Aurora 4x
New Players => The Academy => Topic started by: Foolcow on April 13, 2011, 11:22:29 AM
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There's no such order on the Task Group screen, and I can't find such an option anywhere.
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On the second tab of the taskgroups screen (special orders and organization).
Near the bottom left of that tab, there is a button called Task Force Training, or something like that.
You need to create a Fleet Headquarters and assign someone with an operations bonus to Operations before they get TF experience. IIRC anyway.
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You'll also need to set a waypoint somewhere in the system. I usually drop one in the middle of the star.
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You'll also need to set a waypoint somewhere in the system. I usually drop one in the middle of the star.
No, you needn't do that.
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I didn't know about this operations bonus thing. My force seemed to be getting trained just by having captains with crew training on all the ships.
Question: If I have a task group, and its trained up, and merge with it an untrained ship, that single ship will perform poorly in the fleet action but not diminish their companions, yes?
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I didn't know about this operations bonus thing. My force seemed to be getting trained just by having captains with crew training on all the ships.
Question: If I have a task group, and its trained up, and merge with it an untrained ship, that single ship will perform poorly in the fleet action but not diminish their companions, yes?
If you have the option checked on the combat screen to sync fire it will.
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What influences the speed of TF training is the individual ships' COs Crew Training Bonus (and possibly his Operations bonus, if any), followed by the Task Force's (not TG's) commander's. All modified by the Task Force's Operations Officer's Operations and Crew Training bonus.
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No, you needn't do that.
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I used to get error spam if I had no waypoints. Steve must've changed that, I guess.
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???
Task Force Training was never a "targeted" task, as far as I can remember.
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It never required a target, but if the system had no defined WPs it'd get pissy. I don't recall if it involved pop-up error messages or just spam on the event list (which may or may not be viewable without SM mode).
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It was a bug that got fixed in 5.1 or 5.2.
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I used to get error spam if I had no waypoints. Steve must've changed that, I guess.
That was a v5.11 bug that was fixed in v5.13
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My task group is training what feels like really slowly. Like, way faster than the advancement of my technology. I have a 25% operations officer-- is this just too crappy to expect solid results? My maintenence clock on some of these ships is 3.5 years. And they have a 50% TF training and on average a 20% grade bonus.
Is this just par for the course for a first-fleet? Would you take them on a sortie in this condition?
My plan was to train them up higher, roll back their clocks at home, and then take them out to see how they fare against some aliens, but this is taking seriously forever.
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Try assigning a high-training task force commander, instead of someone with a training bonus on operations.
The task force commander provides everybody with the full training bonus.
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It's very strange, but I have a few new ships fresh out of the yards, and they have -7% crew grade bonus. Anyone know why this is?
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You either have your training level at one or you've run out of trained crewmen. See the Race Details (Ctrl-F2) window and the Team/Academy tab of the Population (F2) window.
Edit: Also, see this post (http://aurora2.pentarch.org/index.php/topic,227.0.html).
Reason for strike: if you had enough level 1 crewmen the ship would start at 0%
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Thanks! I never even knew the crew had to come from academies!
Now to look up my ship production rate vs crew required. I have a feeling that I will need a large number of new academies... (luckily, I can build a 2.4k cost structure in 10 days...)
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The Ettin needs 1233 crew and the Chimera needs 724. And I can build a batch of 2 Ettins and 4 Chimeras in half a year. At 1k recruits per year per academy, that's 10 724 crew per year, or 11 academies. And that's not including my FAC production and various support ships as well! Which will add half as much again!
Bloody hell, that's alot of academies! Guess I'll just build another 17 or so... >.<
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Are you doing fleet training with the new ships? Untrained crew will get grade points pretty quickly from that.
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It's very strange, but I have a few new ships fresh out of the yards, and they have -7% crew grade bonus. Anyone know why this is?
You haven't built enough military academies, and ran out of crew in the crew pool. Look on the Teams/Academy tab of the F2 screen. In the upper right corner, you should see "Crewmen and Junior Officers". My number right now is 96, which means I've only got 96 unassigned trained crew in the entire navy. If I built a new ship requiring 400 crew, then only ~25% would be trained an the rest woudl have a -12% or so crew grade - this would balance out to something like the -7% you're seeing.
To solve it, build more academies.
John
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To help alleviate this somewhat, you can set commercial (colonizers/freighters) ships to use conscript crews.
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It's very strange, but I have a few new ships fresh out of the yards, and they have -7% crew grade bonus. Anyone know why this is?
I believe that means you ran out of available trained crewmen (of which a military academy trains a certain number each year) and the rest had to be conscripts.
EDIT: Whoops, a bit late to the party here, about four people had already answered this one. :)
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Yes, I am doing fleet training. The ships do nothing but train actually, since I have nothing to shoot.
Some of my earliest ships have reached just under 20% crew grade bonus.
Given the numbers in that thread you linked, it also appears I will end up recruiting too many officers, maybe.
And the numbers I calculated were on the old times, before the recent ship build rate increase, so I can build 3 batches of ships per year now.
I'll need 25 academies? Maybe? I could be building academies for an entire year non-stop!
I also forgot to count my escort frigates (which can be built at a rate of 3 batches of 3 per year) and the upcoming designs/shipyards for laser frigate (10 planned), spy frigate (2 planned), light FAC carrier (6 planned), decoy drone frigate (still on drawing board).
Add in coillers, jumpships, gate construction ships, maintenance PDCs, salvage, tankers & resupply, maintenance vessels, ... aaaaa...
And to think I planned for starting the 15 kton cruiser production within 2 years! Which once that starts, will churn out 2 batches of 2 cruisers a year, and add an escort destroyer design!
Might have to put most of that off for the foreseeable future or resort to conscript crews.
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Yes, I am doing fleet training. The ships do nothing but train actually, since I have nothing to shoot.
Just to be clear, "Fleet training" changes the TF training level of a ship (last column on the F12 screen), not the crew grade ("Grade Bonus" - 2nd to last). The crew grade is determined by the the initial crew makeup (you pick the racial training level, and if you run out of crew they're mixed with conscripts) and is increased by assigning a captain to the ship with a non-zero crew training rating - the grade bonus will keep up whether the ship's in orbit, doing fleet training, or even in overhaul/refit (unless Steve fixed that last bit). IIRC you can also get grade bonus points by being in combat (I think it's actually by being damaged in combat :) )
Fleet training only affects the TF training. BTW, ships with a very poor grade bonus (e.g. -12%) gain TF training points veeeeery sloooooowly.
John
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Add in coillers, jumpships, gate construction ships, maintenance PDCs, salvage, tankers & resupply, maintenance vessels, ... aaaaa...
Use conscripts for all of these (except maybe jumpships, depends how you're using them). If it doesn't need to respond quickly in combat or fire a weapon... Conscript crews all the way.
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sloanjh:
I might as well train them anyway. Some TF points is better than no TF points and when they're out training, they aren't sucking resources for maintenance.
Yes, my fleet is big enough that it is becoming a significant factor.
Then again, going by the numbers of missiles people throw around, my fleet missile output per 50 seconds is of comparable size to most alpha strikes from a fighter wing. (310 size 5 missiles per 50 seconds. And I estimate I could double the size of my fleet in just over a year)
So perhaps I could slow down ship production a wee bit. =) 'sides, my missiles stocks are roughly on the order of 5 minutes shooting.
Too much focus on expanding my production base I see. I can build ships faster than I can find people to crew them!
Narmio:
Yeah, I went through and set alot of stuff to conscript crews only. I'm still running out though.
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sloanjh:
I might as well train them anyway. Some TF points is better than no TF points and when they're out training, they aren't sucking resources for maintenance.
Yes, my fleet is big enough that it is becoming a significant factor.
How many fuel factories/sorium to you have? ;D (That's the closest I can get to Big Evil Grin here).
John
PS - they'll suck the maintenance resources when you overhaul them. Overhaul uses maintenance at a multiplied rate - I think it's 4x to match the rate at which the clock unwinds. TANSTAAFL ;D
John
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Fuel refineries? 400 and so far not a problem. My fuel count is still increasing (68 million+) even when I took my ships out for a spin into a possibly precursor system, more to iron out little problems like fuel and maintenance than to actually shoot something.
Results were satisfactory. Didn't seem to burn too much fuel.
It's also the reason why I don't deploy my FAC fleet and why I'm trying build light FAC carriers. FAC engines will gobble all my fuel. I don't want to have to support 30 FACs running around all the time.
(FYI, I train the whole fleet together. Including coillers and troop transports, of which there are only 5 so far. The slow speed of my support ships keeps fuel costs of training down. Almost nil in fact since the troop transport doesn't have engines... XD)
- My logic is that I don't want to spend BP building engines for ships that spend alot of time idling in orbit. Government cargo, colony, jump gate construction and troop transports do not have engines. I attach tugs to them when I need them. The tugs see far more use than the ships themselves.
I did not know about the maintenance resource use. I shall watch my maintenance facilities to see if it does.
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(FYI, I train the whole fleet together. Including coillers and troop transports, of which there are only 5 so far. The slow speed of my support ships keeps fuel costs of training down. Almost nil in fact since the troop transport doesn't have engines... XD)
This is arguably a bug/exploit that Steve should probably fix - I'm pretty sure it wasn't intentional (unlike the fact that FAC/fighters don't suck fuel while training in hangar bays). The major expense for training is fuel; one shouldn't be able to cut this cost to zero by sticking a speed-1 ship in the mix. A previous version of this exploit that Steve did fix was to set your TG to 1 before starting training.
- My logic is that I don't want to spend BP building engines for ships that spend alot of time idling in orbit. Government cargo, colony, jump gate construction and troop transports do not have engines. I attach tugs to them when I need them. The tugs see far more use than the ships themselves.
Yeah!!! This is a strategy that I've long advocated/used (albeit only for ships that spend lots of time idling, unlike cargo/colony ships).
John
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Well, I could always build PDCs with hangar bays to train my FACs. And use the light carriers when those get built.
I can support the fuel consumption of my normal ship movements. It's the FACs that I can't support.
Sigh. It looks like my days of peace are over.
My jumpship that I've been using to probe jumppoints enters the system of Freehaven from Val Alorn.
There's a stable wormhole in there.
Well, crap. Some Freehaven that was.
And it's 5 jumps away from my home system, which makes it uncomfortably far away to picket. =(
I only hope it will take them time to pass through the Val Alorn system while I build up my fleet and missile stocks.
So screw the crew training. I need more ships even if they have to have totally conscript crews! Against those invaders, I suspect I will need every last missile I can throw.
Perhaps I could make an ammo and fuel dump in the Riva system which is at the end of my jumpgate chain and an important warppoint nexus... *mutters about fleet strategy and goes to implement*
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Also, my cargo ships and colony ships do spend alot of time idling. I tend to use government contracts for general transport instead of doing it myself.
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Ammo and fuel dumps are absolute lifesavers for long-distance long-term ops. I use tons of them, as well as remote maintenance facilities. This game is all about the logistics, which is pretty awesome.
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PS - they'll suck the maintenance resources when you overhaul them. Overhaul uses maintenance at a multiplied rate - I think it's 4x to match the rate at which the clock unwinds. TANSTAAFL ;D
Actually, I don't think so.
Currently, my 20 Chimeras are using 379 duranium per year at my maintenance.
At the current time of posting, the last three chimeras to be built have just finished their overhaul.
The production window still says 379 duranium per year.
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You ran out of trained crew pool, so they have to use recruits (which start from -10%) to crew the vessels.
Increase the number of academies you have and/or reduce your racial training level.
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Incidentally, since maintenance facilities use resources, what creates maintenance supplies? Maintenance facilities? I'm confused, my supplies are at 0.
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Maintenance Supplies are in the drop down production menu on the left - Installations.. Missiles... Fighters...................Maintenance Supplies right at the bottom - build them like any other Industrial project.
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ah ha! learn something new every day. or in this game, every fifteen minutes.
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To be fair, Maintenance Facilities used to build maintenance supplies, before Steve changed the way they worked.
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I think the maintence faiclities-maintence supplies need a rework anyway or some expansion and streamlining