Big Beam or Little Beam?

[Borealis4x (OP)]

I'm debating whether my interception beam ships that close with the enemy to soak missiles for bombers and frakk things up should be on the smaller or larger side of things. Basically should they be a frigate or a destroyer.

A larger ship will have more armor, weapons and PD obviously. On the other hand closing with the enemy is dangerous, and I'd rather not lose large, valuable ships, and 4 1 beam frigate is the same as 1 4 beam destroyer, isn't it? Only difference is you only lose one beam if a ship gets destroyed rather than 4.

I have two designs:

Big Beam

Code: [Select]

Karl von Clausewitz class Destroyer (P)      25,000 tons       753 Crew       12,136.5 BP       TCS 500    TH 540    EM 1,500
9000 km/s      Armour 8-76       Shields 50-300       HTK 176      Sensors 24/24/0/0      DCR 60      PPV 155.4
Maint Life 4.09 Years     MSP 9,102    AFR 167%    IFR 2.3%    1YR 873    5YR 13,094    Max Repair 1406.250 MSP
Captain    Control Rating 4   BRG   AUX   ENG   CIC   
Intended Deployment Time: 6 months    Morale Check Required   

Half Magnetic Fusion Drive  EP1125.00 (4)    Power 4500.0    Fuel Use 47.73%    Signature 135.0000    Explosion 15%
Fuel Capacity 5,057,000 Litres    Range 76.3 billion km (98 days at full power)
Xi S50 / R300 Shields (1)     Recharge Time 300 seconds (0.2 per second)

Saeder-Krupp Heavy Industries Series 1 Super MAC (4)    Range 400,000km     TS: 9,000 km/s     Power 75-8    ROF 50       
Quad Rheinmetall AG Gauss Cannon A Mk.1 (10x20)    Range 50,000km     TS: 32000 km/s     Power 0-0     RM 50,000 km    ROF 5       
Renraku Computer Systems MAC Fire Control 480, 8 km/s (1)     Max Range: 480,000 km   TS: 8,000 km/s     98 96 94 92 90 88 85 83 81 79
Wuxing Incorporated Point Defense Fire Control R60-TS32000 (1)     Max Range: 60,000 km   TS: 32,000 km/s     83 67 50 33 17 0 0 0 0 0
Inertial Confinement Fusion Reactor R34-PB100 (1)     Total Power Output 33.7    Exp 50%

Raytheon Point DRADIS AS19-R1 (10%) (1)     GPS 48     Range 19.1m km    MCR 1.7m km    Resolution 1
Raytheon Standard DRADIS AS51-R20 (10%) (1)     GPS 960     Range 52m km    Resolution 20
Boglin Fields, Inc. MilSpec Standard Thermal Sensor Mk.1 (1)     Sensitivity 24     Detect Sig Strength 1000:  38.7m km
Boglin Fields, Inc. MilSpec Standard EM Sensor Mk1. (1)     Sensitivity 24     Detect Sig Strength 1000:  38.7m km

ECM 50

Little Beam

Code: [Select]

Trident class Frigate (P)      8,000 tons       231 Crew       4,405.8 BP       TCS 160    TH 203    EM 0
10547 km/s      Armour 4-35       Shields 0-0       HTK 55      Sensors 24/24/0/0      DCR 33      PPV 35.08
Maint Life 1.39 Years     MSP 1,032    AFR 171%    IFR 2.4%    1YR 577    5YR 8,654    Max Repair 831.3 MSP
Captain    Control Rating 4   BRG   AUX   ENG   CIC   
Intended Deployment Time: 6 months    Morale Check Required   

Quarter Magnetic Fusion Drive  EP562.50 (3)    Power 1687.5    Fuel Use 67.50%    Signature 67.5000    Explosion 15%
Fuel Capacity 1,804,000 Litres    Range 60.1 billion km (65 days at full power)

Saeder-Krupp Heavy Industries Series 1 Super MAC (1)    Range 400,000km     TS: 10,547 km/s     Power 75-8    ROF 50       
Quad Rheinmetall AG Gauss Cannon A Mk.1 (2x20)    Range 50,000km     TS: 32000 km/s     Power 0-0     RM 50,000 km    ROF 5       
Wuxing Incorporated Point Defense Fire Control R60-TS32000 (1)     Max Range: 60,000 km   TS: 32,000 km/s     83 67 50 33 17 0 0 0 0 0
Renraku Computer Systems MAC Fire Control 480, 8 km/s (1)     Max Range: 480,000 km   TS: 8,000 km/s     98 96 94 92 90 88 85 83 81 79
SinoViet Heavy Machinery Micro-Inertial Confinement Fusion Reactor (1)     Total Power Output 8    Exp 50%

Raytheon Standard DRADIS AS51-R20 (10%) (1)     GPS 960     Range 52m km    Resolution 20
Raytheon Micro Point DRADIS AS6-R1 (10%) (1)     GPS 5     Range 6.1m km    MCR 545k km    Resolution 1
Boglin Fields, Inc. MilSpec Standard Thermal Sensor Mk.1 (1)     Sensitivity 24     Detect Sig Strength 1000:  38.7m km
Boglin Fields, Inc. MilSpec Standard EM Sensor Mk1. (1)     Sensitivity 24     Detect Sig Strength 1000:  38.7m km

ECM 50

This design is classed as a Military Vessel for maintenance purposes

EDIT:
I know the tracking speed for the Beam FC is low. I'm working on it.

[Ulzgoroth]

The destroyer has 4 times the main beams, but also 5 times the Gauss cannons, more than 4 times the total armor at double the thickness, shields, and better fuel and engineering economy. And only costs and weighs about three times as much.  It does muster a bit less speed, but mostly I suspect it's saving by not having to include an extra three copies of the sensor and fire control suites and the control stations, which really add up when you include the full set.

Unless the 25000 ton size imposes some serious penalties, or you're fighting enemies that will maul the destroyer in just two or three shots, I'd much rather have one of the big ones than four of the little ones...

(Of course, one of either could toast my entire battlefleet in an afternoon without scratching the paint. Maybe I could touch a Trident with my missile strike fighters. It's much faster than they are, but probably can't detect them before they reach firing range.)

It might be worth your time to boost the MAC fire control tracking speed a little bit. You're leaving potential accuracy on the table there, assuming you sometimes shoot the big gun at targets over 8kkm/s, and you can probably afford to spend an extra hull space there.

[Gabethebaldandbold]

you might want to squeeze in some ECCM. I am overall a big fan of larger ships, and in this case, I think that the 25000 ton destroyer (which is by the way huge huge for a destroyer) is best, although I would prefer some tougher shields instead of an 8 layer armour personally.
the good thing about the 8000 ton vessel though, its that you can split the fleet better, and have an easier time keeping your smaller colonies defended.
so unless you are facing very impressive firepower coming from your enemies, you should go with the Karl von somethingsomething

[Jorgen_CAB]

I'm debating whether my interception beam ships that close with the enemy to soak missiles for bombers and frakk things up should be on the smaller or larger side of things. Basically should they be a frigate or a destroyer.

A larger ship will have more armor, weapons and PD obviously. On the other hand closing with the enemy is dangerous, and I'd rather not lose large, valuable ships, and 4 1 beam frigate is the same as 1 4 beam destroyer, isn't it? Only difference is you only lose one beam if a ship gets destroyed rather than 4.

I have two designs:

Big Beam

Code: [Select]


Karl von Clausewitz class Destroyer (P)      25,000 tons       753 Crew       12,136.5 BP       TCS 500    TH 540    EM 1,500
9000 km/s      Armour 8-76       Shields 50-300       HTK 176      Sensors 24/24/0/0      DCR 60      PPV 155.4
Maint Life 4.09 Years     MSP 9,102    AFR 167%    IFR 2.3%    1YR 873    5YR 13,094    Max Repair 1406.250 MSP
Captain    Control Rating 4   BRG   AUX   ENG   CIC   
Intended Deployment Time: 6 months    Morale Check Required   

Half Magnetic Fusion Drive  EP1125.00 (4)    Power 4500.0    Fuel Use 47.73%    Signature 135.0000    Explosion 15%
Fuel Capacity 5,057,000 Litres    Range 76.3 billion km (98 days at full power)
Xi S50 / R300 Shields (1)     Recharge Time 300 seconds (0.2 per second)

Saeder-Krupp Heavy Industries Series 1 Super MAC (4)    Range 400,000km     TS: 9,000 km/s     Power 75-8    ROF 50       
Quad Rheinmetall AG Gauss Cannon A Mk.1 (10x20)    Range 50,000km     TS: 32000 km/s     Power 0-0     RM 50,000 km    ROF 5       
Renraku Computer Systems MAC Fire Control 480, 8 km/s (1)     Max Range: 480,000 km   TS: 8,000 km/s     98 96 94 92 90 88 85 83 81 79
Wuxing Incorporated Point Defense Fire Control R60-TS32000 (1)     Max Range: 60,000 km   TS: 32,000 km/s     83 67 50 33 17 0 0 0 0 0
Inertial Confinement Fusion Reactor R34-PB100 (1)     Total Power Output 33.7    Exp 50%

Raytheon Point DRADIS AS19-R1 (10%) (1)     GPS 48     Range 19.1m km    MCR 1.7m km    Resolution 1
Raytheon Standard DRADIS AS51-R20 (10%) (1)     GPS 960     Range 52m km    Resolution 20
Boglin Fields, Inc. MilSpec Standard Thermal Sensor Mk.1 (1)     Sensitivity 24     Detect Sig Strength 1000:  38.7m km
Boglin Fields, Inc. MilSpec Standard EM Sensor Mk1. (1)     Sensitivity 24     Detect Sig Strength 1000:  38.7m km

ECM 50

Little Beam

Code: [Select]

Trident class Frigate (P)      8,000 tons       231 Crew       4,405.8 BP       TCS 160    TH 203    EM 0
10547 km/s      Armour 4-35       Shields 0-0       HTK 55      Sensors 24/24/0/0      DCR 33      PPV 35.08
Maint Life 1.39 Years     MSP 1,032    AFR 171%    IFR 2.4%    1YR 577    5YR 8,654    Max Repair 831.3 MSP
Captain    Control Rating 4   BRG   AUX   ENG   CIC   
Intended Deployment Time: 6 months    Morale Check Required   

Quarter Magnetic Fusion Drive  EP562.50 (3)    Power 1687.5    Fuel Use 67.50%    Signature 67.5000    Explosion 15%
Fuel Capacity 1,804,000 Litres    Range 60.1 billion km (65 days at full power)

Saeder-Krupp Heavy Industries Series 1 Super MAC (1)    Range 400,000km     TS: 10,547 km/s     Power 75-8    ROF 50       
Quad Rheinmetall AG Gauss Cannon A Mk.1 (2x20)    Range 50,000km     TS: 32000 km/s     Power 0-0     RM 50,000 km    ROF 5       
Wuxing Incorporated Point Defense Fire Control R60-TS32000 (1)     Max Range: 60,000 km   TS: 32,000 km/s     83 67 50 33 17 0 0 0 0 0
Renraku Computer Systems MAC Fire Control 480, 8 km/s (1)     Max Range: 480,000 km   TS: 8,000 km/s     98 96 94 92 90 88 85 83 81 79
SinoViet Heavy Machinery Micro-Inertial Confinement Fusion Reactor (1)     Total Power Output 8    Exp 50%

Raytheon Standard DRADIS AS51-R20 (10%) (1)     GPS 960     Range 52m km    Resolution 20
Raytheon Micro Point DRADIS AS6-R1 (10%) (1)     GPS 5     Range 6.1m km    MCR 545k km    Resolution 1
Boglin Fields, Inc. MilSpec Standard Thermal Sensor Mk.1 (1)     Sensitivity 24     Detect Sig Strength 1000:  38.7m km
Boglin Fields, Inc. MilSpec Standard EM Sensor Mk1. (1)     Sensitivity 24     Detect Sig Strength 1000:  38.7m km

ECM 50

This design is classed as a Military Vessel for maintenance purposes

EDIT:
I know the tracking speed for the Beam FC is low. I'm working on it.

A larger ship is always more powerful than the same amount of tonnage for pretty much anything except stealth and production.

A small ship will always be more vulnerable but you can produce smaller ships faster so you can basically produce more of them during a specific time period. If time is not a concern and you have the technological capacity to fit the larger more research intensive components in that larger ship they are the best choice.

Those are the basic factors you have to juggle and there is no perfect answer to the question.

[Borealis4x (OP)]

you might want to squeeze in some ECCM. I am overall a big fan of larger ships, and in this case, I think that the 25000 ton destroyer (which is by the way huge huge for a destroyer) is best, although I would prefer some tougher shields instead of an 8 layer armour personally.
the good thing about the 8000 ton vessel though, its that you can split the fleet better, and have an easier time keeping your smaller colonies defended.
so unless you are facing very impressive firepower coming from your enemies, you should go with the Karl von somethingsomething

ur mums way huge for a destroyer

Anyways, I think ECCM only applies to missile FC.

[Jorgen_CAB]

you might want to squeeze in some ECCM. I am overall a big fan of larger ships, and in this case, I think that the 25000 ton destroyer (which is by the way huge huge for a destroyer) is best, although I would prefer some tougher shields instead of an 8 layer armour personally.
the good thing about the 8000 ton vessel though, its that you can split the fleet better, and have an easier time keeping your smaller colonies defended.
so unless you are facing very impressive firepower coming from your enemies, you should go with the Karl von somethingsomething

ur mums way huge for a destroyer

Anyways, I think ECCM only applies to missile FC.

No ECCM apply to all fire-controls as does ECM.

[SpikeTheHobbitMage]

you might want to squeeze in some ECCM. I am overall a big fan of larger ships, and in this case, I think that the 25000 ton destroyer (which is by the way huge huge for a destroyer) is best, although I would prefer some tougher shields instead of an 8 layer armour personally.
the good thing about the 8000 ton vessel though, its that you can split the fleet better, and have an easier time keeping your smaller colonies defended.
so unless you are facing very impressive firepower coming from your enemies, you should go with the Karl von somethingsomething

ur mums way huge for a destroyer

Anyways, I think ECCM only applies to missile FC.

No ECCM apply to all fire-controls as does ECM.

ECCM applies to fire controls.  ECM applies to ships.  Both can apply to missiles.

[Jorgen_CAB]

you might want to squeeze in some ECCM. I am overall a big fan of larger ships, and in this case, I think that the 25000 ton destroyer (which is by the way huge huge for a destroyer) is best, although I would prefer some tougher shields instead of an 8 layer armour personally.
the good thing about the 8000 ton vessel though, its that you can split the fleet better, and have an easier time keeping your smaller colonies defended.
so unless you are facing very impressive firepower coming from your enemies, you should go with the Karl von somethingsomething

ur mums way huge for a destroyer

Anyways, I think ECCM only applies to missile FC.

No ECCM apply to all fire-controls as does ECM.

ECCM applies to fire controls.  ECM applies to ships.  Both can apply to missiles.

I obviously meant they all effect fire-controls... 

[SpikeTheHobbitMage]

you might want to squeeze in some ECCM. I am overall a big fan of larger ships, and in this case, I think that the 25000 ton destroyer (which is by the way huge huge for a destroyer) is best, although I would prefer some tougher shields instead of an 8 layer armour personally.
the good thing about the 8000 ton vessel though, its that you can split the fleet better, and have an easier time keeping your smaller colonies defended.
so unless you are facing very impressive firepower coming from your enemies, you should go with the Karl von somethingsomething

ur mums way huge for a destroyer

Anyways, I think ECCM only applies to missile FC.

No ECCM apply to all fire-controls as does ECM.

ECCM applies to fire controls.  ECM applies to ships.  Both can apply to missiles.

I obviously meant they all effect fire-controls... 

When my reading comprehension starts getting this bad, it is time to get off the net.  Cheers.

[liveware]

I'm debating whether my interception beam ships that close with the enemy to soak missiles for bombers and frakk things up should be on the smaller or larger side of things. Basically should they be a frigate or a destroyer.

A larger ship will have more armor, weapons and PD obviously. On the other hand closing with the enemy is dangerous, and I'd rather not lose large, valuable ships, and 4 1 beam frigate is the same as 1 4 beam destroyer, isn't it? Only difference is you only lose one beam if a ship gets destroyed rather than 4.

I have two designs:

Big Beam

Code: [Select]

Karl von Clausewitz class Destroyer (P)      25,000 tons       753 Crew       12,136.5 BP       TCS 500    TH 540    EM 1,500
9000 km/s      Armour 8-76       Shields 50-300       HTK 176      Sensors 24/24/0/0      DCR 60      PPV 155.4
Maint Life 4.09 Years     MSP 9,102    AFR 167%    IFR 2.3%    1YR 873    5YR 13,094    Max Repair 1406.250 MSP
Captain    Control Rating 4   BRG   AUX   ENG   CIC   
Intended Deployment Time: 6 months    Morale Check Required   

Half Magnetic Fusion Drive  EP1125.00 (4)    Power 4500.0    Fuel Use 47.73%    Signature 135.0000    Explosion 15%
Fuel Capacity 5,057,000 Litres    Range 76.3 billion km (98 days at full power)
Xi S50 / R300 Shields (1)     Recharge Time 300 seconds (0.2 per second)

Saeder-Krupp Heavy Industries Series 1 Super MAC (4)    Range 400,000km     TS: 9,000 km/s     Power 75-8    ROF 50       
Quad Rheinmetall AG Gauss Cannon A Mk.1 (10x20)    Range 50,000km     TS: 32000 km/s     Power 0-0     RM 50,000 km    ROF 5       
Renraku Computer Systems MAC Fire Control 480, 8 km/s (1)     Max Range: 480,000 km   TS: 8,000 km/s     98 96 94 92 90 88 85 83 81 79
Wuxing Incorporated Point Defense Fire Control R60-TS32000 (1)     Max Range: 60,000 km   TS: 32,000 km/s     83 67 50 33 17 0 0 0 0 0
Inertial Confinement Fusion Reactor R34-PB100 (1)     Total Power Output 33.7    Exp 50%

Raytheon Point DRADIS AS19-R1 (10%) (1)     GPS 48     Range 19.1m km    MCR 1.7m km    Resolution 1
Raytheon Standard DRADIS AS51-R20 (10%) (1)     GPS 960     Range 52m km    Resolution 20
Boglin Fields, Inc. MilSpec Standard Thermal Sensor Mk.1 (1)     Sensitivity 24     Detect Sig Strength 1000:  38.7m km
Boglin Fields, Inc. MilSpec Standard EM Sensor Mk1. (1)     Sensitivity 24     Detect Sig Strength 1000:  38.7m km

ECM 50

Little Beam

Code: [Select]

Trident class Frigate (P)      8,000 tons       231 Crew       4,405.8 BP       TCS 160    TH 203    EM 0
10547 km/s      Armour 4-35       Shields 0-0       HTK 55      Sensors 24/24/0/0      DCR 33      PPV 35.08
Maint Life 1.39 Years     MSP 1,032    AFR 171%    IFR 2.4%    1YR 577    5YR 8,654    Max Repair 831.3 MSP
Captain    Control Rating 4   BRG   AUX   ENG   CIC   
Intended Deployment Time: 6 months    Morale Check Required   

Quarter Magnetic Fusion Drive  EP562.50 (3)    Power 1687.5    Fuel Use 67.50%    Signature 67.5000    Explosion 15%
Fuel Capacity 1,804,000 Litres    Range 60.1 billion km (65 days at full power)

Saeder-Krupp Heavy Industries Series 1 Super MAC (1)    Range 400,000km     TS: 10,547 km/s     Power 75-8    ROF 50       
Quad Rheinmetall AG Gauss Cannon A Mk.1 (2x20)    Range 50,000km     TS: 32000 km/s     Power 0-0     RM 50,000 km    ROF 5       
Wuxing Incorporated Point Defense Fire Control R60-TS32000 (1)     Max Range: 60,000 km   TS: 32,000 km/s     83 67 50 33 17 0 0 0 0 0
Renraku Computer Systems MAC Fire Control 480, 8 km/s (1)     Max Range: 480,000 km   TS: 8,000 km/s     98 96 94 92 90 88 85 83 81 79
SinoViet Heavy Machinery Micro-Inertial Confinement Fusion Reactor (1)     Total Power Output 8    Exp 50%

Raytheon Standard DRADIS AS51-R20 (10%) (1)     GPS 960     Range 52m km    Resolution 20
Raytheon Micro Point DRADIS AS6-R1 (10%) (1)     GPS 5     Range 6.1m km    MCR 545k km    Resolution 1
Boglin Fields, Inc. MilSpec Standard Thermal Sensor Mk.1 (1)     Sensitivity 24     Detect Sig Strength 1000:  38.7m km
Boglin Fields, Inc. MilSpec Standard EM Sensor Mk1. (1)     Sensitivity 24     Detect Sig Strength 1000:  38.7m km

ECM 50

This design is classed as a Military Vessel for maintenance purposes

EDIT:
I know the tracking speed for the Beam FC is low. I'm working on it.

If you consider 9k km/s to be sufficient speed for your destroyer, you might consider improving the protection of your frigate. Then they would have improved survivability in the event they can't escape their opponent.