Aurora 4x
VB6 Aurora => Bureau of Ship Design => Topic started by: Galwail on August 05, 2012, 04:00:58 AM
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Yes, this is another "My very first combat ship, will I get absolutely destroyed in the first combat?" thread :) Are these two designs any good? Do they have any chance at all against missile alpha strikes? Aren't they too slow for beam ships? Shouldn't I drop those small shields and take more engineering spaces/maintenance storage for more on-field repairs?
Broadsword class Destroyer 8 000 tons 777 Crew 1349 BP TCS 160 TH 240 EM 240
3000 km/s Armour 10-35 Shields 8-300 Sensors 12/12/0/0 Damage Control Rating 16 PPV 36
Maint Life 6.9 Years MSP 632 AFR 85% IFR 1.2% 1YR 23 5YR 347 Max Repair 54 MSP
Ion Engine E8 (8) Power 60 Fuel Use 80% Signature 30 Armour 0 Exp 5%
Fuel Capacity 250 000 Litres Range 70.3 billion km (271 days at full power)
Gamma R300/16 Shields (4) Total Fuel Cost 64 Litres per day
15cm C3 Near Ultraviolet Laser (9) Range 180 000km TS: 3000 km/s Power 6-3 RM 3 ROF 10 6 6 6 4 3 3 2 2 2 1
Fire Control S04 96-3000 H70 (1) Max Range: 192 000 km TS: 3000 km/s 95 90 84 79 74 69 64 58 53 48
Gas-Cooled Fast Reactor Technology PB-1 (6) Total Power Output 27 Armour 0 Exp 5%
Active Search Sensor MR12-R80 (70%) (1) GPS 1920 Range 12.9m km Resolution 80
Thermal Sensor TH2-12 (70%) (1) Sensitivity 12 Detect Sig Strength 1000: 12m km
EM Detection Sensor EM2-12 (70%) (1) Sensitivity 12 Detect Sig Strength 1000: 12m km
This design is classed as a Military Vessel for maintenance purposes
Socrates class Destroyer Escort 8 000 tons 670 Crew 1382.8 BP TCS 160 TH 240 EM 240
3000 km/s Armour 9-35 Shields 8-300 Sensors 12/12/0/0 Damage Control Rating 15 PPV 35.4
Maint Life 4.82 Years MSP 594 AFR 93% IFR 1.3% 1YR 42 5YR 633 Max Repair 108 MSP
Ion Engine E8 (8) Power 60 Fuel Use 80% Signature 30 Armour 0 Exp 5%
Fuel Capacity 250 000 Litres Range 70.3 billion km (271 days at full power)
Gamma R300/16 Shields (4) Total Fuel Cost 64 Litres per day
Twin 12cm C4 Near Ultraviolet Laser Turret (3x2) Range 120 000km TS: 15000 km/s Power 8-8 RM 3 ROF 5 4 4 4 3 2 2 1 1 1 1
Fire Control S03 72-3000 (1) Max Range: 144 000 km TS: 3000 km/s 93 86 79 72 65 58 51 44 37 31
Fire Control S08 48-12000 H70 (1) Max Range: 96 000 km TS: 12000 km/s 90 79 69 58 48 38 27 17 6 0
Gas-Cooled Fast Reactor Technology PB-1 (6) Total Power Output 27 Armour 0 Exp 5%
Active Search Sensor MR1-R1 (70%) (1) GPS 24 Range 1.4m km Resolution 1
Thermal Sensor TH2-12 (70%) (1) Sensitivity 12 Detect Sig Strength 1000: 12m km
EM Detection Sensor EM2-12 (70%) (1) Sensitivity 12 Detect Sig Strength 1000: 12m km
This design is classed as a Military Vessel for maintenance purposes
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Yes, this is another "My very first combat ship, will I get absolutely destroyed in the first combat?" thread :) Are these two designs any good? Do they have any chance at all against missile alpha strikes?
Against a large alpha strike? No chance at all I am afraid. Reasonably you could expect enemy missiles with a speed of say 30k km/s. So your ship might down maybe 2 missiles per tick.
Aren't they too slow for beam ships?
Yeah, unless you wish to camp on a jump point. They are unlikely to close in with enemy shis.
Shouldn't I drop those small shields and take more engineering spaces/maintenance storage for more on-field repairs?
Or just drop the shields and get faster. Repair capacity is actually quite large already, depending on what you wnat to do with the ships-
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Repair capacity is actually quite large already, depending on what you wnat to do with the ships-
Don't know . . . fight stuff? :D
Or just drop the shields and get faster.
I can boost them by another 1000 km/s, but I don't know if I can go much higher than that. Engines on those ships already take 33% of the space ???
Broadsword class Destroyer 9 000 tons 870 Crew 1531.6 BP TCS 180 TH 360 EM 0
4000 km/s Armour 10-38 Shields 0-0 Sensors 12/12/0/0 Damage Control Rating 16 PPV 36
Maint Life 6.28 Years MSP 691 AFR 99% IFR 1.4% 1YR 30 5YR 452 Max Repair 54 MSP
Ion Engine E8 (12) Power 60 Fuel Use 80% Signature 30 Armour 0 Exp 5%
Fuel Capacity 250 000 Litres Range 62.5 billion km (180 days at full power)
15cm C3 Near Ultraviolet Laser (9) Range 180 000km TS: 4000 km/s Power 6-3 RM 3 ROF 10 6 6 6 4 3 3 2 2 2 1
Fire Control S04 96-3000 H70 (1) Max Range: 192 000 km TS: 3000 km/s 95 90 84 79 74 69 64 58 53 48
Gas-Cooled Fast Reactor Technology PB-1 (6) Total Power Output 27 Armour 0 Exp 5%
Active Search Sensor MR12-R80 (70%) (1) GPS 1920 Range 12.9m km Resolution 80
Thermal Sensor TH2-12 (70%) (1) Sensitivity 12 Detect Sig Strength 1000: 12m km
EM Detection Sensor EM2-12 (70%) (1) Sensitivity 12 Detect Sig Strength 1000: 12m km
This design is classed as a Military Vessel for maintenance purposes
Socrates class Destroyer Escort 9 000 tons 759 Crew 1562.2 BP TCS 180 TH 360 EM 0
4000 km/s Armour 9-38 Shields 0-0 Sensors 12/12/0/0 Damage Control Rating 15 PPV 35.4
Maint Life 4.2 Years MSP 597 AFR 117% IFR 1.6% 1YR 54 5YR 813 Max Repair 108 MSP
Ion Engine E8 (12) Power 60 Fuel Use 80% Signature 30 Armour 0 Exp 5%
Fuel Capacity 250 000 Litres Range 62.5 billion km (180 days at full power)
Twin 12cm C4 Near Ultraviolet Laser Turret (3x2) Range 120 000km TS: 15000 km/s Power 8-8 RM 3 ROF 5 4 4 4 3 2 2 1 1 1 1
Fire Control S03 72-3000 (1) Max Range: 144 000 km TS: 3000 km/s 93 86 79 72 65 58 51 44 37 31
Fire Control S08 48-12000 H70 (1) Max Range: 96 000 km TS: 12000 km/s 90 79 69 58 48 38 27 17 6 0
Gas-Cooled Fast Reactor Technology PB-1 (6) Total Power Output 27 Armour 0 Exp 5%
Active Search Sensor MR1-R1 (70%) (1) GPS 24 Range 1.4m km Resolution 1
Thermal Sensor TH2-12 (70%) (1) Sensitivity 12 Detect Sig Strength 1000: 12m km
EM Detection Sensor EM2-12 (70%) (1) Sensitivity 12 Detect Sig Strength 1000: 12m km
This design is classed as a Military Vessel for maintenance purposes
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33% is not /that/ high. You need to be pretty fast! If you arn't faster than the enemy ship, you're pretty much useless... unless the designed role of the ship is mostly as an anti-missile escort and less as a secondary warship. It also greatly increases the capabilities of certain beam weapons, particularly railguns.
I would mention that you should primarily be using short range res-1 active sensors. There's little point to mounting larger range sensors, since you can't hurt anything outside beam range anyway. You probably want something heftier than the MR1-R1 on the Socrates though; it will have trouble seeing missiles in a timely manner.
I think mostly it seems you're not quite sure what you want to use these designs for, except in the vague sense that you need a beam warship. If you want them to protect a planetary asset, or a particular class of missile warships, design them accordingly.
Some example ion-age beam destroyers:
Invincible class Paladin 5,000 tons 519 Crew 844 BP TCS 100 TH 600 EM 0
6000 km/s Armour 6-26 Shields 0-0 Sensors 1/1/0/0 Damage Control Rating 2 PPV 18
Maint Life 3.03 Years MSP 211 AFR 100% IFR 1.4% 1YR 34 5YR 517 Max Repair 144 MSP
Ion Jet (10) Power 60 Fuel Use 100% Signature 60 Armour 0 Exp 5%
Fuel Capacity 90,000 Litres Range 32.4 billion km (62 days at full power)
Heavy Blast Cannon (3x4) Range 120,000km TS: 6000 km/s Power 9-3 RM 4 ROF 15 3 3 3 3 2 2 1 1 1 1
128/6 Boresight (1) Max Range: 256,000 km TS: 6000 km/s 96 92 88 84 80 77 73 69 65 61
Gas-Cooled Fast Reactor (2) Total Power Output 9 Armour 0 Exp 5%
Z-Band Scanner (1) GPS 20 Range 2.1m km Resolution 1
Z-Band Beacon (1) GPS 2 Range 170k km Resolution 1
This is a dedicated attack ship, designed to run down enemy ships while shooting down or absorbing attacks directed at it. Therefore, it mounts huge engines and few frills. Railguns have an advantage in small designs such as this, since on fast ships they can still function in both roles without huge or redundant fire controls. So despite mounting no explicit antimissile capability, it is still capable of defending itself or others.
Vigilance class Escort Cruiser 3,000 tons 251 Crew 514.8 BP TCS 60 TH 132 EM 0
2200 km/s Armour 5-18 Shields 0-0 Sensors 1/1/0/0 Damage Control Rating 1 PPV 23.55
Maint Life 3.58 Years MSP 134 AFR 57% IFR 0.8% 1YR 16 5YR 241 Max Repair 115 MSP
Magazine 45
Type 17 Thruster (2) Power 66 Fuel Use 96% Signature 66 Armour 0 Exp 10%
Fuel Capacity 60,000 Litres Range 37.5 billion km (197 days at full power)
Gladius NUV Blaster (4x1) Range 90,000km TS: 16000 km/s Power 3-3 RM 3 ROF 5 3 3 3 2 1 1 1 1 1 0
Type 48 Vanguard (1) Max Range: 96,000 km TS: 16000 km/s 90 79 69 58 48 38 27 17 6 0
Gas-Cooled Fast Reactor (3) Total Power Output 13.5 Armour 0 Exp 5%
Torpedo Rail (9) Missile Size 5 Hangar Reload 37.5 minutes MF Reload 6.2 hours
Torpedo Guidance (1) Range 8.8m km Resolution 70
T-20 (9) Speed: 20,000 km/s End: 8.2m Range: 9.9m km WH: 9 Size: 5 TH: 80 / 48 / 24
Quantum-Slave Controller (1) GPS 16 Range 1.8m km Resolution 1
This class is designed to defend large motherships and planets. It doesn't even attempt to be faster than other ships. Since its light anti-missile lasers lack range, it mounts a rack of heavy short range missiles to even the odds.
Spruance class Destroyer Escort 9,000 tons 1003 Crew 1621.5 BP TCS 180 TH 720 EM 0
4000 km/s Armour 3-38 Shields 0-0 Sensors 1/1/0/0 Damage Control Rating 5 PPV 64
Maint Life 2.56 Years MSP 563 AFR 129% IFR 1.8% 1YR 120 5YR 1805 Max Repair 384 MSP
Rolls Royce Ion Drive (12) Power 60 Fuel Use 70% Signature 60 Armour 0 Exp 5%
Fuel Capacity 200,000 Litres Range 57.1 billion km (165 days at full power)
Triple 15cm C3 Ultraviolet Laser Turret (4x3) Range 240,000km TS: 16000 km/s Power 18-9 RM 4 ROF 10 6 6 6 6 4 4 3 3 2 2
SN/SPG-9 Beam Fire Control (1) Max Range: 320,000 km TS: 16000 km/s 97 94 91 88 84 81 78 75 72 69
Large Gas-Cooled Fast Reactor (2) Total Power Output 36 Armour 0 Exp 5%
SN/SPS-10 Missile Detection Sensor (1) GPS 63 Range 6.9m km Resolution 1
Steve's Spruance-class destroyer from the Space Race campaign is directly comparable to your ships in size and speed. Relatively speaking, it sacrifices armor to mount a huge long range laser array with a maximized FC to match. IIRC, it's designed to escort the huge missile cruisers and fleet carriers of that campaign.
Cerberus class Monitor 9,000 tons 1048 Crew 1724 BP TCS 180 TH 720 EM 0
4000 km/s Armour 8-38 Shields 0-0 Sensors 1/1/0/0 Damage Control Rating 19 PPV 48
Maint Life 18.62 Years MSP 2275 AFR 34% IFR 0.5% 1YR 12 5YR 187 Max Repair 96 MSP
Rolls Royce RR80 Magneto-Plasma Drive (9) Power 80 Fuel Use 60% Signature 80 Armour 0 Exp 5%
Fuel Capacity 100,000 Litres Range 33.3 billion km (96 days at full power)
20cm C4 Ultraviolet Laser (8) Range 320,000km TS: 6250 km/s Power 10-4 RM 4 ROF 15 10 10 10 10 8 6 5 5 4 4
SN/SPG-7 Beam Fire Control (2) Max Range: 320,000 km TS: 4000 km/s 97 94 91 88 84 81 78 75 72 69
Stellarator Fusion Reactor (7) Total Power Output 42 Armour 0 Exp 5%
SN/SPN-27 Navigation Sensor (1) GPS 1680 Range 30.4m km Resolution 60
ECCM-1 (1) ECM 10
I also wanted to include Steve's Monitor from that same campaign, as an example of a dedicated jump point control ship. This particular example goes for extreme firepower and range in exchange for speed. Personally, I favor fast vessels for jump point control, to the extent that I still do that. Your Broadsword is very similar to this design, though lower-technology.
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I tend to build my generic beam warships as primarily anti-missile. They have more high speed anti-missile lasers. But they also pack a secondary, heavier armament. This is because I can find that when assaulting a planet, I may not have enough missiles to defeat their planetary AMMs and destroy the defending PDCs, but that larger laser has enough range that my missiles can cause them to expend all their AMM and the laser can outrange their beam defence, thus making it easy to pick them off unmolested afterwards.
Although of course, every design is highly circumstantial, depending on your own particular game and your own particular enemies.
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When I play beam ships, I'm also generally playing with nebulae. That, of course, is where beams excel. Jump point defense is the other area, as ships tend to have some blind time after making a jump, and will always be at a relatively close range.
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Here's my ion engine era beam ship from my latest game:
Scheer II class Destroyer 4,000 tons 477 Crew 678.8 BP TCS 80 TH 264 EM 0
6600 km/s Armour 2-22 Shields 0-0 Sensors 1/1/0/0 Damage Control Rating 4 PPV 18
Maint Life 9.27 Years MSP 424 AFR 32% IFR 0.4% 1YR 9 5YR 133 Max Repair 50 MSP
Ion Engine ME8.4 (8) Power 66 Fuel Use 84% Signature 33 Armour 0 Exp 10%
Fuel Capacity 190,000 Litres Range 101.8 billion km (178 days at full power)
10cm Railgun V1/C3 (6x4) Range 10,000km TS: 6600 km/s Power 3-3 RM 1 ROF 5 1 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0
Fire Control S1.5 12-9000 (1) Max Range: 24,000 km TS: 9000 km/s 58 17 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0
GCFR S1 P4.5 (4) Total Power Output 18 Armour 0 Exp 5%
This design is classed as a Military Vessel for maintenance purposes
This is just a final defensive fire early game ship.
Heres the replacement for the next tech level:
Scheer III class Cruiser 8,000 tons 962 Crew 1927 BP TCS 160 TH 736 EM 0
9200 km/s Armour 3-35 Shields 0-0 Sensors 1/1/0/0 Damage Control Rating 16 PPV 30
Maint Life 18.09 Years MSP 2409 AFR 32% IFR 0.4% 1YR 14 5YR 209 Max Repair 86 MSP
Magneto-plasma Drive ME7.8 (16) Power 92 Fuel Use 78% Signature 46 Armour 0 Exp 12%
Fuel Capacity 390,000 Litres Range 112.5 billion km (141 days at full power)
10cm Railgun V4/C3 (10x4) Range 40,000km TS: 9200 km/s Power 3-3 RM 4 ROF 5 1 1 1 1 0 0 0 0 0 0
Fire Control S4.5 48-12000 (1) Max Range: 96,000 km TS: 12000 km/s 90 79 69 58 48 38 27 17 6 0
SFR S1 P6 (5) Total Power Output 30 Armour 0 Exp 5%
Search 335k - Missile (1) GPS 28 Range 3.1m km Resolution 1
This design is classed as a Military Vessel for maintenance purposes
More range was put in so that they could actually shoot at other ships. The price shot way up for this one, size and tech are expensive. also fairly maintenence heavy, but I am parking these on jump points.
And finally a gunboat design to get the most out of my railguns tracking speed wise:
Valkyrie class Gunboat 550 tons 70 Crew 140 BP TCS 11 TH 92 EM 0
16727 km/s Armour 1-5 Shields 0-0 Sensors 1/1/0/0 Damage Control Rating 0 PPV 3
Maint Life 4.78 Years MSP 40 AFR 9% IFR 0.1% 1YR 3 5YR 43 Max Repair 69 MSP
GB Magneto-plasma Drive FACE78 (1) Power 184 Fuel Use 780% Signature 92 Armour 0 Exp 36%
Fuel Capacity 10,000 Litres Range 4.2 billion km (69 hours at full power)
10cm Railgun V4/C3 (1x4) Range 16,000km TS: 16727 km/s Power 3-3 RM 4 ROF 5 1 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0
Fire Control S01 8-16000 (1) Max Range: 16,000 km TS: 16000 km/s 37 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0
SFR S0.5 P3.45 (1) Total Power Output 3.45 Armour 0 Exp 12%
Search 3M - 5000 (1) GPS 280 Range 3.1m km Resolution 100
This design is classed as a Military Vessel for maintenance purposes
I'm using the +pow techs because at around ion propulsion they start to get RP cost effective per point of engine power, also I could probably drop fuel and maint for more armor.