First contact with a neutral NPR

[undercovergeek (OP)]

Okey dokey, found what seems to be a quite passive NPR, ive entered the system had a look round with an unarmed scout, found one 14000 ton ship and sent in a survey vessel whos snooping around

ive seen the communications tab on the alien race screen and clicked that which already tells me comms are already initiated - can i boost this in anyway - whos doing the comms?

Do i send a diplomacy ship

TIA

[Garfunkel]

Do send a diplo ship. Commercial engines, no military grade active sensors, park it close enough to the aliens to be able to see their colony or station(s). They will work on the alien's opinion of you. The diplomatic rating you see in-game is your opinion of them - you have no way of knowing what their opinion of you is until they either grant you trade access or they start shooting. They might ask you to leave the system but your diplo ship should be able to overcome the reputation hit from not agreeing to that so it's safe to ignore.

[Ulzgoroth]

Also, if you can find their outer-system presence you can post your diplo ship near a fuel extractor site or something where the aliens hang out but don't have vigorous territorial interests. That should cut back on the damage control.

(Meanwhile, I've been simultaneously pestering mine with stealth ELINT ships that sneak around in their homeworld's orbit taking notes. They get caught occasionally, but only occasionally, and they look fighter-sized because of the cloaking...

[Andrew]

Also, if you can find their outer-system presence you can post your diplo ship near a fuel extractor site or something where the aliens hang out but don't have vigorous territorial interests. That should cut back on the damage control.

NPRs are simpler than that. They only care about the system not parts of it so hanging out around the gas giant , hanging around near the homeworld, surveying the system its all the same. If they have multiple systems having  a diplomat ship hang out in one of their outer systems will work well as they don't care as much. A diplomat ship in the home system should not be disastrous unless they are xenophobic to a high degree and if they are you probably are going to war eventually anyway

[Ulzgoroth]

Also, if you can find their outer-system presence you can post your diplo ship near a fuel extractor site or something where the aliens hang out but don't have vigorous territorial interests. That should cut back on the damage control.

NPRs are simpler than that. They only care about the system not parts of it so hanging out around the gas giant , hanging around near the homeworld, surveying the system its all the same. If they have multiple systems having  a diplomat ship hang out in one of their outer systems will work well as they don't care as much. A diplomat ship in the home system should not be disastrous unless they are xenophobic to a high degree and if they are you probably are going to war eventually anyway

Outer-system wasn't clear, I meant outer systems, not the outer part of systems.

My contact has lots of Sorium extractors in predictable spots outside their actual settled space.

[undercovergeek (OP)]

after 3 years of no comms, i mayyyyyyyy have moved the diplo ship into orbit of a colony

it got 38 missiles to the face

have ruined any chance of peace talks?

how close is close enough without triggering a salvo response?

TIA

[Andrew]

Presuming an actual npr not a spoiler. To provoke them all you have to be is detectable , so getting shot is just a matter of being in range and they have warships for that.  As I said before there is no distinction between a ship in orbit and a ship at the jump point as far as getting you negative diplomacy points as far as I am aware.
In general a diplo ship does not provoke much but still works better if it is not in their home system but in detection range of another ship or colony. However if you had other ships in the system that may have provoked them.

Usually before an NPR fires on you there will be messages demanding you leave the system, if you do not yet understand the language these will be incomprehensible transmissions noted as such in your log. If there were no transmissions and or your log said the aliens were not responding to attempts to communicate particularly if there is no large population you are aware of then probably spoilers

[undercovergeek (OP)]

Presuming an actual npr not a spoiler. To provoke them all you have to be is detectable , so getting shot is just a matter of being in range and they have warships for that.  As I said before there is no distinction between a ship in orbit and a ship at the jump point as far as getting you negative diplomacy points as far as I am aware.
In general a diplo ship does not provoke much but still works better if it is not in their home system but in detection range of another ship or colony. However if you had other ships in the system that may have provoked them.

Usually before an NPR fires on you there will be messages demanding you leave the system, if you do not yet understand the language these will be incomprehensible transmissions noted as such in your log. If there were no transmissions and or your log said the aliens were not responding to attempts to communicate particularly if there is no large population you are aware of then probably spoilers

Ah ok - everything seems to be pointing at your description of spoilers - there is however only one ship above their planet and in the system of many planets they only have one colony

Which leads me to the question I was going to ask next - are there super sneaky ways at getting a peep at the colony to get more info

[Andrew]

You can gain information on planets in several ways. All of these work better if done early with an NPR before hostilities break out as  the problem of being shot at makes all these harder
1) Geosurvey needs a ship or drone with geosurvey sensors in orbit for a long time. Not going to happen until after you destroy the ships and any STO on the planet
2) Passive EM and thermal sensors. A real NPR will have a thermal and EM Signature of thousands you can pick that up from a long way away with passive sensors. Gives you an estimate of population and industry compare to your homeworld. Big sensors a long way away or small sensors closer and outside their missile range. On a ship faster than theirs. Spoilers may have a very small EM/thermal signature of 5-10 totally not worth trying to spot that it tells you nothing
3) Scan with resolution 1 active sensors will give you an estimate of the amount of ground forces , it will be low as dug in troops look smaller. You will not identify what percentage are STO's until they open fire.  Getting this without coming within weapons range of the defenders is hard but a big enough resolution 1 sensor could do it. But better to win the space battle before worrying about the ground battle

With a real npr ELINT Modules on a diplomacy ship or small scoutship within range of the planetary population EM signature can slowly give you information

[Steve Walmsley]

With regard to Diplomatic ships, an NPR will allow them into their home system if that is their only system. Otherwise, they will be upset by Diplomatic ships in any of their 'Core' systems, which is their home system plus any other heavily populated systems.

[Droll]

With regard to Diplomatic ships, an NPR will allow them into their home system if that is their only system. Otherwise, they will be upset by Diplomatic ships in any of their 'Core' systems, which is their home system plus any other heavily populated systems.

I'll admit this has always been counterintuitive for me. Usually when you set up an embassy it's supposed to be in the capital on account of the government being seated there.

[nuclearslurpee]

With regard to Diplomatic ships, an NPR will allow them into their home system if that is their only system. Otherwise, they will be upset by Diplomatic ships in any of their 'Core' systems, which is their home system plus any other heavily populated systems.

I'll admit this has always been counterintuitive for me. Usually when you set up an embassy it's supposed to be in the capital on account of the government being seated there.

I guess the idea is to make it a bit harder for players to pull off classic exploits like diplo-ship-with-ELINT-module shenanigans on the NPRs.

[Ush213]

Iv never actually got to the point of trading with NPR. Usually I'm like Frank Reynolds and just start blasting when i see them.
Is there much benefit to setting up trade and alliances? How does territory work with an neutral NPR. I always find that they don't respect my warnings to leave the system and it end up in a challenge race to get enough infrastructure in a system.

It it worth it to ally with them and what is a good approach to claiming fringe/border systems.

[Garfunkel]

Unless the system is something they consider extremely important, they will leave as long as your claim is serious enough. So, you need ships and a colony and the aliens need to see them. Trading brings in wealth and you might learn about new systems that you have not discovered yet as your civilians go there to trade. I have never gotten the further treaties so I don't know how useful they are.

[Steve Walmsley]

The later treaties will give you geo and grav data and eventually research data.