Author Topic: Irrelevant research  (Read 1185 times)

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Offline Silvarelion (OP)

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Irrelevant research
« on: May 16, 2017, 12:36:27 PM »
Hey guys. Just wondering what everyone considers irrelevant research. I know the Missile Tracking tech line is bugged and so unusable.

@Iranon also mentioned that logistics techs (I'm assuming that's the increased fuel production line) might also be irrelevant in the next update. What others are there?
Mistake Not My Current State Of Joshing Gentle Peevishness For The Awesome And Terrible Majesty Of The Towering Seas Of Ire That Are Themselves The Mere Milquetoast Shallows Fringing My Vast Oceans Of Wrath.
  ~The Mistake Not, Hydrogen Sonata, Iain Banks
 

Iranon

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Re: Irrelevant research
« Reply #1 on: May 16, 2017, 02:00:56 PM »
Many techs aren't irrelevant, but do so little that they are only worth picking up when they are very cheap compared to the current levels of bread-and-butter techs. Most egregrious example imo would be reactor power multipliers. Even in pure beam ships, the weight savings are quite modest and there's the trade-off of higher explosion chance.
Less severe, but Sensor Strength should trail Sensitivity (comparable increase in range, but results in more expensive and noisier sensors and no use for passives).
AFAIK, Electronic Hardening isn't useful against current AI designs.

Some techs are optional and only worth using if you use enough. Good armour > bad shields, unless you know exactly what you are doing. ECM/ECCM tech may need a little love before the components are worth their weight (overengineered fire controls > underdeveloped ECCM). You generally don't need redundant beam techs, some individual lines there stand out too: imo railgun calibre quickly stops being worth researching, too throttled by capacitor tech. Currently, something similar applies to particle beams but Lances will change that. Some Missile Launcher and Magazine techs are not very important if you decide to rely on box launchers instead. The entire genetics line can be ignored most of the time, especially the aspects that can be remedied by terraforming.
Some things have their use, but are easy to misuse. Stealth tech on offensive ships is usually wasteful, just split the package on FACs/Fighters. Huge sensors can't be split up on multiple ships though, so while expensive stealth tech does give a relevant option for high-end recon ships.

One example where I've often seen poor prioritising is in power multiplier or fuel efficiency vs. engine concept.
Higher engine concept may give better power than maximum power multiplier tech, without the drawback of increased fuel consumption.
Higher engine concept and correspondingly lower multiplier may save more fuel than better fuel efficiency tech, and in the case of <1.0 multiplier will result in cheaper and less manpower-intensive engines as well.

Increased fuel production generally scales worse than measures to limit fuel consumption; in the upcoming version we have 2 additional logistics tech to exacerbate this one of which directly goes into this: reducing fuel consumption by 20% is much better than increasing fuel production and refueling rate by 25% - you need less weight in fuel tanks and consume less Sorium.
« Last Edit: May 16, 2017, 02:06:08 PM by Iranon »
 
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Offline Silvarelion (OP)

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Re: Irrelevant research
« Reply #2 on: May 16, 2017, 03:22:10 PM »
OK, that all makes sense. Looks like I'll be thinking my research priorities again :P

While I've got you in the thread @Iranon, you mentioned in a Reddit post that balanced fleets aren't all that efficient. Just wondering what you mean by that.
Mistake Not My Current State Of Joshing Gentle Peevishness For The Awesome And Terrible Majesty Of The Towering Seas Of Ire That Are Themselves The Mere Milquetoast Shallows Fringing My Vast Oceans Of Wrath.
  ~The Mistake Not, Hydrogen Sonata, Iain Banks
 

Offline Michael Sandy

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Re: Irrelevant research
« Reply #3 on: May 16, 2017, 05:11:24 PM »
"Efficient" means able to do its job for the least cost.  But that isn't what a balanced fleet is FOR.  A balanced fleet is able to do all the jobs.  An 'efficient' fire department has the lowest number of firefighters needed to deal with the bulk of emergencies.  But that 'efficiency' means it may not handle a peak load well.

A balanced fleet will always have some ships along that are just consuming fuel and maintenance and not doing anything.  Maybe it is the missile ships that can't get through the PD, or maybe it is the beam kiting warships which do not dare approach into short range missile envelope.

An 'efficient' fleet is often a fleet that is purpose built to counter a known enemy.  Just fast enough, with just enough beam range to out duel the enemy.  Or just enough ammo to destroy their known ships.  But versus an unknown enemy, you can't count on 'efficiency'.  You need to be able to cover all the bases.

I could have a relatively slow main fleet, whose job is to pull the teeth of an enemy missile fleet, allowing the beam kiters to do their job afterwards.  Or it might be the beam kiters that go in first, taking out the enemy fighters and LACs, and allowing the plodders to come in range of the mother ship and blow through its defenses at range.