Post by: Erik L on April 12, 2008, 03:27:43 PM
What do others use for their classifications?
Post by: Haegan2005 on April 12, 2008, 04:30:27 PM
CA Primary combatant. So far around 6000 tons.
CH larger, better protected combatant with more then 5 launchers or lasers.
BB ten launchers or more, 10000 ton + range. only one race so far has these.
BC no race has these yet. still thinking about how to classify. Probably mixed laser, missile armament. 8000 ton range.
Post by: Charlie Beeler on April 12, 2008, 04:50:08 PM
Destroyer - <8k tons
Light Cruiser - <10k tons
Cruiser - 10k tons
Battle Cruiser - >10k tons
It's rough and violated frequently.
Haegan, I like your idea of basing class on a mix of tonnage and combat capability. Something to think about.
Post by: Erik L on April 12, 2008, 09:01:05 PM
Quote from: "Charlie Beeler"
Frigate - <5k tons
Destroyer - <8k tons
Light Cruiser - <10k tons
Cruiser - 10k tons
Battle Cruiser - >10k tons
It's rough and violated frequently.
Haegan, I like your idea of basing class on a mix of tonnage and combat capability. Something to think about.
Heh. I could see the panic when one of your races sends a single "cruiser" on a diplomatic mission and the receiving race is expecting 8k tons.
As for armaments, missile ships get the -G added, i.e. DDG, CAG; beam armed ships (and I include meson, railgun, laser, carronade, etc here) have no designation; dedicated escorts get -E added; Scouts usually -X; and carriers -V.
Post by: Charles Fox on April 13, 2008, 02:37:01 PM
Post by: Haegan2005 on April 13, 2008, 07:19:26 PM
Quote
As for armaments, missile ships get the -G added, i.e. DDG, CAG; beam armed ships (and I include meson, railgun, laser, carronade, etc here) have no designation; dedicated escorts get -E added; Scouts usually -X; and carriers -V.
Post by: Erik L on April 13, 2008, 08:14:33 PM
Quote from: "Haegan2005"
So that would make a Havertian Navajo scout a DDX?QuoteAs for armaments, missile ships get the -G added, i.e. DDG, CAG; beam armed ships (and I include meson, railgun, laser, carronade, etc here) have no designation; dedicated escorts get -E added; Scouts usually -X; and carriers -V.
If it was a destroyer, yes.
Post by: Haegan2005 on April 13, 2008, 08:57:35 PM
Quote from: "Erik Luken"
Quote from: "Haegan2005"So that would make a Havertian Navajo scout a DDX?QuoteAs for armaments, missile ships get the -G added, i.e. DDG, CAG; beam armed ships (and I include meson, railgun, laser, carronade, etc here) have no designation; dedicated escorts get -E added; Scouts usually -X; and carriers -V.
If it was a destroyer, yes.
Post by: Erik L on April 13, 2008, 09:12:05 PM
Quote from: "Haegan2005"
Hmmm. It's really a scout with lasers attached. However, the lasers fit the definition of a support ship with PD capability only, which fits my campaign description of a destroyer.
I define scout as a ship with max and full sensor suites, stealth and ecm if available. Scouts usually have a minimal weapon complement.
Your ship, I'd call an Escort, since its main function would seem to be point defense. So the Navajo would be a DDE, not DDX.
Post by: Haegan2005 on April 13, 2008, 09:28:42 PM
So it performs three purposes:
1. Long range sensor capability
2. Thinken the PD capability of the fleet.
3. Provide yet another target.
Quote from: "Erik Luken"
Quote from: "Haegan2005"Hmmm. It's really a scout with lasers attached. However, the lasers fit the definition of a support ship with PD capability only, which fits my campaign description of a destroyer.
I define scout as a ship with max and full sensor suites, stealth and ecm if available. Scouts usually have a minimal weapon complement.
Your ship, I'd call an Escort, since its main function would seem to be point defense. So the Navajo would be a DDE, not DDX.
Post by: Whiskey144 on November 08, 2009, 09:22:04 PM
Fighter- small craft, very fast and hard to hit. Like a recoverable missile bus (missile that shoots missiles), that is crewed. A "gunboat", "gunship", "assault boat/boarding craft", "fighter/bomber", and "bomber" would all be classed as fighters. So would "interceptors".
Destroyers- small vessels with frigate-level firepower, but very little long-term endurance. Typical mission lengths are up to 6 months at most, more typically 2-8 weeks. In other words- good for home patrol and defense, bad for offensive operations. They have some multirole usage, mainly as combatants, point defense, and sensor ships.
Troop Transport- pretty much, TTs are just lightly armed frigates. They swap weapons space for troop carriage capability. They can either carry 500-2000 power-armor troopers, or a 150-500 man armored assault force. Armored assault forces are primarily used for fire support in planetary operations (like artillery). TTs are also useful as logistics vessels, carrying spare parts, additional ordnance, and extra food/water/air/fuel, due to their capacious internal bays.
Frigates- sizeable vessels, these are essentially small battleships. They are smaller than battleships, with a proportionately smaller firepower and survivability "rating". They have excellent (8-24 months) endurance, and have high delta-vs (change in velocity, meaning can go a lot of places). Frigates can perform a variety of roles, including: fleet combatant, fighter carriage, point defense, sensor net operations, C4ISR (Command, Control, Communications, Computers, Intelligence, Reconnaissance, Surveillance), and planetary raids.
Pocket Battleship- approximately midway between frigates and full-sized battleships, they have battleship-level firepower and usually survivability, but are smaller, require less crew, and tend to have greater endurances (12-36 months, though 48-96 months is possible) than frigates and even some larger warships. The reasoning behind a pocket battleship is- fewer crew, fewer pieces, smaller ship (for material frugality).
Battleship- this is a beast of warfare. Note that, if you have the resources to build a fleet of battleships, the only reason not to is so you can have more frigates/pocket battleships in more places at once. Endurance is very long (48 months is normal).
Supercarrier- these are inferior to battleships in many respects, but do have the advantage of- huge troop bays, huge hangar bays, and massive ordnance and supply carriage. Basically, supercarriers are really big troop tranports, but with frigate-sized guns (and lots of them).
Post by: Beersatron on November 08, 2009, 10:39:18 PM
Also, I rarely go above CL in my games because I prefer spamming them instead of 'wasting' time on expanding the SY capacity and then retooling and because Steve releases a new DB before I feel the need for a larger vessel.
Post by: Sotak246 on November 09, 2009, 01:38:08 AM
Frigate 3000-5000
Destroyer 5000-6000
Light Cruiser 6000-8000
Cruiser 8000-10000
Battle Cruiser 10000-12000
Battleship 12000-25000
Dreadnought <25000
My fleets tend to be heavy with Cruisers and Battle Cruisers with a small back bone of Battleships. The DDs are divided between escort and patrol type vessels. My CLs are almost exclusively escort types for task force anit-missile defense. Frigates are usually early game builds then relegated to picket duties.
Post by: Steve Walmsley on November 09, 2009, 06:20:42 AM
That is the reason I left hull designations as purely cosmetic so people could decide for themselves and perhaps change those designations over time as ships generally get larger.
Steve
Post by: waresky on November 09, 2009, 07:58:31 AM
Quote from: "Sotak246"
I usually use these as my weight classifications:25000 (puny) DREADNOUGHT Class???
Frigate 3000-5000
Destroyer 5000-6000
Light Cruiser 6000-8000
Cruiser 8000-10000
Battle Cruiser 10000-12000
Battleship 12000-25000
Dreadnought <25000
My fleets tend to be heavy with Cruisers and Battle Cruisers with a small back bone of Battleships. The DDs are divided between escort and patrol type vessels. My CLs are almost exclusively escort types for task force anit-missile defense. Frigates are usually early game builds then relegated to picket duties.
AHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH..:D
In 2200 25.000 tons r right a decent Light Cruiser:DDDDD
Post by: Charlie Beeler on November 09, 2009, 08:28:32 AM
Quote from: "waresky"
Quote from: "Sotak246"I usually use these as my weight classifications:25000 (puny) DREADNOUGHT Class???
Frigate 3000-5000
Destroyer 5000-6000
Light Cruiser 6000-8000
Cruiser 8000-10000
Battle Cruiser 10000-12000
Battleship 12000-25000
Dreadnought <25000
My fleets tend to be heavy with Cruisers and Battle Cruisers with a small back bone of Battleships. The DDs are divided between escort and patrol type vessels. My CLs are almost exclusively escort types for task force anit-missile defense. Frigates are usually early game builds then relegated to picket duties.
AHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH..:D
In 2200 25.000 tons r right a decent Light Cruiser:DDDDD
Just how much are you modifying your starting game? If I've read your other posts correctly your current game has in excess of 100years of game time, but even your intial designs posted are on average 10x the mass that most other are posting.
Post by: James Patten on November 09, 2009, 09:07:27 AM
I think my favorite ships are in the sub 1000 ton range - they're usually fairly quick, are built in less than a year, and could probably swarm over your 100,000 ton ship and overwhelm its defenses with relatively few losses.
Post by: Hawkeye on November 09, 2009, 10:25:09 AM
The backbone of my navy will probably allways be the destroyer. In early game it will be between 5000t and 6000t and might later on grow to 8000 but probably not more.
Cruisers will be in the 10k range initially and might grow to 15k or so. Never got a game to a point where I felt the need for bigger ships, but Heavy Cruisers would probably be between 15 and 25k with BC/BB of 25k to 50k
Difference between BC and BB will NOT be mass, but speed (as IRL) with less armor/shields and more engines
Post by: Father Tim on November 09, 2009, 11:53:42 AM
Post by: waresky on November 09, 2009, 01:16:35 PM
Are an "absurd example" on a specified class.
For me,Traveller players,an Dreadnought must have a VERY damned BIG hull..
in fact actually,in THIS campaign,4.61,my biggest ships are commercials:ehheehh
because am never use SM mode,i HATE "God Mode On".
ok,in another Camp,was lucky,on minerals,and ive build a Heavy Cruiser Class 35.000 tons.
In my Mind a BC Class are more 50.000-100.000 tons
BB : 100.000 - 200.000
SD:300.000 - xxxx tons.
Post by: waresky on November 09, 2009, 01:17:24 PM
Code: [Select]
Dome Colony 1 class Orbital Dome Colony 552600 tons 3488 Crew 24030 BP TCS 11052 TH 4500 EM 0
407 km/s Armour 1-599 Shields 0-0 Sensors 1/1/0/0 Damage Control Rating 1 PPV 0
Maintenance Capacity 27 MSP Max Repair 38 MSP
Colonists 2000000 Cargo Handling Multiplier 25
Ion Engine E0.8 (30) Power 150 Fuel Use 8% Signature 150 Armour 0 Exp 1%
Fuel Capacity 10,050,000 Litres Range 409.0 billion km (11631 days at full power)
This design is classed as a commercial vessel for maintenance purposesCode: [Select]
Rommel class AO OrbRefinery 214250 tons 4228 Crew 9992.2 BP TCS 4285 TH 2352 EM 0
548 km/s Armour 1-318 Shields 0-0 Sensors 1/1/0/0 Damage Control Rating 1 PPV 0
Maintenance Capacity 29 MSP Max Repair 60 MSP
Fuel Harvester: 30 modules producing 840000 litres per annum
Ion Engine E0.4 (21) Power 112 Fuel Use 4% Signature 112 Armour 0 Exp 0%
Fuel Capacity 35,050,000 Litres Range 7349.8 billion km (155231 days at full power)
This design is classed as a commercial vessel for maintenance purposes
Post by: waresky on November 09, 2009, 01:20:21 PM
another Militar Naval Class very big,from Traveller,are "Battle Riders"(300.000+ tons) a "Carriers" who carry 7 to 10 10.000tons-Class Riders (same as very BIG Gunboat or Missile Boat,no Jump Capabilies but heavily armed and fast.
Post by: welchbloke on November 09, 2009, 01:26:25 PM
Quote from: "waresky"
am love "think different"I have the same question as Charlie. How do you manage to build such massive ships within Aurora. The raw material requirements for ships of this size are enormous and I would have thought well beyond most empires even after 100 yrs.
another Militar Naval Class very big,from Traveller,are "Battle Riders"(300.000+ tons) a "Carriers" who carry 7 to 10 10.000tons-Class Riders (same as very BIG Gunboat or Missile Boat,no Jump Capabilies but heavily armed and fast.
Post by: waresky on November 09, 2009, 01:58:06 PM
not so "enormous"
Rommel AO OrbRefinery: 8886xDuranium---39.9xNeutronium---5xCorbomite---450xboronide--170xMercassium---441xGallicite
So..for 2 megaShips i think not "enormous"..not?:D
And u think: no Spare parts and NO Economic cost for maintenance.
So i think this Commercial ships are BETTER when u need build BIG for BIG economic effort.
Post by: waresky on November 09, 2009, 02:00:47 PM
but guys...ive 12 mining colony,and after 100 years in peace,earth have very high minerals reserve..lucky? no.hard planning coloniz projects.
am repeat..for ME..SM mode,Steve can ERASE the capability.Am hate "God mode On"..
Post by: waresky on November 09, 2009, 02:05:34 PM
Code: [Select]
Churchill class Freighter 448500 tons 1483 Crew 3065.6 BP TCS 8970 TH 3696 EM 0
412 km/s Armour 1-521 Shields 0-0 Sensors 1/1/0/0 Damage Control Rating 1 PPV 0
Maintenance Capacity 4 MSP Max Repair 28 MSP
Cargo 400000
Ion Engine E0.4 (33) Power 112 Fuel Use 4% Signature 112 Armour 0 Exp 0%
Fuel Capacity 3,550,000 Litres Range 356.2 billion km (10005 days at full power)
This design is classed as a commercial vessel for maintenance purposesThis is another example: ive 3 of them at work.
1 r udeful for RawOre trade route between mining colony and hungry Industrialized Colonys
1 r actually caught on biggest colonizing Fomalhaut mission,a very Heaven planet,infrastructure,Industrial Cap,mining,etc..
1 r useful for transport from a Abandoned Intact Cities (Aliens) a so MANY ships parts to Earth depot:)
Post by: waresky on November 09, 2009, 02:12:26 PM
Am think Human MUST win.So we must go better than Aliens.
All that:9
Post by: Charlie Beeler on November 09, 2009, 02:42:19 PM
Quote from: "waresky"
Dome Colony 1: minerals needed: 7930x Duranium--75x neutronium--5x Corbomite--15165x mercassium--855xGallicite
not so "enormous"
Rommel AO OrbRefinery: 8886xDuranium---39.9xNeutronium---5xCorbomite---450xboronide--170xMercassium---441xGallicite
So..for 2 megaShips i think not "enormous"..not?:D
And u think: no Spare parts and NO Economic cost for maintenance.
So i think this Commercial ships are BETTER when u need build BIG for BIG economic effort.
You appearently have been very lucky with starting homeworld resources. Most that I've generated have had under 250k tons of duranium. So, yes your designs would use enormous volumes resources in the universes I've gamed.
Post by: waresky on November 09, 2009, 02:48:10 PM
(8450 tons of mercassium very smeg!! 12540 tons of Soriu,,another smegty dep..:SVenus in this camp have a 42 millions Duranium dep..at 0.2
And Titan Corundium's Depot 3 millions at 0.9!!..Sorium ok and some mercassium
so with some Neutronium from mercury (450k at 0.7) in few years and close eye control in production am take Stars Route..and there am really lucky.325 MILLIONS (Ross 128) at 0.6 Duranium depot!!!!
all that:)
Post by: Beersatron on November 09, 2009, 02:53:47 PM
I can see the benefit of having one large ship to carry everything for a new colony, but personally, I would prefer ships around 60k Tons that carry about 25000 and go around 2k kms and also have 3/4 armor in case I run into a nebula. That way I can use 10 of them for a new colony start-up and after that I can parcel them up to run critical supplies where/when needed.
Post by: waresky on November 09, 2009, 03:17:36 PM
And think that..my Freighter (400.000 tons cargo!) canhold "ONLY" 64 Ion Drive E80 recovered from Ancient Abandoned Intact Alien City..64!!! on 400.000 tons...
u r sure..who r better build small?:D
ive a dozens of cargo ranges from 25000 to 75000 tons...and 3 only Freighter 400k.
And trust me..r 5 times who carry from this Aliens city..and r enough Ships parts to load enough!!!!
And another fact: for a VERY good colonizing plan,this freighter r very helped.
Post by: waresky on November 09, 2009, 03:27:27 PM
Planning,careful surveying,write up paper WHERE r better depot,prepare mission carefully,setup a mining route,2 or 3 cargos task group for go and return with Automines and Raw ore..all take time,but in long plan route r winner choice.
minerals make a difference between loose or wins Naval Fleet
Post by: Steve Walmsley on November 10, 2009, 01:37:40 AM
Quote from: "Beersatron"
How long does it take to increase the capacity on your Commercial Shipyards in order to build those freighters Waresky? Do you design a smaller class so the civilians can do their thing?Its not as bad as you may think. Larger shipyards can be expanded more quickly than small ones so the rate at which capacity can be added increases as the shipyard gets bigger. For a military shipyard the formula is as follows:
Build Rate Multiple = Capacity / 5000
Build Rate Multiple= 1 + ((Build Rate Multiple - 1) / 2)
Actual Build Rate = Build Rate Multiple * Racial Shipbuilding Rate
So assuming a racial shipbulding rate of 1000, the rate at which BP can be spent on a shipyard per year is as follows:
Shipyard Capacity 5000 (which is the baseline size)
BRM = 5000/5000 = 1
BRM = 1 + (0/2) = 1
Actual Build Rate = 1 x 1000 = 1000 BP
Shipyard Capacity 10,000
BRM = 10000/5000 = 2
BRM = 1 + ((2-1)/2) = 1.5
Actual Build Rate = 1.5 x 1000 = 1500BP
Shipyard Capacity 20,000
BRM = 20000/5000 = 4
BRM = 1 + ((4-1)/2) = 2.5
Actual Build Rate = 2.5 x 1000 = 2500BP
Shipyard Capacity 45,000
BRM = 45000/5000 = 9
BRM = 1 + ((9-1)/2) = 5
Actual Build Rate = 5 x 1000 = 5000BP
As you can see, a shipyard of 45,000 capacity can increase in size to 50,000 in the same amount of time a shipyard of 5000 capacity can increase to 6000. It will still cost 5x as much though.
Steve
Post by: WHCnelson on April 14, 2010, 05:28:16 PM
sure how it works. Do I place the vessel over a
planet or Gas Giant with Sorium and it will
automaticly start to process the fuel?
Thanks Guys. :D :roll:
Post by: Beersatron on April 15, 2010, 12:44:15 AM
Quote from: "WHCnelson"
Hey I have a fuel Harvester design, but not
sure how it works. Do I place the vessel over a
planet or Gas Giant with Sorium and it will
automaticly start to process the fuel?
Thanks Guys. :D :roll:
Gas Giant with Sorium will work, pretty sure the super jovians with sorian will also work. You also do not need to create a placeholder colony on the planetary body, just 'move to' and it starts automajically.
Post by: sloanjh on April 15, 2010, 08:36:13 AM
Quote from: "Beersatron"
Quote from: "WHCnelson"Hey I have a fuel Harvester design, but not
sure how it works. Do I place the vessel over a
planet or Gas Giant with Sorium and it will
automaticly start to process the fuel?
Thanks Guys. :D :roll: :-)
John
Post by: Brian Neumann on April 15, 2010, 08:56:38 PM
Brian
Post by: UnLimiTeD on April 16, 2010, 12:52:44 PM
Post by: WHCnelson on April 17, 2010, 09:35:00 AM
Here is my design.
Herc Fuel Harvester class Fuel Harvester 63250 tons 995 Crew 2375.6 BP TCS 1265 TH 864 EM 0
1366 km/s Armour 1-141 Shields 0-0 Sensors 6/1/0/0 Damage Control Rating 6 PPV 0
Maint Capacity 141 MSP Max Repair 108 MSP
Fuel Harvester: 10 modules producing 320000 litres per annum
IC Fusion Drive E0.65 (6) Power 288 Fuel Use 6.5% Signature 144 Armour 0 Exp 2%
Fuel Capacity 4,250,000 Litres Range 1860.7 billion km (15765 days at full power)
Thermal Sensor TH1-6 (1) Sensitivity 6 Detect Sig Strength 1000: 6m km
This design is classed as a commercial vessel for maintenance purposes
I am also wondering if I should put a check mark with the Tanker in the upper right section of the Class Design. I am building two right now and they are at 16.5%.
Thanks guys
Post by: Brian Neumann on April 17, 2010, 09:41:58 AM
Quote from: "WHCnelson"
Ok,Yes you want them to have the tanker designation, otherwise there are a lot of conditional orders that will ignore them, both for orders they can give, and orders to have ships go to the harvester to refuel.
Here is my design.
Herc Fuel Harvester class Fuel Harvester 63250 tons 995 Crew 2375.6 BP TCS 1265 TH 864 EM 0
1366 km/s Armour 1-141 Shields 0-0 Sensors 6/1/0/0 Damage Control Rating 6 PPV 0
Maint Capacity 141 MSP Max Repair 108 MSP
Fuel Harvester: 10 modules producing 320000 litres per annum
IC Fusion Drive E0.65 (6) Power 288 Fuel Use 6.5% Signature 144 Armour 0 Exp 2%
Fuel Capacity 4,250,000 Litres Range 1860.7 billion km (15765 days at full power)
Thermal Sensor TH1-6 (1) Sensitivity 6 Detect Sig Strength 1000: 6m km
This design is classed as a commercial vessel for maintenance purposes
I am also wondering if I should put a check mark with the Tanker in the upper right section of the Class Design. I am building two right now and they are at 16.5%.
Thanks guys
Brian
Post by: AtomikKrab on April 18, 2010, 01:16:48 AM
50-100k ton battlecrusier with various distinctions within
40-50k ton Heavy Cruiser
30-40k ton Cruiser
20-30k ton Light Cruiser
15-20k ton Missile Destroyer
10-15k ton Destroyer
5-10k ton Frigate
less than 5k tons is a scout
The battleship was the smallest design I could pack 100 armor on 1000 km/s speed and a heavy laser punch with the anti-missiles and other stuff. my fleet was like a mace, the battleship was the armored head suitable for crushing and making it through fury and the rest of the fleet was the shaft of the mace which provides the leverage and force to the blow. I should note I was packing armor in that game for plot so everything had a lot of armor on it which made the fleet heavier than normal
Post by: waresky on April 22, 2010, 08:14:12 AM
otherwise with a costant cheap minerary planetary situations..u get only a few BB (2-10) and some Cruisers.
Atomik seems as a "hacker Empires power"..
Space Master modifier powers..
Post by: Octavian30 on April 29, 2010, 09:23:44 PM
2-3.5k Ton - Corvette
3.5-5.5k T - Frigate
5.6-7.5k T - Destroyer
7.5k-10k T - Light Cruiser
10k T + Heavy Cruiser
25k T Battlecruiser -
I have 16k T Escort Carriers which I am going to enlarge to get them up to 8k speed