Author Topic: Skeleton Ship Designs/Dual Tooling  (Read 2030 times)

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Offline wobbly (OP)

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Skeleton Ship Designs/Dual Tooling
« on: July 18, 2013, 01:34:24 PM »
What ships do people generally dual-tool a shipyard for?
The obvious one is colony/freight & I'll generally dual-tool a shipyard for geo & grav by designing a ship with both & ripping 1 out at build time.  I'm currently wondering about tooling a geo/grav/scout shipyard by designing a skeleton ship loaded with all sensor types & removing them on the respective builds but am wondering if you just end up with ships that are poorly optimized for all 3.
 

Offline joeclark77

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Re: Skeleton Ship Designs/Dual Tooling
« Reply #1 on: July 18, 2013, 01:50:46 PM »
Quote
dual-tool a shipyard for geo & grav by designing a ship with both & ripping 1 out at build time
THANK YOU! I've been trying and trying to figure out how I could make grav and geo ships at the same shipyard!  Sorry I have no answer to your question though.
 

Offline Paul M

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Re: Skeleton Ship Designs/Dual Tooling
« Reply #2 on: July 19, 2013, 12:14:41 AM »
You have to check the design to see if setting the shipyard for one or another of the designs allows for the other to be built.  My frigates are designed to allow for one design to be used as the main one (that the shipyard is set to build) while allowing for the other ships to be built.

You can't change the design after you set the yard to build it without retooling the yard so far as I am aware.  So you can't add or subtract to a design as you suggest. 
 

Offline wobbly (OP)

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Re: Skeleton Ship Designs/Dual Tooling
« Reply #3 on: July 19, 2013, 01:31:57 AM »
I might not have explained what I meant entirely clearly.  You can design a ship with geo & grav sensors then tool the shipyard.  If you then hit copy design & remove say the grav sensors, you have a grav-ship buildable at that shipyard, this is what I meant by "ripping 1 out at build time".  Anyway I've played around a bit more & found I can build a geo/grav/scout shipyard but probably only because I'm building cheap expendable scouts instead of decent ones.  I'm trying to work out if there's anything decent for colliers, tankers or troop ships.  I tried to design a collier from a destroyer with the weapon systems removed & extra magazines but can't seem to get a build-able design that way.
 

Offline Paul M

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Re: Skeleton Ship Designs/Dual Tooling
« Reply #4 on: July 19, 2013, 02:01:54 AM »
It is only buildable at the ship yard if the cost of the new ship is within 20% of the cost of the original ship.  My point is that what you describe is not always going to work.  I can also just design two ships for geo and grav work right from the get go and fiddle with them till the other shows up in the "buildable" window.

My troop transports (TT Ceylon) I managed to get co-buildable with the FFH Wounded Knee class of frigates so it should be possible.

Colliers likely not because weapons cost a lot and magazines/fuel storage do not, so ripping out weapons is likely to result in a ship with a cost difference over 20%.
 

Offline wobbly (OP)

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Re: Skeleton Ship Designs/Dual Tooling
« Reply #5 on: July 19, 2013, 02:52:33 AM »
Quote from: Paul M link=topic=6323. msg64336#msg64336 date=1374217314
I can also just design two ships for geo and grav work right from the get go and fiddle with them till the other shows up in the "buildable" window.
Not if you want the build cost under 600 (Its 100 bp difference to add a geo scanner & another 20 to remove a grav scanner & vis-versa).  If you want to fit it with 2 geo or grav scanners you'll need to build 1200 pt ships that way.  Mine are round 450, I doubt my shipyards are actually big enough to build 1200 pt versions especially seeing as they'd need bigger jump-engines.

I'll take a look at your frigate & troop ship.  I have a shipyard already building frigates so possibly I can get a workable design there.
 

Offline Stardust

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Re: Skeleton Ship Designs/Dual Tooling
« Reply #6 on: July 19, 2013, 06:57:26 AM »
In my current campaign, I've tooled a shipyard that's capable of building freighters, colony ships, and troop transports.  Tooling the yard for the freighter or troop transport wouldn't work.  Tooling for the colony ship was the key.

In the class design screen, there is a tab that shows what other classes can be built in a yard tooled for the selected class.
 

Offline sloanjh

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Re: Skeleton Ship Designs/Dual Tooling
« Reply #7 on: July 19, 2013, 08:42:51 AM »
if the cost of the new ship is within 20% of the cost of the original ship. 

IIRC, it's the refit cost (from the tooled design to the design to be built) that matters, not the cost difference.

John
 

Offline Bgreman

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Re: Skeleton Ship Designs/Dual Tooling
« Reply #8 on: July 19, 2013, 12:49:00 PM »
IIRC, it's the refit cost (from the tooled design to the design to be built) that matters, not the cost difference.

John

Confirmed, this is correct.  In order for a ship of class B to be built at a yard tooled for class A, the refit cost to go from A -> B must be less than or equal to 20% of the total cost of class A.
 

Offline Paul M

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Re: Skeleton Ship Designs/Dual Tooling
« Reply #9 on: July 20, 2013, 08:18:46 AM »
That was what I meant but clearly not what I wrote...
 

Offline sloanjh

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Re: Skeleton Ship Designs/Dual Tooling
« Reply #10 on: July 20, 2013, 09:59:34 AM »
That was what I meant but clearly not what I wrote...

LOL - Hate it when that happens :)

John
« Last Edit: July 20, 2013, 10:01:39 AM by sloanjh »
 

Offline wobbly (OP)

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Re: Skeleton Ship Designs/Dual Tooling
« Reply #11 on: July 20, 2013, 12:05:41 PM »
Quote from: Paul M link=topic=6323. msg64347#msg64347 date=1374326326
That was what I meant but clearly not what I wrote. . .
Not to worry I got what you meant & actually had to re-read the post to see why it was being clarified. 
It's the refit cost shown in the DAC/Rank/Info tab & is the cost of any new components added + (cost of old components removed)/5 for same size vessels(about +7. 5 for each extra hs or +2. 5 for removing hull space from what I can tell).  It's funny the number of times twiddling the deployment time by . 1 or so to get the cabin spaces to match up has made all the difference for me.