Aurora 4x
New Players => The Academy => Topic started by: se5a on December 12, 2012, 03:01:55 AM
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so I've snuck up on some spoiler using thermal sensors.
before I attempt to set up a surprise party for this spoiler I want to get a better look at it with some active sensors.
My plan is to design a sensor Buoy, stick it on a stage, and fire it at the thing.
aand I suddenly have some questions:
Q1:
The wiki mentions reactor duration, but I can't see anywhere to change that on the design window.
the reactor window is greyed out, unless fuel capacity gives it a lifetime?
I don't see anything in the stats on lifetime even when I put fuel in.
Q2:
if the Buoy is a second stage, does it start beeping as soon as it's fired, or after the first stage has released it? (I suspect the spoiler will kill the buoy as soon as it sees it, and if I'm close it might investigate...)
Q3:
for mines, do I just dump a bunch of missiles(or one, whatever) which have active sensors, as a second stage on a buoy which has maybe a passive and set the separation range to the missile range?
Q3b: how long do mines hang around for? I presume Q1 may answer..
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1. In 6.00 Steve introduced buoys and mines with infinite lifetime. The Wiki is out of date.
2. Only when the second stage fires.
3. Exactly, but you may design a mine only with passive sensors to maintain secrecy. Its your choice.
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Ah cool cool.
with the seeking missile part of the mine, I guess I'm wanting to match the range of the missile itself and the range of the sensor on it, and the resolution to match what I'm expecting it to hit?
and match that with the sensor on the first stage...
if the first stage detects something that the second stage cannot see, will the secondstage detonate as soon as it's fired? or is there a fudge factor in there?
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1. Yes
2. The first stage will fire the second stage as soon as it sees something, so its better to give them fuel range matching with the sensor range of the mine and the missile.
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Wicked. thankyou.
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@se5a - If you can make a 2 stage missile work like you're attempting (i.e. first stage carries the bouy, second stage is the bouy itself) can you post again with the design for each stage? I am currently attempting the exact same thing and have been unable to make it work.
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Will do - I've had a serious Uridium deficit so things are taking a little longer than expected.
especialy since I've designed and built ships and loadouts specificaly for this mission.
another quick question: when firing at a waypoint, does the waypoint need to be in range of whatever FC you have on the ship?
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Based on previous experience shooting at hostiles, I would say yes, the target (even if it is a waypoint) needs to be in range. Beyond experience, when I was messing with this I assumed it did simply because I can't think of a good reason it wouldn't need to be in range.
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ah ok, I assume I can get away with designing a sensor with massive resolution and therefore huge range and small size for this sort of thing?
ie waypoints are considered infinite size so any FC will pick it up?
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With this FCS:
Ravenki-SBDV-FCS-001 (1) Range 3,227.0m km Resolution 155
I was able to target a waypoint that was 2,000m KM away. Keep in mind, after firing the missile wouldn't actually go anywhere...but I was definitely able to see the waypoint as a viable target.
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Rog.
I'll have to do some experimentation.
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Based on previous experience shooting at hostiles, I would say yes, the target (even if it is a waypoint) needs to be in range. Beyond experience, when I was messing with this I assumed it did simply because I can't think of a good reason it wouldn't need to be in range.
Nope.
You can fire at any waypoint, but you have to position yourself for the missile to reach the target. :)
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another quick question: when firing at a waypoint, does the waypoint need to be in range of whatever FC you have on the ship?
Nope. I've successfully launched guided missiles and buoy deployment drones at waypoints outside of the FC range.
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himn...
am I doing this wrong then?
I've told a fighter armed with a probe to fire at a waypoint next to en. the fighter, while well within the range of the probe, is flying towards the waypoint. (from the task groups window)
if I go to the individual unit details under combat settings, I'm unable to assign the FC to the waypoint I am wanting to fire at.
I was unable to assign to the waypoint that I was sitting right ontop off as well.
this is a res16 FC.
maybe I'll send the other fighter back to the ship and get one of the other active all the way probes.
edit:
Oh, maybe I need to turn it ON?
edit2:
oh, no you don't need to turn FC on.
ok managed to launch it... lets see if it heads towards the target.
edit - still don't know what I did to make it fire, but it apears that CryBaby Buoy probe is headding towards the target waypoint at 9600km/s eta 18:31:33
right sending the the Falcon class fighter back to the nest in-case this thing is smart enough to figure where it came from and send a swarm to investigate.
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Ok! Payload successfully delivered!
Intel Gathered!
ouch, lucky I didn't just open fire.
lets see what the response will be if any.
Here's the stats on what I launched it from:
Second Stage Payload:
S3 CryBaby Buoy:
Missile Size: 3 MSP (0.15 HS) Warhead: 0 Armour: 0.1 Manoeuvre Rating: 10
Speed: 0 km/s Engine Endurance: 0 minutes Range: 0.0m km
Active Sensor Strength: 0.9 Sensitivity Modifier: 140%
Resolution: 16 Maximum Range vs 800 ton object (or larger): 500,000 km
Thermal Sensor Strength: 0.54 Detect Sig Strength 1000: 540,000 km
EM Sensor Strength: 0.56 Detect Sig Strength 1000: 560,000 km
Cost Per Missile: 3.225
Chance to Hit: 1k km/s 0% 3k km/s 0% 5k km/s 0% 10k km/s 0%
Materials Required: 0.025x Tritanium 1.2x Boronide 2x Uridium Fuel x0
First Stage:
S5 CryBaby Probe:
Missile Size: 5 MSP (0.25 HS) Warhead: 0 Armour: 0 Manoeuvre Rating: 10
Speed: 9600 km/s Engine Endurance: 18.5 hours Range: 640.3m km
Cost Per Missile: 3.825
Second Stage: S3 CryBaby 500km Buoy x1
Second Stage Separation Range: 150,000 km
Overall Endurance: 19 hours Overall Range: 640.3m km
Chance to Hit: 1k km/s 96% 3k km/s 30% 5k km/s 19.2% 10k km/s 9.6%
Materials Required: 0.025x Tritanium 1.2x Boronide 2x Uridium 0.6x Gallicite Fuel x2000
fired from:
Falcon class Fighter 498 tons 8 Crew 148.65 BP TCS 9.95 TH 27.3 EM 0
7839 km/s Armour 1-5 Shields 0-0 Sensors 18/14/0/0 Damage Control Rating 0 PPV 4.35
Maint Life 5.09 Years MSP 19 AFR 19% IFR 0.3% 1YR 1 5YR 18 Max Repair 34.125 MSP
Intended Deployment Time: 1 months Spare Berths 2
Magazine 29
39 EPx1.95 Internal Fusion Drive (2) Power 39 Fuel Use 315.41% Signature 13.65 Exp 19%
Fuel Capacity 10,000 Litres Range 1.1 billion km (40 hours at full power)
Size 5 Box Launcher (1) Missile Size 5 Hangar Reload 37.5 minutes MF Reload 6.2 hours
Size 2 Box Launcher (12) Missile Size 2 Hangar Reload 15 minutes MF Reload 2.5 hours
ASwrm FC30-R16 (1) Range 30.2m km Resolution 16
S2 Scorpion 15.0mk ASwrm (12) Speed: 40,000 km/s End: 6.2m Range: 15m km WH: 4 Size: 2 TH: 493/296/148
S5 CryBaby 640mk BuoyProbe (1) Speed: 9,600 km/s End: 1111.6m Range: 640.3m km WH: 0 Size: 5 TH: 32/19/9
Thermal Sensor TH1-18 (1) Sensitivity 18 Detect Sig Strength 1000: 18m km
EM Detection Sensor EM1-14 (1) Sensitivity 14 Detect Sig Strength 1000: 14m km
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ohoh, all is not good in the hood. he's detected my second fighter.
going to have to go weapons hot and light up the drive full burn away from the NightHawk. maybe I'll be able to pick you guys up later if you bail... sorry guys. the mother-ship scout cruiser is to expensive to loose if I can help it. and she can't take on all those guys by herself. I'll try drop some mines for ya though.
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OK I designed mines,
two seeker missiles in an engineless stage that had passive sensors.
I fired a handfull of these mines at a waypoint.
which imeditely released the missiles...
is that suposed to happen?
do I need to put the mine itself in an empty stage? - so that the third stage falls away when it gets to the waypoint, then the second fires when it detects something releasing the missiles, which in-turn aim themselfs at the target?
or is there another way to do this?
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Ok, looks liek you have to assign an FC, but not assign a target.
you can't fire without assigning an FC,
if you target, ie a waypoint. then the first stage will deploy the second stage.
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Or not.
I can't reproduce the success I had then.
can somone explain to me the exact steps required?
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If you are using the FC to fire a mine at a waypoint and if that waypoint is within the mine/missile separation range it will automatically release the second stage.
Best way to fire a mine is trough the task groups screen. There should be a command: "Fire missiles" or something in that way.
And there should be a button somwhere on the bottom too doing the same thing.
So the steps for minelaying are:
1. Place a waypoint anywhere where you want.
2. Use the command "launch missiles" on that waypoint. Your ship will head there, and when it reaches the waypoint it releases the missiles assigned to missile launchers.
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The 'Msl Launch' button has been bugged for as long as I remember.
The 'launch missiles at' order still requires you to have a target assigned.
If your mine doesn't have engines, what you want to do is set a waypoint at like the sun, then set waypoints where you actually want to drop the mines. Set the sun waypoint as the FC's target, then order the tg to launch their missiles at each waypoint. Disclaimer I haven't tested this since before mine re-targeting was fixed.
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ah ok thanks guys I'll try this.
I was attempting to launch mines while being chased by a swarm. without active sensors.
I suspect some of my trouble may have also been that I may have run out of the mines, yet it appears that the launchers are still labeled thus:
Size 7 Missile Launcher (25% Reduction) #2 - S7 Viper Stealth Mine (Ready To Fire)
even though there's nothing *IN* it?
I'm guessing also that 'reload' takes no time to *load* a missile(or switch between ordnance) but it does take time to ready the tube after firing?
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ah ok thanks guys I'll try this.
I was attempting to launch mines while being chased by a swarm. without active sensors.
I suspect some of my trouble may have also been that I may have run out of the mines, yet it appears that the launchers are still labeled thus:
Size 7 Missile Launcher (25% Reduction) #2 - S7 Viper Stealth Mine (Ready To Fire)
even though there's nothing *IN* it?
I'm guessing also that 'reload' takes no time to *load* a missile(or switch between ordnance) but it does take time to ready the tube after firing?
That's the Rate of Fire tech line. Missile reload rate 1, 2, 3, etc.
Each rating equals 30 seconds reload for same sized launcher. I.E. reload rate 5, size 5 = 30 seconds. Size 10 = 60 seconds. Size 1= 5...
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I'm well aware of the reload rate, I was pointing out that it's a little confusing since it's not loading a missile that takes time(since it appears you can switch out ordnance in no time)
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I'm well aware of the reload rate, I was pointing out that it's a little confusing since it's not loading a missile that takes time(since it appears you can switch out ordnance in no time)
Do you have any extra missiles in the magazines?
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The 'Msl Launch' button has been bugged for as long as I remember.
The 'launch missiles at' order still requires you to have a target assigned.
If your mine doesn't have engines, what you want to do is set a waypoint at like the sun, then set waypoints where you actually want to drop the mines. Set the sun waypoint as the FC's target, then order the tg to launch their missiles at each waypoint. Disclaimer I haven't tested this since before mine re-targeting was fixed.
doing this worked.. I think.
except that the two fighters onboard the ship also launched their missiles (pretty sure they didn't have a target set either) - without even leaving the ship! or at least there was no notification that they'd launched. - and they're still onboard.
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doing this worked.. I think.
except that the two fighters onboard the ship also launched their missiles (pretty sure they didn't have a target set either)
To prevent this you have to unassign missiles from launchers you wish not launch.
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oh man.. it seems that if you use the 'clear all' button in the ord management, it doesn't refresh, but if you close individual unit window and go back in, the tubes are all empty.... but the missiles have completely disappeared as well. they've not gone back into stock. this is with a box launcher. while docked. the stock of missiles on the mothership has not increased either.
Edit:
Ah I see, these were actually empty since they'd fired before.
Magazine contents includes those assigned to launchers.
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Erik here's an example of what I mean about it being confusing:
Individual unit screen, Ordnance Management tab:
left window shows no 'S7 RattleSnake AGS Mine'
right window shows:
Missile Launcher #1 - S7 Viper Stealth Mine
Missile Launcher #2 - S7 RattleSnake AGS Mine
etc
Combat Summary tab:
Missile Fire Control FC1518-R120 (50%) #1: Waypoint #1 - Holding Fire
Size 7 Missile Launcher (25% Reduction) #1 - S7 Viper Stealth Mine (Ready To Fire)
Size 7 Missile Launcher (25% Reduction) #2 - S7 RattleSnake AGS Mine (Ready To Fire)
Size 7 Missile Launcher (25% Reduction) #3 (Ready To Fire)
Size 7 Missile Launcher (25% Reduction) #4 (Ready To Fire)
even though I have no S7 RattleSnakes left on this ship. the combat summary shows that missile launcher ready to fire.
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...even though I have no S7 RattleSnakes left on this ship. the combat summary shows that missile launcher ready to fire.
That is normal. If your unit has fired its last missile the launch tubes do not automatically unassign the missile type from the tube.
Of course you can not launch a missile that its assigned to a tube, but not present in the magazine.
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*shrug* to me it reads as 'none in the mag, one in the chamber'