Beam Fighter designs in the new era

[TheDeadlyShoe (OP)]

I was playing around with beam fighter designs and found myself somewhat indecisive on which to use.   The doctrine I'm looking at is to use beam fighters as missile defence and, when opportunity allows, in the strike role.  This both worked out better and worse than I expected.

My first two designs:

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Warrior class Striker    320 tons     3 Crew     82 BP      TCS 6.4  TH 24  EM 0
7500 km/s     Armour 2-4     Shields 0-0     Sensors 1/1/0/0     Damage Control Rating 0     PPV 2
Maint Life 7.03 Years     MSP 16    AFR 8%    IFR 0.1%    1YR 1    5YR 9    Max Repair 18 MSP
Intended Deployment Time: 0.1 months    Spare Berths 7   

Type 11 Thruster (2)    Power 24    Fuel Use 392.02%    Signature 12    Exp 20%
Fuel Capacity 10,000 Litres    Range 1.4 billion km   (53 hours at full power)

Gladius UV Pulse (1)    Range 72,000km     TS: 7500 km/s     Power 3-0.75     RM 4    ROF 20        3 3 3 3 2 2 1 0 0 0
Type 57 Strike Targeter (1)    Max Range: 72,000 km   TS: 8000 km/s     86 72 58 44 31 17 3 0 0 0
Micro GCF (2)     Total Power Output 1.03    Armour 0    Exp 12%

Q-Slave Targeter  (1)     GPS 8     Range 280k km    Resolution 5

This design is classed as a Fighter for production, combat and maintenance purposes

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Grendel class Striker    480 tons     3 Crew     101.2 BP      TCS 9.6  TH 24  EM 0
5000 km/s     Armour 2-5     Shields 0-0     Sensors 1/1/0/0     Damage Control Rating 0     PPV 4.3
Maint Life 3.63 Years     MSP 13    AFR 18%    IFR 0.3%    1YR 2    5YR 23    Max Repair 19 MSP
Intended Deployment Time: 0.1 months    Spare Berths 7   
Magazine 10   

Type 11 Thruster (2)    Power 24    Fuel Use 392.02%    Signature 12    Exp 20%
Fuel Capacity 5,000 Litres    Range 0.5 billion km   (26 hours at full power)

Gladius UV Pulse Turret (1x1)    Range 48,000km     TS: 16000 km/s     Power 3-1     RM 4    ROF 15        3 3 3 3 0 0 0 0 0 0
Type 59 Defense Targeter (1)    Max Range: 48,000 km   TS: 16000 km/s     79 58 38 17 0 0 0 0 0 0
Micro GCF (2)     Total Power Output 1.03    Armour 0    Exp 12%

Torpedo Rail (2)    Missile Size 5    Hangar Reload 37.5 minutes    MF Reload 6.2 hours
Type 65 Torpedo Guidance (1)     Range 10.3m km    Resolution 80
T-25 (2)  Speed: 28,800 km/s   End: 6.1m    Range: 10.6m km   WH: 9    Size: 5    TH: 105/63/31

Q-Slave Targeter  (1)     GPS 8     Range 280k km    Resolution 5The combat environment is expected to be relatively short ranged, perhaps even as short as between the Earth and Luna.  But I was always unhappy with the Warrior, it doesn't really do anything well.  About its only upside is fitting two layers of armor.  The Grendel does both missile defence AND strike better.

So I came up with two alternates - the 'Tie Fighter', going for bang for the buck, and the 'Tie Interceptor', attempting to leverage the fighter's speed advantage.

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Warrior - Defence Fighter class Striker    300 tons     3 Crew     67 BP      TCS 6  TH 12  EM 0
4000 km/s     Armour 1-3     Shields 0-0     Sensors 1/1/0/0     Damage Control Rating 0     PPV 2.8
Maint Life 6.51 Years     MSP 14    AFR 7%    IFR 0.1%    1YR 1    5YR 9    Max Repair 19 MSP
Intended Deployment Time: 0.1 months    Spare Berths 7   

Type 11 Thruster (1)    Power 24    Fuel Use 392.02%    Signature 12    Exp 20%
Fuel Capacity 10,000 Litres    Range 1.5 billion km   (4 days at full power)

Gladius UV Pulse Turret (1x1)    Range 48,000km     TS: 16000 km/s     Power 3-1     RM 4    ROF 15        3 3 3 3 0 0 0 0 0 0
Type 59 Defense Targeter (1)    Max Range: 48,000 km   TS: 16000 km/s     79 58 38 17 0 0 0 0 0 0
Micro GCF (2)     Total Power Output 1.03    Armour 0    Exp 12%

Q-Slave Targeter  (1)     GPS 8     Range 280k km    Resolution 5

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Warrior Interceptor class Striker    400 tons     3 Crew     112.8 BP      TCS 8  TH 48  EM 0
12000 km/s     Armour 1-4     Shields 0-0     Sensors 1/1/0/0     Damage Control Rating 0     PPV 2
Maint Life 0 Years     MSP 0    AFR 80%    IFR 1.1%    1YR 9    5YR 131    Max Repair 18 MSP
Intended Deployment Time: 0.1 months    Spare Berths 7   

Type 11 Thruster (4)    Power 24    Fuel Use 392.02%    Signature 12    Exp 20%
Fuel Capacity 5,000 Litres    Range 0.6 billion km   (13 hours at full power)

Gladius UV Pulse (1)    Range 48,000km     TS: 12000 km/s     Power 3-0.75     RM 4    ROF 20        3 3 3 3 0 0 0 0 0 0
Type 59 Defense Targeter (1)    Max Range: 48,000 km   TS: 16000 km/s     79 58 38 17 0 0 0 0 0 0
Micro GCF (2)     Total Power Output 1.03    Armour 0    Exp 12%
I want to use the 'Interceptor' variant, but I'm leery of its lack of bells & whistles such as engineering or a sensor.   Love the speed though, for Ion tech it's fantastic.

I also noted a quirk when designing these, the Turret bumps the capacitor recharge of the miniaturized 10cm laser from 0.75 to 1, lowering its ROF to 15.  Useful, especially considering I have to mount 2 power generators anyway.

After designing those I tried my hand at a Grendel more purely focused on the strike role.

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Grendel - Bomber class Striker    480 tons     3 Crew     99.2 BP      TCS 9.6  TH 24  EM 0
5000 km/s     Armour 2-5     Shields 0-0     Sensors 1/1/0/0     Damage Control Rating 0     PPV 4.5
Maint Life 3.93 Years     MSP 13    AFR 18%    IFR 0.3%    1YR 1    5YR 20    Max Repair 18 MSP
Intended Deployment Time: 0.1 months    Spare Berths 7   
Magazine 10   

Type 11 Thruster (2)    Power 24    Fuel Use 392.02%    Signature 12    Exp 20%
Fuel Capacity 15,000 Litres    Range 1.4 billion km   (3 days at full power)

Hastae UV Micro-Pulse (1)    Range 72,000km     TS: 5000 km/s     Power 10-0.15     RM 4    ROF 335        10 10 10 10 8 6 5 0 0 0
Type 57 Strike Targeter (1)    Max Range: 72,000 km   TS: 8000 km/s     86 72 58 44 31 17 3 0 0 0
Micro GCF (1)     Total Power Output 0.52    Armour 0    Exp 12%

Torpedo Rail (2)    Missile Size 5    Hangar Reload 37.5 minutes    MF Reload 6.2 hours
Type 65 Torpedo Guidance (1)     Range 10.3m km    Resolution 80
T-25 (2)  Speed: 28,800 km/s   End: 6.1m    Range: 10.6m km   WH: 9    Size: 5    TH: 105/63/31

Q-Slave Targeter  (1)     GPS 8     Range 280k km    Resolution 5Impressive damage potential, but the single-purpose nature of the design bothers me.

[dgibso29]

I've personally never used beam fighters, though I do intend to utilize them soon.

My current strike fighter is this:

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F-48 Sparrow class Fighter    250 tons     3 Crew     185.2 BP      TCS 5  TH 7.68  EM 0
19200 km/s     Armour 1-3     Shields 0-0     Sensors 1/1/0/0     Damage Control Rating 0     PPV 3
Maint Life 0 Years     MSP 0    AFR 50%    IFR 0.7%    1YR 9    5YR 133    Max Repair 132 MSP
Intended Deployment Time: 1 months    Spare Berths 2   
Magazine 20   

Volksmacht ICFD High-Performance Fighter Drive 96P-8S  (1)    Power 96    Fuel Use 385.82%    Signature 7.68    Exp 30%
Fuel Capacity 30,000 Litres    Range 5.6 billion km   (3 days at full power)

External Ordnance Rack (CAM) (5)    Missile Size 4    Hangar Reload 30 minutes    MF Reload 5 hours
Lockheed Martin AAQ-48 CAM Guidance Package (1)     Range 25.7m km    Resolution 20
Slammer CAM Mk. 3 (5)  Speed: 48,000 km/s   End: 7.3m    Range: 21.2m km   WH: 30    Size: 4    TH: 320/192/96
Each squadron led by a command variant with active sensors and a slightly reduced payload.

[dgibso29]

Hey look I designed a beam fighter:

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F-71 Thrasher class Interceptor    400 tons     11 Crew     961.2 BP      TCS 8  TH 15.36  EM 0
24000 km/s     Armour 1-4     Shields 0-0     Sensors 1/1/0/0     Damage Control Rating 0     PPV 3
Maint Life 3.49 Years     MSP 150    AFR 12%    IFR 0.2%    1YR 19    5YR 283    Max Repair 525 MSP
Intended Deployment Time: 0.5 months    Spare Berths 1   

Volksmacht ICFD High-Performance Fighter Drive 96P-8S  (2)    Power 96    Fuel Use 385.82%    Signature 7.68    Exp 30%
Fuel Capacity 15,000 Litres    Range 1.7 billion km   (20 hours at full power)

15cm C2.5 Far X-Ray Laser (1)    Range 480,000km     TS: 24000 km/s     Power 6-2.5     RM 8    ROF 15        6 6 6 6 6 6 6 6 5 4
Lockheed-Martin Laser Targeting Suite 350-10000 (FTR) (1)    Max Range: 700,000 km   TS: 40000 km/s     99 97 96 94 93 91 90 89 87 86
Westinghouse Solid-Core AM Fighter Powerpland PO4.8-S10 (1)     Total Power Output 4.8    Armour 0    Exp 35%

Meant to operate with a command variant with active sensors.

[Nightstar]

960 BP fighter. XD

As a rule, I wouldn't spend that much on something so easily smacked down by a few AMMs. And if you build it anyway, at that price you might as well double the engines. I'm also thinking your tech is a little beyond what he can use.

[dgibso29]

No one said early game!  And at any rate, by the time you've got those tech levels, that bp isn't as big of an issue. At least not in my experience. I kept it at 400t for space reasons. Meshes better with my other strikecraft - I like to have a mix of squadrons onboard my larger carriers.

[Vynadan]

I haven't actually designed fighter engines under the new rules yet, but for Ion tech those look pretty good.

With the latter two Warrior alternatives, the defence variant seems better suited both for defense and offense. Higher TS, RoF and lower BP make it more economic than the interceptor - it might be only one third as fast, but that won't matter for closing in between Earth and Luna, and for each interceptor you can build two defender.

As for the single-purpose Grendel: With a size 5 launcher designing a S5 carrier missile for 2-4 size 1 AMMs might be feasable, depending on their range and your exact missile technology. Given the MFC you could fire two AMM carriers from each Grendel, 1-2 Grendel per enemy missile salvo, as long as you detect the missiles early enough for the submunitions to seperate.

[SteelChicken]

I haven't had much luck using beam fighters.  They basically get mauled by AMM's before they can do anything, unless you are talking jump point defense, in which case hangar space would be better served with weapons.   I find that I don't even really use missile fighters too much anymore, unless I want to send them off on another vector away from my main fleet.  The equivalent ship-tonnage in missile armed ships is much more useful.

How do you guys close the range and survive? Is it more a RP for fun thing?

Now if aurora had some sort of mechanic where you "jumped out of hyperspace" instead of slowly closing distance over days, these would be ALOT more fun.

[Anarade Relle]

One way is try to time your fighter-approach so their AMM's are aimed at your missiles rather then your fighters.

[Bremen]

One way is try to time your fighter-approach so their AMM's are aimed at your missiles rather then your fighters.

Now that fighter speed isn't based on designing the tiniest fighters possible, I've also found a great way to protect them from AMMs is to give them actual armor.

[HartLord]

Here's the fastest I've gotten something on Ion tech while still having a gun (this was thrown together for fun):

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Fast class Interceptor    500 tons     18 Crew     171.6 BP      TCS 10  TH 58.8  EM 0
16800 km/s     Armour 1-5     Shields 0-0     Sensors 1/1/0/0     Damage Control Rating 0     PPV 0.5
Maint Life 3.84 Years     MSP 21    AFR 20%    IFR 0.3%    1YR 2    5YR 34    Max Repair 21 MSP
Intended Deployment Time: 2.5 months    Spare Berths 0    

24 EP Ion Drive (7)    Power 24    Fuel Use 448.03%    Signature 8.4    Exp 20%
Fuel Capacity 10,000 Litres    Range 0.8 billion km   (13 hours at full power)

Gauss Cannon R3-8 (1x3)    Range 30,000km     TS: 16800 km/s     Accuracy Modifier 8%     RM 3    ROF 5        1 1 1 0 0 0 0 0 0 0
Fire Control S01 16-3000 (FTR) (1)    Max Range: 32,000 km   TS: 12000 km/s     69 37 6 0 0 0 0 0 0 0

This design is classed as a Fighter for production, combat and maintenance purposes
On a related note, here's my preferred parasite-ship size, this one featuring my tiny gauss guns:

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M1 Shell class Frigate Escort    3,000 tons     108 Crew     862.8 BP      TCS 60  TH 252  EM 0
12000 km/s     Armour 2-18     Shields 0-0     Sensors 1/1/0/0     Damage Control Rating 1     PPV 13
Maint Life 1.83 Years     MSP 180    AFR 72%    IFR 1%    1YR 67    5YR 1012    Max Repair 210 MSP
Intended Deployment Time: 1 months    Spare Berths 2    

240 EP Ion Drive (3)    Power 240    Fuel Use 407.3%    Signature 84    Exp 20%
Fuel Capacity 110,000 Litres    Range 1.6 billion km   (37 hours at full power)

Gauss Cannon R3-8 (26x3)    Range 30,000km     TS: 12000 km/s     Accuracy Modifier 8%     RM 3    ROF 5        1 1 1 0 0 0 0 0 0 0
Fire Control S04 16-12000 (1)    Max Range: 32,000 km   TS: 12000 km/s     69 37 6 0 0 0 0 0 0 0

Active Search Sensor MR1-R1 (1)     GPS 24     Range 1.9m km    Resolution 1

This design is classed as a Military Vessel for maintenance purposes


[Vynadan]

@HartLord: Is there any reason for the fighter to have 2.5 months of intended deployment time? The lower it is, the more crew quarters space you free up after all, and if you go below 0.5 you half all requirements - that might just be enough to free up a little more space and slap on a layer of armour or make it a little faster.

For ion tech though, those things are pretty damn fast

[HartLord]

It has 2. 5 months because I was just messing around with it.    I don't think the extra armor would do any good because this design is not intended to be shot at. . .  

Edit: my frigate now properly says it has tiny guns, not turrets; the turrets are on less fast ships. 

[TheDeadlyShoe (OP)]

There's no effective way to protect against AMMs, it is the same conundrum that faces every beam warship.  You have to attack the enemy with missiles if only to deplete their AMMs.

IMO, beam fighters work best with Battlestar designs. Thick armor, thick defenses, hangar bays. You can deploy the fighters and keep them close to use them as anti-missile escorts, attack with them if the moment is right, or keep them inside the bays so they are protected from AMM targeting. 

@admiral666 - you should probably reduce the deploy time on your fighter to 0.1, I think thats why you have 11 crew listed.

@Vynadan -

[Vandermeer]

IMO, beam fighters work best with Battlestar designs. Thick armor, thick defenses, hangar bays. You can deploy the fighters and keep them close to use them as anti-missile escorts, attack with them if the moment is right, or keep them inside the bays so they are protected from AMM targeting.

Funny thing, though maybe a game/Ai exploit of sorts: You can effectively drain AMM supplies of planets by sending out fast fighters just over the edge of the enemy targeting range, then wait a few salvos, fly back and dock. What happens is that the salvos disappear, poof.

[Jorgen_CAB]

The main use for beam fighters in my campaigns are as anti-fighter or anti-fast recon assets. Against real warships they are just too vulnerable and a single destroyer can almost destroy an endless number before it is significantly damaged using either missiles and/or beam weapons.

I do use beam fighters quite extensive though and they do fill an important role, just not used to attack warships. I really don't think you can use them that way without serious advantage in technology. The same is true for regular beam ship doctrines.

For me beam weapons are important for close in defenses and anti-missile duty not as a main weapon you use against enemy combat ships. Beam weapons is useful in Jump Point defenses and as a last ditch defense or as an orbital bombardment weapon against planets with no or a thin atmosphere.

Beam weapons are very much like the gun on today's frigates and destroyers. It is used for littoral areas (jump points) and as shore bombardments. The likelihood of two modern destroyers in a modern setting to duke it out with their guns are most likely very improbable but not impossible. But they are still armed with them and they are still a useful weapon. I view beam weapons exactly the same way on my warships. Beam fighters are sort of today's interceptor or air superiority air-crafts and they certainly is important in that role.