Author Topic: Cold War Comments Thread  (Read 74175 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline Gyrfalcon

  • Bug Moderators
  • Commander
  • ***
  • G
  • Posts: 331
  • Thanked: 199 times
Re: Cold War Comments Thread
« Reply #360 on: March 13, 2021, 12:45:14 PM »
Sounds good - you can always drill down and expand on interesting events when something extraordinary happens.
 

Offline Black

  • Gold Supporter
  • Rear Admiral
  • *****
  • B
  • Posts: 868
  • Thanked: 218 times
  • Gold Supporter Gold Supporter : Support the forums with a Gold subscription
    2022 Supporter 2022 Supporter : Donate for 2022
    2023 Supporter 2023 Supporter : Donate for 2023
    2024 Supporter 2024 Supporter : Donate for 2024
Re: Cold War Comments Thread
« Reply #361 on: March 22, 2021, 12:36:44 PM »
Disappointing development in Colonial Union, but not surprising. I did not expect that the Union would go against Tlatelolco as well. Good for Tareks that they did not opposed Union, although any chance for some kind of normalized relationship, even if future Colonial government shifts from this madness, is very slim.
 

Offline StarshipCactus

  • Lt. Commander
  • ********
  • S
  • Posts: 262
  • Thanked: 87 times
Re: Cold War Comments Thread
« Reply #362 on: March 22, 2021, 08:15:23 PM »
What kind of gadget could giant crabs carry around that could do that to them? Do they carry it all the time, or is it just something they have for special occasions?
 

Offline Kurt (OP)

  • Moderator
  • Vice Admiral
  • *****
  • Posts: 1766
  • Thanked: 3389 times
  • 2021 Supporter 2021 Supporter : Donate for 2021
    Gold Supporter Gold Supporter : Support the forums with a Gold subscription
    2022 Supporter 2022 Supporter : Donate for 2022
    2023 Supporter 2023 Supporter : Donate for 2023
Re: Cold War Comments Thread
« Reply #363 on: March 23, 2021, 09:05:01 AM »
What kind of gadget could giant crabs carry around that could do that to them? Do they carry it all the time, or is it just something they have for special occasions?

He overloaded the power supply for his armor.  I'd think that you'd want to safeguard against something like that happening, but apparently its a feature, not a bug for the Tarek. 

Kurt
 

Offline Migi

  • Captain
  • **********
  • Posts: 465
  • Thanked: 172 times
Re: Cold War Comments Thread
« Reply #364 on: March 23, 2021, 03:16:32 PM »
The Tarek seem to have gotten the rough end of the stick, I don't remember them doing anything aggressive except in response to human provocation but at least with an intact homeworld they are in a position to recover their independence if the CU gets beaten down.

Given the planet was captured intact, does it instantly provide all economic output to the CU or is there some sort of integration period?
What did you decide to do about ground units in the end?
 

Offline Kurt (OP)

  • Moderator
  • Vice Admiral
  • *****
  • Posts: 1766
  • Thanked: 3389 times
  • 2021 Supporter 2021 Supporter : Donate for 2021
    Gold Supporter Gold Supporter : Support the forums with a Gold subscription
    2022 Supporter 2022 Supporter : Donate for 2022
    2023 Supporter 2023 Supporter : Donate for 2023
Re: Cold War Comments Thread
« Reply #365 on: March 23, 2021, 03:33:23 PM »
The Tarek seem to have gotten the rough end of the stick, I don't remember them doing anything aggressive except in response to human provocation but at least with an intact homeworld they are in a position to recover their independence if the CU gets beaten down.

Given the planet was captured intact, does it instantly provide all economic output to the CU or is there some sort of integration period?
What did you decide to do about ground units in the end?

The Tarek were always going to be unreasonably hostile to humans, as a result of their initial roll on the communications table.  However, having said that, Humanity really screwed them over.  We colonized the other habitable planet in their system without checking with them first, and then got uncomfortable when they didn't act like it was okay.  Basically, we gave them an excuse to hate us, but they were going to do that already.  The income and tech disparity is so large that they had no way of actually becoming a credible threat, though. 
 
The following users thanked this post: papent, Migi

Offline Black

  • Gold Supporter
  • Rear Admiral
  • *****
  • B
  • Posts: 868
  • Thanked: 218 times
  • Gold Supporter Gold Supporter : Support the forums with a Gold subscription
    2022 Supporter 2022 Supporter : Donate for 2022
    2023 Supporter 2023 Supporter : Donate for 2023
    2024 Supporter 2024 Supporter : Donate for 2024
Re: Cold War Comments Thread
« Reply #366 on: April 05, 2021, 09:47:35 AM »
It would seem that D'Bringi unwillingness to share fighter technology with Rehorish just costed Alliance second route to Mintek territory and significantly decreased number of ships that can be deployed for offensive through Phyriseq. And fixed defenses are most likely out of question for defense of Kure as the precise location of the jump point is unknown?
 

Offline Kurt (OP)

  • Moderator
  • Vice Admiral
  • *****
  • Posts: 1766
  • Thanked: 3389 times
  • 2021 Supporter 2021 Supporter : Donate for 2021
    Gold Supporter Gold Supporter : Support the forums with a Gold subscription
    2022 Supporter 2022 Supporter : Donate for 2022
    2023 Supporter 2023 Supporter : Donate for 2023
Re: Cold War Comments Thread
« Reply #367 on: April 05, 2021, 04:27:55 PM »
It would seem that D'Bringi unwillingness to share fighter technology with Rehorish just costed Alliance second route to Mintek territory and significantly decreased number of ships that can be deployed for offensive through Phyriseq. And fixed defenses are most likely out of question for defense of Kure as the precise location of the jump point is unknown?

The question of the D'Bringi providing the tech will be addressed in an upcoming post.  And yes, fixed defenses are out of the question.  The Alliance knows the location of the warp point within fifteen light seconds, which means that bases are out of the question.  The longest ranged conventional weapon at this point is capital missiles, with a 7.5 light second range, and proto-type fighters have a max range of four light minutes, one way.  That means mobile ships would be needed to respond to an incursion.  The D'Bringi and the Rehorish will have to discuss defenses, but they will be unlikely to abandon the system, as it has a reasonably sized colony and is a contact point with the Titov Free State and the Colonial Union.  Perhaps missile and fighter bases around the colony and fighter bases at the warp point to the Titov Free State. 

As for the D'Bringi reticence about sharing their fighters costing them a chance to break into Mintek space, there was never going to be a chance of that.  Strategos Neeron was willing to sacrifice his entire force, if necessary, if they could not force the Alliance corvettes out of detect range.  While Neeron's force was a significant percentage of the Mintek fleet, denying the Alliance access to Mintek space was a critical strategic priority worth much more than the ships in that fleet.  Of course, the Rehorish and the D'Bringi don't know that, and still don't appreciate how ruthless the Mintek really are. 

Kurt
 
The following users thanked this post: Black, BAGrimm

Offline Garfunkel

  • Registered
  • Admiral of the Fleet
  • ***********
  • Posts: 2796
  • Thanked: 1054 times
Re: Cold War Comments Thread
« Reply #368 on: April 06, 2021, 12:57:23 PM »
I just caught up with this - what plot twists! I can't believe that humans went from protagonists to villains and the D'Bringi from villains to protagonists!  :) This is starting to rival Steve's epic Starfire campaign, hope you can keep it going!
 

Offline Desdinova

  • Lt. Commander
  • ********
  • D
  • Posts: 280
  • Thanked: 281 times
Re: Cold War Comments Thread
« Reply #369 on: April 06, 2021, 02:39:17 PM »
It'd be nice to see the D'Bringi taken down a peg after what happened to Earth, but with humanity taking a hard turn towards xenophobia I'm not sure who the good guys are anymore. I wonder if the D'Bringi should make diplomatic overtures towards humanity? "Oh, by the way, there's another giant expansionist power in the galaxy, and if they beat us, they'll be coming for you next, or coming through you to get to us".
 

Offline Migi

  • Captain
  • **********
  • Posts: 465
  • Thanked: 172 times
Re: Cold War Comments Thread
« Reply #370 on: April 16, 2021, 05:07:42 PM »
Thanks for the updates.

Why is the Colonial Union building an SD? IIRC the Mintek ones were slower than cruisers and many of the human experiences in war seem to point in the direction of faster fleets to keep or gain strategic initiative.
I don't think they don't have fighters yet, is that correct? (as a side note I predict the lack of fighters and experience using them will cause the humans great pain later on)

After seeing all the pinnaces and cutters that many navys have, are they similar to fighters, and how do they stack up in combat?
 

Offline Andrew

  • Registered
  • Commodore
  • **********
  • Posts: 695
  • Thanked: 131 times
Re: Cold War Comments Thread
« Reply #371 on: April 17, 2021, 08:40:39 AM »
Cutters are the smallest and cheapest small craft possible , their only use is planatery survey. Pinnaces are jump point capable small craft and are very useful for probing WP, they carry a point defense which shoot at fighters but they are large and expensive so are no use as a combat craft.
Later there are armed pinnaces and Shuttles which do have combat utility. ASFC are the best low tech anti-fighter weapon and they need a large numerical advantage to win against fighters, swarms of Assault shuttles can also cause problems for fighters

Superdreadnoughts are bigger and better armed than anything else except bigger ships. In strength well designed SD Fleets unlike the Mintek SD's which have a bad design philosophy and were caught in a bad situation will kill BC and CA in large numbers. They are slower but that is less of a problem than you think  as long as you have enough to win. In most starfire campaigns BB/SD and larger ships along with carriers dominate battle with a niche roll for BC's as fast capital missile combatants, with the slow bulding rates and generall small economies no one in this campaign has built enough big ships to demonstrate this and have a large investment in BC and CA.
Particularly SD and BB tend to do much better in the WP assault role as they have much thicker defenses

Edit
The Bjering are building an ML or Light Monitor the next size up from an SD , Slower but even more powerful
« Last Edit: April 17, 2021, 08:43:33 AM by Andrew »
 
The following users thanked this post: Migi

Offline Kurt (OP)

  • Moderator
  • Vice Admiral
  • *****
  • Posts: 1766
  • Thanked: 3389 times
  • 2021 Supporter 2021 Supporter : Donate for 2021
    Gold Supporter Gold Supporter : Support the forums with a Gold subscription
    2022 Supporter 2022 Supporter : Donate for 2022
    2023 Supporter 2023 Supporter : Donate for 2023
Re: Cold War Comments Thread
« Reply #372 on: April 17, 2021, 02:16:30 PM »
Thanks for the updates.

Why is the Colonial Union building an SD? IIRC the Mintek ones were slower than cruisers and many of the human experiences in war seem to point in the direction of faster fleets to keep or gain strategic initiative.
I don't think they don't have fighters yet, is that correct? (as a side note I predict the lack of fighters and experience using them will cause the humans great pain later on)

After seeing all the pinnaces and cutters that many navys have, are they similar to fighters, and how do they stack up in combat?

The cutters are used by all races for planetary surveys, but that's it.  As Andrew said, the pinnaces are very useful for probing warp points to determine what is on the other side.  You don't have to risk a full-sized ship, and pinnaces are small enough that they might be able to escaping drawing any attention at all.  In terms of combat, as Andrew said, the pinnaces have a point defense unit, so they can defend themselves against fighters, but they can't datalink so fighters, with their six fighter squadrons, will eat them up in combat. 

The Colonial Union does not have fighters, and they have not met anyone that is actively using them, so they have no idea that they even exist.  And that is the reason the CU is building an SD.  You are correct that an SD is slower both tactically and strategically.  Most of the active races in my campaign so far have limited themselves to battlecruisers, which are fast, and big enough to do a good amount of damage while carrying enough defenses to make them tough targets.  The humans, though, are reacting to their perceived inferior position.  They are looking to gain prestige, rather than combat capability, and fielding a force of the biggest ships possible looks like the best way to do that, whether they are combat effective or not. 

All things being equal, a force of SD's is difficult for a force of BC's to deal with.  It can be done, as the D'Bringi proved in their first major engagement with the Mintek.  However, if the SD's are properly designed and deployed, they can successfully take on a mass-equivalent force of battlecruisers, or even a force of BC's that out-masses them, to a certain extent.  That is balanced by the BC force's ability to pick the time and place of the engagement, or to decide if there will be an engagement at all. 

Of course, all of that assumes the other side doesn't have fighters.  The D'Bringi have no interest in SD's because they've been throwing all of their time and money into expanding their fighter corps.  Plus, their clans have a raiding mentality, and building large slow battlewagons doesn't really fit into that mindset.  The humans are either going to encounter someone who has fighters, or they are going to develop them themselves.  Either way, unless they get their asses handed to them, they are going to go with the view that fighters are only good as a support weapon to the large BB's and SD's, because they'll have so much time and effort invested in the big ships that they'll find it difficult to go a different way until their faces are rubbed in the fact that they have to adopt fighters. 

Kurt
 
The following users thanked this post: Migi

Offline Black

  • Gold Supporter
  • Rear Admiral
  • *****
  • B
  • Posts: 868
  • Thanked: 218 times
  • Gold Supporter Gold Supporter : Support the forums with a Gold subscription
    2022 Supporter 2022 Supporter : Donate for 2022
    2023 Supporter 2023 Supporter : Donate for 2023
    2024 Supporter 2024 Supporter : Donate for 2024
Re: Cold War Comments Thread
« Reply #373 on: April 17, 2021, 04:38:01 PM »
From what I remember from Starfire books, anti-matter warheads are quite a gamechanger as far as missile combat goes. This could give an edge to Mintek.
 

Offline Kurt (OP)

  • Moderator
  • Vice Admiral
  • *****
  • Posts: 1766
  • Thanked: 3389 times
  • 2021 Supporter 2021 Supporter : Donate for 2021
    Gold Supporter Gold Supporter : Support the forums with a Gold subscription
    2022 Supporter 2022 Supporter : Donate for 2022
    2023 Supporter 2023 Supporter : Donate for 2023
Re: Cold War Comments Thread
« Reply #374 on: April 17, 2021, 05:19:21 PM »
From what I remember from Starfire books, anti-matter warheads are quite a gamechanger as far as missile combat goes. This could give an edge to Mintek.

You aren't wrong.  Anti-matter warheads double the damage of the missile mounting them, which is a big boost in combat power.  The Mintek have made a big investment in the latest tech.  Given the increased tech costs in my campaign, and the reduced pop growth, higher tech levels are causing even the larger nations to have to pick and choose what they invest in developing, and the higher tech stuff is expensive to start with.  There is a lot of good stuff available at HT 9, which is the level the Mintek just reached, though.  Improved fighters, composite armor, anti-matter warheads, capital energy beams, jammer ECM, improved multiplex tracking, SBM's, and SBM pods, and laser pods for fighters.  All of that stuff is nearly critical to any nation, and some of it is potentially game changing.  The anti-matter warheads, coupled with improved multiplex tracking, is gives missile ships a big advantage (although improved multiplex helps beam ships too).  The SBM's, with anti-matter warheads, are a big advantage too, as they can outrange the enemy's capital missiles.  And jammer ECM and SBM pods can change the equation in warp point assaults, as the pods can travel through warp points, and a jammer ECM on board a ship will knock every enemy ship (fighters too!) out of their datalinks at close range.   

All of this is very expensive to develop, and the Mintek aren't the largest economy in the game, but once they've got it developed and deployed, watch out! 

Kurt
 
The following users thanked this post: Black