Aurora 4x
C# Aurora => C# Bureau of Design => Topic started by: RougeNPS on January 13, 2021, 09:32:55 AM
-
As the title suggests, how do i make bombers like in Star Wars? For those of you who dont know, bombers in Star Wars work more like guided missile boats or slow moving heavy torpedo launchers than conventional Earth bombers. Seeing as they usually come equipped with either mines, proton torpedoes (Or other kinds of torpedoes.), concussion missiles (High-yield AOE missiles.), and in some cases, other specialized armaments such as Buzzdroid missiles or even mines.
-
You make a 50-ton max power engine and strap some fuel, a missile fire control, and a box launcher of your chosen size to it.
Just make sure its below 500 tons.
-
Ok. So if i wanted a torpedo bomber, how would i do it with missiles? I make the distinction between missiles and torpedoes as, missiles are guided and meant for armor penetration or crowd control. And torpedoes are unguided and meant for overwhelming shields with firepower before detonating. Yes i know you may not be able to replicate this in Aurora but im curious to what extent you would be able to.
I know how to do mines and i could probably do swarm missiles and basically any other kind of Star Wars-esque armament but im not sure if you could do what i would call a torpedo per say so im curious.
-
Ok. So if i wanted a torpedo bomber, how would i do it with missiles? I make the distinction between missiles and torpedoes as, missiles are guided and meant for armor penetration or crowd control. And torpedoes are unguided and meant for overwhelming shields with firepower before detonating. Yes i know you may not be able to replicate this in Aurora but im curious to what extent you would be able to.
I know how to do mines and i could probably do swarm missiles and basically any other kind of Star Wars-esque armament but im not sure if you could do what i would call a torpedo per say so im curious.
If you want torpedos to be short ranged and unguided, a giant plasma carronade or reduced rate of fire laser would be an interesting choice.
-
Plasma Cannonade seems a lot like how Proton Torpedoes actually work in Star Wars from what i was reading so i think thats a good choice. I just havent ever used them before.
-
Plasma Cannonade seems a lot like how Proton Torpedoes actually work in Star Wars from what i was reading so i think thats a good choice. I just havent ever used them before.
They are outrageously cheap, so feel free to use it! It's short ranged though so if it isn't very fast, you might want to reduce thermal signature somewhat.
-
Plasma Cannonade seems a lot like how Proton Torpedoes actually work in Star Wars from what i was reading so i think thats a good choice. I just havent ever used them before.
They are outrageously cheap, so feel free to use it! It's short ranged though so if it isn't very fast, you might want to reduce thermal signature somewhat.
Don't bother with thermal reduction. It's a bloody energy weapon; they ARE going to spot you before you get to shoot them. Stealth is impossible.
And thermal reduction is expensive. You are gonna lose these things in job lots; you can't afford to make them individually expensive.
-
Yeah thermal reduction is more useful for missile ships - even then, they'll see you when you turn on actives to actually fire the missiles.
-
Plasma Cannonade seems a lot like how Proton Torpedoes actually work in Star Wars from what i was reading so i think thats a good choice. I just havent ever used them before.
They are outrageously cheap, so feel free to use it! It's short ranged though so if it isn't very fast, you might want to reduce thermal signature somewhat.
Don't bother with thermal reduction. It's a bloody energy weapon; they ARE going to spot you before you get to shoot them. Stealth is impossible.
And thermal reduction is expensive. You are gonna lose these things in job lots; you can't afford to make them individually expensive.
- For anything other than Plasma Carronades I'd agree with this. For anything even remotely fast I'd agree with this. For anything biiger than 500 Tons I'd agree with this. But we're taliing about ideas for a slow, small, carronade bomber, so I vehemently disagree with this. It's a terrible idea to make a slaw, small carronade bomber, yes, but if you're hell bent on doing it anyway Thermal Reduction would be essential to ensure that when they do start firing on you that you are as close as possible to them.
-These days I use Thermal reduction pretty much exclusively on non-missile fighters and Fighter to FAC sized scouts for this exact reason. Without a dedicated Anti-Fighter or Anti-FAC sensor, they'll only see you coming at very nearly point blank, and for the Plasma Carronade specifically, this is crucial as itis consistently outranged by just about everything except Gauss. You need to get close. And if you're going slow as OP intends, that's gonna be hard. Thermal Reduction is best used on ships that are small and therefore very hard to see on Actives, mostly because they need less power, ergo less heat, to go fast.
- Thermal Reduction on fighters save lives. :)
-
Plasma Cannonade seems a lot like how Proton Torpedoes actually work in Star Wars from what i was reading so i think thats a good choice. I just havent ever used them before.
They are outrageously cheap, so feel free to use it! It's short ranged though so if it isn't very fast, you might want to reduce thermal signature somewhat.
Don't bother with thermal reduction. It's a bloody energy weapon; they ARE going to spot you before you get to shoot them. Stealth is impossible.
And thermal reduction is expensive. You are gonna lose these things in job lots; you can't afford to make them individually expensive.
- For anything other than Plasma Carronades I'd agree with this. For anything even remotely fast I'd agree with this. For anything biiger than 500 Tons I'd agree with this. But we're taliing about ideas for a slow, small, carronade bomber, so I vehemently disagree with this. It's a terrible idea to make a slaw, small carronade bomber, yes, but if you're hell bent on doing it anyway Thermal Reduction would be essential to ensure that when they do start firing on you that you are as close as possible to them.
-These days I use Thermal reduction pretty much exclusively on non-missile fighters and Fighter to FAC sized scouts for this exact reason. Without a dedicated Anti-Fighter or Anti-FAC sensor, they'll only see you coming at very nearly point blank, and for the Plasma Carronade specifically, this is crucial as itis consistently outranged by just about everything except Gauss. You need to get close. And if you're going slow as OP intends, that's gonna be hard. Thermal Reduction is best used on ships that are small and therefore very hard to see on Actives, mostly because they need less power, ergo less heat, to go fast.
- Thermal Reduction on fighters save lives. :)
You are getting spotted at 10million kms, no matter what you do, because their antimissile sensors will catch you. If you are as slow as you are assuming, that is plenty of time for them to blow you to bits if they have the capacity.
I place very little value on stealth UNLESS you can actually attack without being spotted.
YMMV against NPRs.
-
Plasma Cannonade seems a lot like how Proton Torpedoes actually work in Star Wars from what i was reading so i think thats a good choice. I just havent ever used them before.
They are outrageously cheap, so feel free to use it! It's short ranged though so if it isn't very fast, you might want to reduce thermal signature somewhat.
Don't bother with thermal reduction. It's a bloody energy weapon; they ARE going to spot you before you get to shoot them. Stealth is impossible.
And thermal reduction is expensive. You are gonna lose these things in job lots; you can't afford to make them individually expensive.
- For anything other than Plasma Carronades I'd agree with this. For anything even remotely fast I'd agree with this. For anything biiger than 500 Tons I'd agree with this. But we're taliing about ideas for a slow, small, carronade bomber, so I vehemently disagree with this. It's a terrible idea to make a slaw, small carronade bomber, yes, but if you're hell bent on doing it anyway Thermal Reduction would be essential to ensure that when they do start firing on you that you are as close as possible to them.
-These days I use Thermal reduction pretty much exclusively on non-missile fighters and Fighter to FAC sized scouts for this exact reason. Without a dedicated Anti-Fighter or Anti-FAC sensor, they'll only see you coming at very nearly point blank, and for the Plasma Carronade specifically, this is crucial as itis consistently outranged by just about everything except Gauss. You need to get close. And if you're going slow as OP intends, that's gonna be hard. Thermal Reduction is best used on ships that are small and therefore very hard to see on Actives, mostly because they need less power, ergo less heat, to go fast.
- Thermal Reduction on fighters save lives. :)
You are getting spotted at 10million kms, no matter what you do, because their antimissile sensors will catch you. If you are as slow as you are assuming, that is plenty of time for them to blow you to bits if they have the capacity.
I place very little value on stealth UNLESS you can actually attack without being spotted.
YMMV against NPRs.
- I'm assuming about 2,000 km/s, which is 10,000 km per increment. Also, that assumes they're sensors are actually on in the first place. I'm assuming they're not. If their thermals can only see you at sub 1m km, you've only got 7 increments to weather their fire, assuming you fire at 30,000 km, and assuming your using the 10cm carronade on a 500-ton fighter and not something a bit bigger on a small FAC. You're assuming stealth in light of enemy actives being on. It works way better when they have no idea that you're even there. Why put those big, hot "shoot me" lights on if you're not expecting something to shoot at? Any Actives with appreciable range will be stupid easy to spot with EM Passives.
-
Plasma Cannonade seems a lot like how Proton Torpedoes actually work in Star Wars from what i was reading so i think thats a good choice. I just havent ever used them before.
They are outrageously cheap, so feel free to use it! It's short ranged though so if it isn't very fast, you might want to reduce thermal signature somewhat.
Don't bother with thermal reduction. It's a bloody energy weapon; they ARE going to spot you before you get to shoot them. Stealth is impossible.
And thermal reduction is expensive. You are gonna lose these things in job lots; you can't afford to make them individually expensive.
- For anything other than Plasma Carronades I'd agree with this. For anything even remotely fast I'd agree with this. For anything biiger than 500 Tons I'd agree with this. But we're taliing about ideas for a slow, small, carronade bomber, so I vehemently disagree with this. It's a terrible idea to make a slaw, small carronade bomber, yes, but if you're hell bent on doing it anyway Thermal Reduction would be essential to ensure that when they do start firing on you that you are as close as possible to them.
-These days I use Thermal reduction pretty much exclusively on non-missile fighters and Fighter to FAC sized scouts for this exact reason. Without a dedicated Anti-Fighter or Anti-FAC sensor, they'll only see you coming at very nearly point blank, and for the Plasma Carronade specifically, this is crucial as itis consistently outranged by just about everything except Gauss. You need to get close. And if you're going slow as OP intends, that's gonna be hard. Thermal Reduction is best used on ships that are small and therefore very hard to see on Actives, mostly because they need less power, ergo less heat, to go fast.
- Thermal Reduction on fighters save lives. :)
You are getting spotted at 10million kms, no matter what you do, because their antimissile sensors will catch you. If you are as slow as you are assuming, that is plenty of time for them to blow you to bits if they have the capacity.
I place very little value on stealth UNLESS you can actually attack without being spotted.
YMMV against NPRs.
- I'm assuming about 2,000 km/s, which is 10,000 km per increment. Also, that assumes they're sensors are actually on in the first place. I'm assuming they're not. If their thermals can only see you at sub 1m km, you've only got 7 increments to weather their fire, assuming you fire at 30,000 km, and assuming your using the 10cm carronade on a 500-ton fighter and not something a bit bigger on a small FAC. You're assuming stealth in light of enemy actives being on. It works way better when they have no idea that you're even there. Why put those big, hot "shoot me" lights on if you're not expecting something to shoot at? Any Actives with appreciable range will be stupid easy to spot with EM Passives.
If you are anywhere you might get attacked and your antimissile sensors are off, you deserve whatever happens to you.
I leave PD sensors on at all times. They are way less loud than the ship's thermal signatures so it's no skin off my nose.
I'm not gonna triple the cost of my expendable bombers in the hope that my enemy makes a mistake.
-
I dont particularly mean slow as in speed. I was referring to the speed of the projectile itself. Not the speed of the ship. Sorry for the confusion.
-
I also wouldnt care about losing them by the dozens if they are cheap. Honestly just wanted ideas for a cheap shield breaker and wanted to know how to best implement an idea.
-
I also wouldnt care about losing them by the dozens if they are cheap. Honestly just wanted ideas for a cheap shield breaker and wanted to know how to best implement an idea.
Plasma carronades aren't particularly effective against shields. They have pretty low DPS.
That said, you're probably more concerned with alpha damage and they're great at that.
-
I mean if i build them by the dozen does it really matter?
-
I mean if i build them by the dozen does it really matter?
No, they are fine for this. I was just clarifying that, techncally speaking, there are better anti-shield weapons (low calibre railguns have the highest DPS).
-
Yeah thats fine. Thanks for the advice.
-
Plasma Cannonade seems a lot like how Proton Torpedoes actually work in Star Wars from what i was reading so i think thats a good choice. I just havent ever used them before.
They are outrageously cheap, so feel free to use it! It's short ranged though so if it isn't very fast, you might want to reduce thermal signature somewhat.
Don't bother with thermal reduction. It's a bloody energy weapon; they ARE going to spot you before you get to shoot them. Stealth is impossible.
And thermal reduction is expensive. You are gonna lose these things in job lots; you can't afford to make them individually expensive.
- For anything other than Plasma Carronades I'd agree with this. For anything even remotely fast I'd agree with this. For anything biiger than 500 Tons I'd agree with this. But we're taliing about ideas for a slow, small, carronade bomber, so I vehemently disagree with this. It's a terrible idea to make a slaw, small carronade bomber, yes, but if you're hell bent on doing it anyway Thermal Reduction would be essential to ensure that when they do start firing on you that you are as close as possible to them.
-These days I use Thermal reduction pretty much exclusively on non-missile fighters and Fighter to FAC sized scouts for this exact reason. Without a dedicated Anti-Fighter or Anti-FAC sensor, they'll only see you coming at very nearly point blank, and for the Plasma Carronade specifically, this is crucial as itis consistently outranged by just about everything except Gauss. You need to get close. And if you're going slow as OP intends, that's gonna be hard. Thermal Reduction is best used on ships that are small and therefore very hard to see on Actives, mostly because they need less power, ergo less heat, to go fast.
- Thermal Reduction on fighters save lives. :)
You are getting spotted at 10million kms, no matter what you do, because their antimissile sensors will catch you. If you are as slow as you are assuming, that is plenty of time for them to blow you to bits if they have the capacity.
I place very little value on stealth UNLESS you can actually attack without being spotted.
YMMV against NPRs.
- I'm assuming about 2,000 km/s, which is 10,000 km per increment. Also, that assumes they're sensors are actually on in the first place. I'm assuming they're not. If their thermals can only see you at sub 1m km, you've only got 7 increments to weather their fire, assuming you fire at 30,000 km, and assuming your using the 10cm carronade on a 500-ton fighter and not something a bit bigger on a small FAC. You're assuming stealth in light of enemy actives being on. It works way better when they have no idea that you're even there. Why put those big, hot "shoot me" lights on if you're not expecting something to shoot at? Any Actives with appreciable range will be stupid easy to spot with EM Passives.
Thanks for that. Sorry for not being there.
-
I think you could use actual missiles rather than plasma carronades for space opera style bombers, especially if they had enormous warheads and you launched them from point blank range
So imagine you're facing an enemy that maybe builds tons of AMMs but not a lot of beam weapons with high tracking speeds, you could get a big formation of 'bomber' fighters or FACs together with ECM and tons of PD to protect themselves from AMMs, and launch very short-ranged huge-warhead missiles at the enemy fleet within 5s missile flight time range, you'd at least get your missiles past their AMMs and any area defense beams, they'd get FDF to protect themselves but if that was inadequate, you could get a lot of damage through. I think you could potentially also fire a ton of size 1 missiles at the same time as the large ones to overwhelm enemy FDF.
A 15cm carronade is 200 tons and requires, depending on your tech, probably a ~20 ton power plant and a ~20 ton BFC plus ~10 crew for 6 damage output, but a 5 ton MFC and a size 30 box launcher fit in about the same space or less and require 0 crew, and a missile that size can easily do 10x the damage of the carronade or more, pierce many layers of armor, and cause serious shock damage against a heavily armored target
Another idea would be to send in a squadron of fighters with HPMs right before the bombers to knock out all of the target's shields, sensors, and defensive fire controls so the bombers' missiles could reach their targets without even getting shot at, this would work in advance of boarding shuttles as well
-
I think you could use actual missiles rather than plasma carronades for space opera style bombers, especially if they had enormous warheads and you launched them from point blank range
So imagine you're facing an enemy that maybe builds tons of AMMs but not a lot of beam weapons with high tracking speeds, you could get a big formation of 'bomber' fighters or FACs together with ECM and tons of PD to protect themselves from AMMs, and launch very short-ranged huge-warhead missiles at the enemy fleet within 5s missile flight time range, you'd at least get your missiles past their AMMs and any area defense beams, they'd get FDF to protect themselves but if that was inadequate, you could get a lot of damage through. I think you could potentially also fire a ton of size 1 missiles at the same time as the large ones to overwhelm enemy FDF.
A 15cm carronade is 200 tons and requires, depending on your tech, probably a ~20 ton power plant and a ~20 ton BFC plus ~10 crew for 6 damage output, but a 5 ton MFC and a size 30 box launcher fit in about the same space or less and require 0 crew, and a missile that size can easily do 10x the damage of the carronade or more, pierce many layers of armor, and cause serious shock damage against a heavily armored target
Another idea would be to send in a squadron of fighters with HPMs right before the bombers to knock out all of the target's shields, sensors, and defensive fire controls so the bombers' missiles could reach their targets without even getting shot at, this would work in advance of boarding shuttles as well
The whole point of my style of bombers is for shield knocking and potentially, critical systems elimination. The rest of the supporting fleet would then rip the ships to shreds via whatever means necessary. I was thinking i would also likely employ FAC or PD fighters as missile screens.