February 23, 2018, 07:13:48 AM »
I like the idea that you have to put Military ships on a Jump point enforcing a goverment blockade of civilian traffic ( And you often want to do that anyway to prevent the nasties comming through the other way ).

Another solution to consider is to handle the case of danger rating ticking down to 0 better. Realistically no company would send half their fleet suddenly to an unknown system just because there was X years since last ship got blown up there. They would send a single brave small ship with big sensors or hired escort first to check if the coast is clear before more start following gradually if route proves to be safe.
 

Offline Steve Walmsley

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Re: danger ratings for systems
« Reply #8 on: February 23, 2018, 09:53:40 AM »
Well, there's two problems here. The first is that for some systems you really want to more or less indefinitely keep them from being used by civilians. Like with Jumpgate linked systems when there's [spoilers] or an NPR making a mess of it when you've got colonies at either end. It would be inconvenient to have half your civilian cargo fleet commit suicide because the danger rating lapsed but you haven't managed to clear out the threat.

That could be handled by having danger rating not reduce automatically, but only when your own warships are in the system and there is no sign of enemy contacts. So you have to be in effective control for a while before civilians would consider entering.
 
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Offline QuakeIV

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Re: danger ratings for systems
« Reply #9 on: February 23, 2018, 11:50:39 AM »
That potentially sounds like a good idea to me.
 
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Offline TMaekler

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Re: danger ratings for systems
« Reply #10 on: February 23, 2018, 03:31:28 PM »
Agree that governments have restricted civilian traffic. However, in this case that could be abused to exactly direct civilian traffic to a desired destination bu placing every other route out of bounds. If you can come up with a mechanic to implement your suggestion on an emergency basis without the potential for full-scale abuse, then I will add something on those lines.

Maybe limiting a race to 100 "Danger Points" (or whatever number fits) which the government can use to put on systems. If you want to add DPs to a system and have already spend all 100 you have to decrease them from those systems to use in the new one.
 

Offline drayath

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Re: danger ratings for systems
« Reply #11 on: March 14, 2018, 04:16:13 PM »
One possibility is a task-force order to restrict a system. If given to a fleet in a system it acts similar to task-force training (fuel usage/maintenance etc), but adds the fleets protection value to the systems danger rating while active. Give an upfront cost (the fleet), ongoing cost (fuel/maintenance & forcing ships to be in system) and a rp reason (military patrolling the area and actively intercepting/warding off unwanted traffic). Would probably need to set a minimum PV cost (per JP in system?) so can't abuse by having a single fighter apply the restriction.
 

Offline Bughunter

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Re: danger ratings for systems
« Reply #12 on: March 15, 2018, 07:11:29 AM »
Patrolling sounds like an interesting solution.. and could maybe also be used to keep neutral aliens out/away from specific jump points.
 

Offline Froggiest1982

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Re: danger ratings for systems
« Reply #13 on: March 15, 2018, 09:02:10 PM »
Agree that governments have restricted civilian traffic. However, in this case that could be abused to exactly direct civilian traffic to a desired destination bu placing every other route out of bounds. If you can come up with a mechanic to implement your suggestion on an emergency basis without the potential for full-scale abuse, then I will add something on those lines.

Middle way...can we have a modifier of route importance?

Example Sol system high importance, Alpha centaury less important, Barnard star Default. Civilian Algorithm then will calculate adding a modifier considering importance; this will not divert all traffic but just the one needed to full fill the orders keep following the main rules. if you want it more complicated you could be needed a minimum amount of defence in the system if you want to be able to tick high importance modifier or eventually, you could set up a maximum of 1 or 2 high priority routes avoiding the potential for full-scale abuse.

Probably this will be needed to be activated on the galactic map with the possibility of having a filter too.

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Re: danger ratings for systems
« Reply #14 on: March 16, 2018, 12:14:33 PM »
Quote from: TMaekler link=topic=9844. msg106804#msg106804 date=1519421488
Maybe limiting a race to 100 "Danger Points" (or whatever number fits) which the government can use to put on systems.  If you want to add DPs to a system and have already spend all 100 you have to decrease them from those systems to use in the new one.

Maybe make it so that the more "danger points" you allocate around, the more likely civilians are to ignore the government warnings and pick, say, a danger 3/4 route instead of sticking to a 0 danger route.  Then you could make it so that the more fighting there is with aliens/ the more commerical ships are destroyed, the less likely they are to go to danger-flagged systems even if you've spammed too many danger signs.

I feel like this would be a neat approximation of the way oversaturation of warnings can cause people to disregard them, as well as stop you from controlling the civvies to hard, but also means they get "scared straight" for a while when someone breaks the rules and gets glomped by the Things From Beyond the Jump Gate