Author Topic: Crusade - Comments Thread  (Read 44670 times)

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Offline Bremen

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Re: Crusade - Comments Thread
« Reply #225 on: January 07, 2020, 02:41:22 PM »
My first thought was I didn't like it - the idea of an expanding area that would damage ships and planets struck me as unfun because it wouldn't have a counter. The pylon idea does help with that, particularly if having a pylon on a planet (or maybe ship) would "push back" the rift, thus providing a way to keep it from irradiating your colony if it happened to open in the system, even if you could destroy the individual invasions.

To be honest even with the change it strikes me as very similar to the current form of the invaders, with the only real difference being substituting the rift for the stable wormholes.
 

Offline Hazard

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Re: Crusade - Comments Thread
« Reply #226 on: January 07, 2020, 06:19:32 PM »
I don't like the idea of having to look for and find all the needed pylons to close down the primary rift and then just have that happen no matter what. I'd rather have the pylons be a found ruin installation or ground force component that after finding you can research and replicate yourself, if not easily. A pylon would also be a structure that would need (X) amount of people to work or a Static unit not unlike STO weapons, but when it works it degrades any rifts in the system and prevents the formation of new ones. This would mean that it must be impossible for rifts to form in systems with no planetary bodies though.

The Ruinous Powers rift beings can send forces to destroy the pylon though, it just lets you avoid having to station a full blown warfleet in every system in your borders just in case a rift forms there. Rifts could still contaminate bodies in a system though and invest ground defenses in them, so that getting that pylon in place and operational for long enough to close a rift and prevent the enemy from destroying it is something that requires actual effort. To prevent the game from slowing down as it has to handle every body in the rift zone with their own planetary defense force stationed there, it'd probably be best to have them spawn when the rift achieves a certain strength and non-rift being forces are on planet, and despawn if they're the only thing left.

Closing down the primary rift would require more time and forces as the rift beings defend it more thoroughly, and I'd say that the rift beings can also cheat the normal pathing system. They can use the rifts to jump from a secondary rift to the primary rift, and from the primary rift to any secondary rift. Given how much Aurora depends on the jump point mechanics, that's some pretty potent boost.
 

Offline Bughunter

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Re: Crusade - Comments Thread
« Reply #227 on: January 08, 2020, 02:10:07 AM »
The interesting thing with being forced to explore is all the other spoilers you can trigger on the way creating this nice situation with multiple threats from different directions we all love.. at least to read about in AAR:s. I also think it is a nice touch if you need to "master" as many aspects of the game as possible to win if playing with the endgame spoilers. Otherwise I agree that if the pylons can be destroyed there should probably be a way to rebuild them also given enough tech and resources. Maybe they just go back to ruin status but are not completely destroyed? And yes requiring workers sounds good. Maybe you need research labs on a pylon planet to do pylon related research?
 

Offline Steve Walmsley (OP)

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Re: Crusade - Comments Thread
« Reply #228 on: January 08, 2020, 04:46:01 AM »
If I implement this the number of rifts would be very small; in many games maybe just one, but occasionally two or three. There wouldn't be a limit on the number of Pylons because there is no limit on the number of systems, so you could find more if one was destroyed.

All of this would be optional, so you could play without any rifts. I would probably leave the pylons in either way so you could activate the threat later.
 

Offline JustAnotherDude

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Re: Crusade - Comments Thread
« Reply #229 on: January 08, 2020, 09:51:13 AM »
Maybe a reward for beating them, as well? Perhaps a massive set of ruins, or a new tech, or something of that nature? You could have something spawn at the epicenter of the rift.
 

Offline Steve Walmsley (OP)

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Re: Crusade - Comments Thread
« Reply #230 on: January 09, 2020, 03:22:56 AM »
I've given this some more thought. The below is where I am heading at the moment.

I'll probably start Rifts at ten million kilometers (subject to play test) with a % rate of expansion (TBD).

I'll rename anomalies as Ancient Constructs (Pylon equivalent). Each one will start as a 'Dormant Ancient Construct'.

Once a Xenology formation has researched them (which will require a fixed but significant amount of research), they will become active and gain the same base function as in VB6, boosting research for a given field on that same body by a fixed amount between 20% and 100%.

In addition, they will add 10% of that bonus to all research in the field anywhere in the Empire. So an Active Ancient Construct with 50% Propulsion, will add an Empire Bonus of 5% to all propulsion research. Ancient Constructs can be destroyed, although I haven't decided on the method yet.

The total Empire Bonus for all Ancient Constructs combined will be deducted from the growth rate of all Aether Rifts. So if you have 30% total Empire Bonus from various Ancient Constructs, then the Rifts will expand 30% slower than normal. Once you pass 100%, the Rifts will begin to shrink at the annual rate of Empire Bonus - 100%. Once they fall below the starting size (probably 10m km), they will collapse and vanish.

The size of the invasion force that comes through the rifts at random intervals (years apart) will depend on rift size and the technology will depend on time passed.
 
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Offline Rabid_Cog

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Re: Crusade - Comments Thread
« Reply #231 on: January 09, 2020, 03:39:12 AM »
Perhaps make it so they can be destroyed/damaged in all the normal ways? Orbital bombardment and collateral damage from ground warfare, but with high toughness.

Also, make it so that the rifts don't completely vanish, they are just set to 'inactive' at a certain minimum size. If you ever drop below 100% bonus again, they start growing again. You can never "defeat" the rifts, you can just hold them back for a while...
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Offline MarcAFK

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Re: Crusade - Comments Thread
« Reply #232 on: January 09, 2020, 06:29:12 AM »
I second that they should be inactivated rather than completely destroyed.
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Offline Zincat

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Re: Crusade - Comments Thread
« Reply #233 on: January 09, 2020, 07:33:33 AM »
Honestly, I like the invaders as they are. I would be fine with this new end-game enemy if it was an additional enemy, compared to the galactic invaders.

About the mechanism in question of this "rift invasion", I don't like that you're completely relying on luck to find the pylons. I've seen games where I saw ONE ruin with in over 100 systems... I would not be averse to it if precursor ruins are either more common, or can be made more common.

I've hoped for a start-game box to choose how common spoilers are for a long time... Let me cranck it all up and have abundnt swarms and precursors! As said, I want a galaxy full of bad things...
 
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Offline Bughunter

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Re: Crusade - Comments Thread
« Reply #234 on: January 09, 2020, 10:59:25 AM »
How does this work with multiple empires all sitting on some pylons? Does the rate apply to rifts in that empires systems only? Best rate for any empire?
 

Offline Steve Walmsley (OP)

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Re: Crusade - Comments Thread
« Reply #235 on: January 09, 2020, 11:25:47 AM »
How does this work with multiple empires all sitting on some pylons? Does the rate apply to rifts in that empires systems only? Best rate for any empire?

The most interesting option is probably for each Empire to decide whether to add its rate to an overall number. Still thinking through this :)
 

Offline Garfunkel

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Re: Crusade - Comments Thread
« Reply #236 on: January 09, 2020, 02:17:29 PM »
Might be easier to both code and for players to track/understand if they just automatically stack regardless of the owner.
 

Offline Zincat

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Re: Crusade - Comments Thread
« Reply #237 on: January 11, 2020, 09:51:48 AM »
I am curious about the refitted OWP. What are you planning to use them for? Defending Terra?

I mean, they don't look bad or anything, but considering the high tech components you also had the opportunity of scrapping the ship for tech. Up to this point you did not have THAT much use for OWPs after all.  Did you determine that to be not worth it? 

Or was it also a roleplay thing? (Which I would TOTALLY approve of. In c# Aurora I'm going to be boarding like there's no tomorrow :) )

The Jackal class Destroyer Escort is a much more clearcut case. Its Gauss cannons would prove an immediate, significant boost to antimissiles capabilities of any imperial fleet, so I would never scrap it for components.
« Last Edit: January 11, 2020, 10:07:25 AM by Zincat »
 

Offline Steve Walmsley (OP)

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Re: Crusade - Comments Thread
« Reply #238 on: January 11, 2020, 10:15:36 AM »
I am curious about the refitted OWP. What are you planning to use them for? Defending Terra?

I mean, they don't look bad or anything, but considering the high tech components you also had the opportunity of scrapping the ship for tech. Up to this point you did not have THAT much use for OWPs after all.  Did you determine that to be not worth it? 

Or was it also a roleplay thing? (Which I would TOTALLY approve of. In c# Aurora I'm going to be boarding like there's no tomorrow :) )

The Jackal class Destroyer Escort is a much more clearcut case. Its Gauss cannons would prove an immediate, significant boost to antimissiles capabilities of any imperial fleet, so I would never scrap it for components.

It was primarily role play, as I now have four former Necron ships in the Imperial Navy. However, there wasn't that much tech to gain from scrapping it, apart from faster missile launch tech, so I thought keeping the ship would help more. With a pair of these in Terra orbit, it frees up more mobile forces.
 

Offline Kristover

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Re: Crusade - Comments Thread
« Reply #239 on: January 11, 2020, 06:14:33 PM »
Question:  I might have missed it earlier but are the Tyrranids and Necrons the stand-in names for the spoilers?  Are there other NPRs out there doing their thing?