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Posted by: nuclearslurpee
« on: December 03, 2021, 11:23:45 AM »

Quote from: Blogaugis on December 03, 2021, 11:06:39 AM
May I suggest adding an option for how many officers you want generated at the game start, for every manually created empire/civilisation?
On the other hand, it is of little importance, since you can Space Master them out, if necessary...

As stated you can just use SM to do this in two button presses, so I doubt it gets added.

However if you want to control this at the start of the game, you generate 100 officers per academy so changing the number of academies will accomplish this - and frankly I recommend doing this anyways as it is hard-capped to 2 academies and thus does not scale beyond 1b pop. When I do a 2b pop game I usually scale it up to 4 academies and as a side effect I have plenty of officers for the size of fleet I will build.
Posted by: Blogaugis
« on: December 03, 2021, 11:06:39 AM »

May I suggest adding an option for how many officers you want generated at the game start, for every manually created empire/civilisation?
On the other hand, it is of little importance, since you can Space Master them out, if necessary...
Posted by: Vandermeer
« on: November 30, 2021, 12:24:55 PM »

Quote from: Steve Walmsley on November 30, 2021, 10:20:00 AM
I've made the changes discussed above:
http://aurora2.pentarch.org/index.php?topic=12523.msg157362#msg157362
Is this real? I have wanted exactly this since forever.

2.0 looks like reboot into extra sharp by now. The Christmas mood is rolling in.
Posted by: nuclearslurpee
« on: November 30, 2021, 11:21:10 AM »

Quote from: Steve Walmsley on November 30, 2021, 11:09:31 AM
Quote from: Kelewan on November 30, 2021, 10:41:03 AM
Quote from: Steve Walmsley on November 30, 2021, 10:20:00 AM
I've made the changes discussed above:
http://aurora2.pentarch.org/index.php?topic=12523.msg157362#msg157362

How are promotions handled for admin commands? At the beginning, will  the minimal rank for the main naval command will be very low, or the top Rank?
If it starts very low, will the the minimal rank increase and trigger a removed from office if we add sub commands? What will happen if it is already the top rank?
If it starts with the top rank, will the promotion skip ranks?

Admin command required ranks were already updated for v2.0, so there should not be a problem. The admin command ranks will be based on the assigned ships and subordinate commands, even if they don't have commanders.
http://aurora2.pentarch.org/index.php?topic=12523.msg156309#msg156309

Note that we will also be able to set the minimum rank requirement for an admin command, which will be good when you have an admin command that doesn't have any ships assigned under it at the moment to make sure it doesn't accidentally eat a CDR instead of a CDRE.
Posted by: cdrtwohy
« on: November 30, 2021, 11:20:03 AM »

Steve really liking the Promotion changes coming, as someone that models the entire officer tree from O1 to O10 being able to actually have a full command staff is nice with out having a whole bunch of useless junior officers running around :)
Posted by: Steve Walmsley
« on: November 30, 2021, 11:09:31 AM »

Quote from: Kelewan on November 30, 2021, 10:41:03 AM
Quote from: Steve Walmsley on November 30, 2021, 10:20:00 AM
I've made the changes discussed above:
http://aurora2.pentarch.org/index.php?topic=12523.msg157362#msg157362

How are promotions handled for admin commands? At the beginning, will  the minimal rank for the main naval command will be very low, or the top Rank?
If it starts very low, will the the minimal rank increase and trigger a removed from office if we add sub commands? What will happen if it is already the top rank?
If it starts with the top rank, will the promotion skip ranks?

Admin command required ranks were already updated for v2.0, so there should not be a problem. The admin command ranks will be based on the assigned ships and subordinate commands, even if they don't have commanders.
http://aurora2.pentarch.org/index.php?topic=12523.msg156309#msg156309
Posted by: Kelewan
« on: November 30, 2021, 10:41:03 AM »

Quote from: Steve Walmsley on November 30, 2021, 10:20:00 AM
I've made the changes discussed above:
http://aurora2.pentarch.org/index.php?topic=12523.msg157362#msg157362

How are promotions handled for admin commands? At the beginning, will  the minimal rank for the main naval command will be very low, or the top Rank?
If it starts very low, will the the minimal rank increase and trigger a removed from office if we add sub commands? What will happen if it is already the top rank?
If it starts with the top rank, will the promotion skip ranks?
Posted by: Steve Walmsley
« on: November 30, 2021, 10:24:02 AM »

Quote from: nuclearslurpee on November 30, 2021, 10:23:06 AM
Great Steve! Looks like 2.0 is done now and you should release it today!   ;)  :P

I think perhaps some testing of all the recent changes first :)
Posted by: nuclearslurpee
« on: November 30, 2021, 10:23:06 AM »

Great Steve! Looks like 2.0 is done now and you should release it today!   ;)  :P
Posted by: Steve Walmsley
« on: November 30, 2021, 10:20:00 AM »

I've made the changes discussed above:
http://aurora2.pentarch.org/index.php?topic=12523.msg157362#msg157362
Posted by: Steve Walmsley
« on: November 30, 2021, 09:49:45 AM »

Quote from: nuclearslurpee on November 30, 2021, 09:19:43 AM
Quote from: Sebmono on November 29, 2021, 10:21:57 PM
So I propose simply:
- Promote only when a seat opens up.
- Prioritize on matching traits from next lowest rank
- If no match, then just pick the officer with highest promotion score in that rank.
- That's it; no shuffling or reassigning, or worrying about tours of duty, just FIFO straight line up the chain with priority given to fit if available.

This seems reasonable to me. My only issue is that to prioritize promotion based on traits first, promotion score second seems to trivialize promotion score and limit the potential for "bad" promotions which are "realistically annoying" and I think some players want to see some amount of bureaucratic inefficiency. I would suggest that if the Political skill is active in the game settings (so it is an optional rule), perhaps 50% of an officer's Political score is added to their matching traits score allowing well-connected officers to leapfrog competent peers - for example, a Captain with 20% Mining skill may miss the chance for promotion to Admiral in charge of a mining admin command due to a fellow Captain with only 10% Mining skill but 30% Political score (net 25% score for the promotion).

This also I think makes the impact of the Political score a bit more tangible for the player which is a nice plus if they choose to use this option.

It's a good point about the political bonus. However, as it won't be used for anything else, I should probably use the full bonus. I'll reduce the size of the bonus for newly generated commanders so the effect is similar.
Posted by: cdrtwohy
« on: November 30, 2021, 09:42:23 AM »

Quote
I would suggest that if the Political skill is active in the game settings (so it is an optional rule), perhaps 50% of an officer's Political score is added to their matching traits score allowing well-connected officers to leapfrog competent peers - for example, a Captain with 20% Mining skill may miss the chance for promotion to Admiral in charge of a mining admin command due to a fellow Captain with only 10% Mining skill but 30% Political score (net 25% score for the promotion)

I agree with this, as anyone that was in the Military can attest the higher the rank the more political it becomes especially when at say the O-6+ level for the most part these people survived due to skill (plus politics) anyway, give that Political score a little more meaning
Posted by: nuclearslurpee
« on: November 30, 2021, 09:19:43 AM »

Quote from: Sebmono on November 29, 2021, 10:21:57 PM
So I propose simply:
- Promote only when a seat opens up.
- Prioritize on matching traits from next lowest rank
- If no match, then just pick the officer with highest promotion score in that rank.
- That's it; no shuffling or reassigning, or worrying about tours of duty, just FIFO straight line up the chain with priority given to fit if available.

This seems reasonable to me. My only issue is that to prioritize promotion based on traits first, promotion score second seems to trivialize promotion score and limit the potential for "bad" promotions which are "realistically annoying" and I think some players want to see some amount of bureaucratic inefficiency. I would suggest that if the Political skill is active in the game settings (so it is an optional rule), perhaps 50% of an officer's Political score is added to their matching traits score allowing well-connected officers to leapfrog competent peers - for example, a Captain with 20% Mining skill may miss the chance for promotion to Admiral in charge of a mining admin command due to a fellow Captain with only 10% Mining skill but 30% Political score (net 25% score for the promotion).

This also I think makes the impact of the Political score a bit more tangible for the player which is a nice plus if they choose to use this option.
Posted by: dsedrez
« on: November 30, 2021, 08:42:16 AM »

Quote from: Steve Walmsley on November 30, 2021, 05:11:43 AM
Quote from: Sebmono on November 29, 2021, 10:21:57 PM
For the sake of simplicity and not attempting to implement an overly complicated solution right off, I still think the most important element to target is minimization of officers (regardless of quality) getting promoted into in ranks with nothing to do. This is the main situation caused by fixed ratios that I think we would all like to minimize.

So if we only promote someone directly into another empty position, then it will minimize idleness at higher ranks, even if it results in the 'wrong man for the job' getting the seat. I'd take that inefficiency, and more than happy to RP it away mentally, for having the most generally experienced officers adding some kind of value (even in the case of a combat vet being assigned to an Admiral position overseeing Logistics fleet), at least they won't be jobless. Added bonus if they can learn new skills they're using in the new seat, even when they start with 0.

So I propose simply:
- Promote only when a seat opens up.
- Prioritize on matching traits from next lowest rank
- If no match, then just pick the officer with highest promotion score in that rank.
- That's it; no shuffling or reassigning, or worrying about tours of duty, just FIFO straight line up the chain with priority given to fit if available.

I think that would work well. It would make promotion demand-driven rather than process driven, but without any complex rules. I could also make some skills more common, such as crew training, to make it easier to find suitable candidates.

One other question is how to handle the starting officer core, before you have built any ships or created any admin command. Maybe that does start at the 2:1 ratio then the above rule is followed thereafter.

I agree on that: it'd solve most promotion problems. It's also simpler than my previous suggestion.

I'd add a simple additional change though: changing the checkbox "Do not promote" to "Do not Promote or Reassign": that would allow me to use the "Reassign Naval" button periodically to simulate tours of duty: I don't currently use that because it unassigns the carefully chosen officers I put on my ships for RP purposes.



Posted by: Migi
« on: November 30, 2021, 08:41:39 AM »

Quote from: Steve Walmsley on November 30, 2021, 05:11:43 AM
One other question is how to handle the starting officer core, before you have built any ships or created any admin command. Maybe that does start at the 2:1 ratio then the above rule is followed thereafter.

If everyone in the starting officer corps begins on the lowest rank, then the whole system should sort itself out after 8 construction cycles assuming you have all 8 ranks required and the system only promotes 1 rank at a time.