Aurora 4x

New Players => The Academy => Topic started by: Elvin on March 17, 2010, 06:22:03 PM

Title: Recovered Tech- how do I break it down?
Post by: Elvin on March 17, 2010, 06:22:03 PM: After salvaging 45 ion engines from some ruins, I feel like I should be doing some research on the technology to actually mass produce them. I've seen multiple references in fictions to this, but I cannot find how to do it in game. Is it something along the lines of shipping the components to a research lab, and then it's automatically an option?

Thanks
Title: Re: Recovered Tech- how do I break it down?
Post by: Shadow on March 17, 2010, 08:19:19 PM: Take the components to some colony and unload them. Then, in the Industry window of said colony, click on the Stockpiles button and you'll get a list of the non-installation things stored there. The drives should be there: select them and click on Disassemble. I think the chance to obtain a new technology is pretty low, but with 45 drives you have 45 chances.

I don't know if the presence of research labs help, but just take it to your main research planet to be sure.
Title: Re: Recovered Tech- how do I break it down?
Post by: UnLimiTeD on March 17, 2010, 08:56:27 PM: Damn, I never thought of this option, despite reading about it in campaigns.
Thx for the reminder.
Title: Re: Recovered Tech- how do I break it down?
Post by: Elvin on March 18, 2010, 05:05:36 PM: Quote from: "Shadow"
Take the components to some colony and unload them. Then, in the Industry window of said colony, click on the Stockpiles button and you'll get a list of the non-installation things stored there. The drives should be there: select them and click on Disassemble. I think the chance to obtain a new technology is pretty low, but with 45 drives you have 45 chances.

I don't know if the presence of research labs help, but just take it to your main research planet to be sure.

Thanks, and the percentage chance must be really small. After dismantling all 45 of them, not a bit of research found towards the tech.

Anyone know if it's a higher % chance for each subsequent disassembly, or if it's just a flat rate? Personally I think it should be a cumulative probability, increasing with each one destroyed, as that seems sensible.
Title: Re: Recovered Tech- how do I break it down?
Post by: Steve Walmsley on March 18, 2010, 05:49:18 PM: Quote from: "Elvin"
Quote from: "Shadow"
Take the components to some colony and unload them. Then, in the Industry window of said colony, click on the Stockpiles button and you'll get a list of the non-installation things stored there. The drives should be there: select them and click on Disassemble. I think the chance to obtain a new technology is pretty low, but with 45 drives you have 45 chances. :). It is definitely a 1 in 40 chance.

I could add a specific cumulative chance but in effect that is already built in. Disassembling ten items gives you ten times the chance of new tech compared to disassembling just one (well slightly less than that but close enough - it would be a (39/40)^10 chance of failure for 10 compared to a 97.5% chance for 1)

Steve
Title: Re: Recovered Tech- how do I break it down?
Post by: Shadow on March 18, 2010, 07:01:03 PM: Well, every dismantled component could give a bonus to further dismantling of the same kind of component (perhaps the exact same). Having the same 2.5% chance per try implies your engineers are constantly bashing the thing with wrenches as opposed to learning more about it with every try, even if they can't quite grasp the whole technology. You'd think they'd know more about an advanced drive when reverse-engineering their 20th specimen, as opposed to the first.

Alternatively, instead of providing an invisible bonus to a chance for complete discovery, every dismantled specimen could provide a fixed (or somewhat variable) number of said technology's* RPs. This way, you could eventually unlock the technology or have the scientists use the engineers' insight to research the tech in question with a headstart (or even with most of the work done, if a lot of RPs have been collected beforehand).

*Or a previous, related technology if the component's so advanced you can't research its immediate tech right away.
Title: Re: Recovered Tech- how do I break it down?
Post by: sandman662 on March 19, 2010, 02:44:18 PM: Another option, (assuming it doesn't already do this) would be to at least get some minerals from it. A small amount, but at least something that takes the sting out of 40 failures in a row !!
Title: Re: Recovered Tech- how do I break it down?
Post by: Steve Walmsley on March 19, 2010, 02:56:17 PM: Quote from: "Shadow"
Alternatively, instead of providing an invisible bonus to a chance for complete discovery, every dismantled specimen could provide a fixed (or somewhat variable) number of said technology's* RPs. This way, you could eventually unlock the technology or have the scientists use the engineers' insight to research the tech in question with a headstart (or even with most of the work done, if a lot of RPs have been collected beforehand).
I think your idea would work better than the current system. At least disassembly would give some indication of progress rather than nothing almost all the time. I'll change it for 5.1 so that disassembly provides from 1-5% of the required research points for each eligible background tech

Steve
Title: Re: Recovered Tech- how do I break it down?
Post by: sandman662 on March 19, 2010, 03:10:21 PM: Yes Steve, I do like Shadow's suggestion. That would make sense AND be awesome
Title: Re: Recovered Tech- how do I break it down?
Post by: UnLimiTeD on March 19, 2010, 03:13:28 PM: Does that mean we normally only have one?
Title: Re: Recovered Tech- how do I break it down?
Post by: Shadow on March 19, 2010, 04:02:35 PM: Quote from: "Steve Walmsley"
Quote from: "Shadow"
Alternatively, instead of providing an invisible bonus to a chance for complete discovery, every dismantled specimen could provide a fixed (or somewhat variable) number of said technology's* RPs. This way, you could eventually unlock the technology or have the scientists use the engineers' insight to research the tech in question with a headstart (or even with most of the work done, if a lot of RPs have been collected beforehand).
I think your idea would work better than the current system. At least disassembly would give some indication of progress rather than nothing almost all the time. I'll change it for 5.1 so that disassembly provides from 1-5% of the required research points for each eligible background tech

Steve
Excellent!
Title: Re: Recovered Tech- how do I break it down?
Post by: Shadow on March 20, 2010, 09:06:00 AM: Oh, and by the way, this may be a given but if a component makes use of technologies less advanced than yours, those fields shouldn't be aided by said component's disassembly.

I mean, for instance, let's say you retrieve an active sensor that uses Active Grav Sensor Strength 21 and EM Sensor Sensitivity 6, and your current technologies in that area are AGSS 16 and EMSS 8. In this case, disassembly should contribute to AGSS research, but not that of EMSS.
Title: Re: Recovered Tech- how do I break it down?
Post by: sandman662 on March 22, 2010, 09:07:32 AM: I just got a "Tech Data Scanned" Event type from a wreck salvaged. It told me that I got 800 research points for Ceramic Composite Armour & 1500 research points for Ceramic Composite Armour. I don't have the tech, nor am I researching it, but when I go to the research panel, I see that Ceramic Composite Armour costs 10000 RPs. Shouldn't that be 7700/10000 now?
Title: Re: Recovered Tech- how do I break it down?
Post by: Elvin on March 22, 2010, 10:06:32 AM: Quote from: "sandman662"
I just got a "Tech Data Scanned" Event type from a wreck salvaged. It told me that I got 800 research points for Ceramic Composite Armour & 1500 research points for Ceramic Composite Armour. I don't have the tech, nor am I researching it, but when I go to the research panel, I see that Ceramic Composite Armour costs 10000 RPs. Shouldn't that be 7700/10000 now?

I think the ship has to make it back to your colony- check out it's info tabs, somewhere I seem to remember it listing research tech.
Title: Re: Recovered Tech- how do I break it down?
Post by: sandman662 on March 22, 2010, 10:10:39 AM: Ok, will do and I'll let you know if that works

Thank you!
Title: Re: Recovered Tech- how do I break it down?
Post by: Hawkeye on March 22, 2010, 11:39:42 AM: Quote from: "Elvin"
Quote from: "sandman662"
I just got a "Tech Data Scanned" Event type from a wreck salvaged. It told me that I got 800 research points for Ceramic Composite Armour & 1500 research points for Ceramic Composite Armour. I don't have the tech, nor am I researching it, but when I go to the research panel, I see that Ceramic Composite Armour costs 10000 RPs. Shouldn't that be 7700/10000 now?

I think the ship has to make it back to your colony- check out it's info tabs, somewhere I seem to remember it listing research tech.

Correct, once you enter your system, you will get a message reading: "Tech download! 2300 research points in Ceramic Composite Armor downloaded" or something along that line.
Title: Re: Recovered Tech- how do I break it down?
Post by: James Patten on March 22, 2010, 01:35:43 PM: HOWEVER - if there's multiple colonies between your location and the colony you want to have the data (such as your homeworld or a major research colony) you should go into the ship's individual record (F6 tab I think?) and disable the download (there's a checkbox somewhere) - otherwise the first colony you encounter, whether it's a brand new one with barely a million people or one with 500 million, will get the information. And there's no sharing between colonies.
Title: Re: Recovered Tech- how do I break it down?
Post by: sandman662 on March 22, 2010, 03:58:55 PM: Ah, got you. Thanks!!
Title: Re: Recovered Tech- how do I break it down?
Post by: sandman662 on March 22, 2010, 07:37:46 PM: Ok, made it home and have tested your solutions and you are right. What an awesome way of handling the tech finds. This game is really great!!!!
Title: Re: Recovered Tech- how do I break it down?
Post by: Steve Walmsley on March 23, 2010, 01:21:49 AM: Quote from: "Shadow"
Oh, and by the way, this may be a given but if a component makes use of technologies less advanced than yours, those fields shouldn't be aided by said component's disassembly.

I mean, for instance, let's say you retrieve an active sensor that uses Active Grav Sensor Strength 21 and EM Sensor Sensitivity 6, and your current technologies in that area are AGSS 16 and EMSS 8. In this case, disassembly should contribute to AGSS research, but not that of EMSS.
Yes, that is already how it works

Steve
Title: Re: Recovered Tech- how do I break it down?
Post by: Steve Walmsley on March 23, 2010, 01:23:15 AM: Quote from: "James Patten"
HOWEVER - if there's multiple colonies between your location and the colony you want to have the data (such as your homeworld or a major research colony) you should go into the ship's individual record (F6 tab I think?) and disable the download (there's a checkbox somewhere) - otherwise the first colony you encounter, whether it's a brand new one with barely a million people or one with 500 million, will get the information. And there's no sharing between colonies.
The checkbox is on the "History / Notes / Tech Data" tab on the Ship window, where you can also see what tech data a ship is carrying.

Steve