Author Topic: MaxTech AMM Frigate, Sarissa Class  (Read 1767 times)

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Offline xenoscepter (OP)

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MaxTech AMM Frigate, Sarissa Class
« on: December 07, 2021, 11:38:48 PM »
Sarissa Class Frigate:
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Sarissa Class Frigate      6,250 tons       185 Crew       7,229.7 BP       TCS 125    TH 3,120    EM 0
24963 km/s      Armour 3-30       Shields 0-0       HTK 56      Sensors 15/15/0/0      DCR 6      PPV 25
Maint Life 7.98 Years     MSP 5,899    AFR 48%    IFR 0.7%    1YR 164    5YR 2,467    Max Repair 1750 MSP
Magazine 250    Cryogenic Berths 200   
Commander    Control Rating 1   BRG   
Intended Deployment Time: 5.1 months    Morale Check Required   

T1200-100T Photonic Drive, Class 1560/065M (2)    Power 3120.0    Fuel Use 2.20%    Signature 1560.00    Explosion 6%
Fuel Capacity 251,000 Litres    Range 328.8 billion km (152 days at full power)

K1200 Particle Beam, Class 1/2 (2)    Range 1,200,000km     TS: 25,000 km/s     Power 5-5    ROF 5        2 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0
T100/1.4M-TS25K Beam FCS, Low Grade (1)     Max Range: 1,400,000 km   TS: 25,000 km/s     29 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0
T13/10B100 Vacuum Energy Power Plant (1)     Total Power Output 10    Exp 50%

R0-75/12 Missile Launcher, Class 2 (10)     Missile Size: 2    Rate of Fire 10
T100/180-75R1 Missile FCS, Low Grade (1)     Range 185.4m km    Resolution 1
Anti-Missile Missile, Class 2 "Longshot" (120)    Speed: 270,000 km/s    End: 0.9m     Range: 15.1m km    WH: 1    Size: 2    TH: 9000/5400/2700

T400/180-75R1 Active Search Sensor, Low Grade (1)     GPS 1440     Range 185.4m km    MCR 16.7m km    Resolution 1
Sensor Calibrator [EM] (1)     Sensitivity 15     Detect Sig Strength 1000:  30.6m km
Sensor Calibrator [TH] (1)     Sensitivity 15     Detect Sig Strength 1000:  30.6m km

Compact ECCM-10 (2)         ECM 100

Missile to hit chances are vs targets moving at 3000 km/s, 5000 km/s and 10,000 km/s

This design is classed as a Military Vessel for maintenance purposes
This design is classed as a c for auto-assignment purposes2 days at full power)

K1200 Particle Beam, Class 1/2 (2)    Range 1,200,000km     TS: 25,000 km/s     Power 5-5    ROF 5       
T100/1.4M-TS25K Beam FCS, Low Grade (1)     Max Range: 1,400,000 km   TS: 25,000 km/s     99 99 98 97 96 96 95 94 94 93
T13/10B100 Vacuum Energy Power Plant (1)     Total Power Output 10    Exp 50%

R0-75/12 Missile Launcher, Class 2 (10)     Missile Size: 2    Rate of Fire 10
T100/180-75R1 Missile FCS, Low Grade (1)     Range 185.4m km    Resolution 1
Anti-Missile Missile, Class 2 "Longshot" (120)    Speed: 270,000 km/s    End: 0.9m     Range: 15.1m km    WH: 1    Size: 2    TH: 9000/5400/2700

T400/180-75R1 Active Search Sensor, Low Grade (1)     GPS 1440     Range 185.4m km    MCR 16.7m km    Resolution 1
Sensor Calibrator [EM] (1)     Sensitivity 15     Detect Sig Strength 1000:  30.6m km
Sensor Calibrator [TH] (1)     Sensitivity 15     Detect Sig Strength 1000:  30.6m km

Compact ECCM-10 (2)         ECM 100

Missile to hit chances are vs targets moving at 3000 km/s, 5000 km/s and 10,000 km/s

This design is classed as a Military Vessel for maintenance purposes
This design is classed as a c for auto-assignment purposes
*To-Hit numbers given for the B-FCS are measured against targets moving at 25,000 km/s at a range of 1,000,000 km.

Anti-Missile Missile, Class 2 "Longshot"
Off-Topic: show
Missile Size: 2.00 MSP  (5.000 Tons)     Warhead: 1    Radiation Damage: 1    Manoeuvre Rating: 100
Speed: 270,000 km/s     Fuel: 275     Flight Time: 55.8 seconds     Range: 15,066,000 km
ECM Modifier: 100%     ECCM Modifier: 100%
Cost Per Missile: 27.40     Development Cost: 2,740
Chance to Hit: 1k km/s 27000%   3k km/s 9000%   5k km/s 5400%   10k km/s 2700%

Materials Required
Corbomite  10
Tritanium  0.30
Gallicite  17.10
Fuel:  275

 --- I might write up more of an effort post for this, but for now it's time for bed. This is, as the title ascribes, a class of Frigate for AMM Duty. It is heavily based off my Diligent Class which can be found here: http://aurora2.pentarch.org/index.php?topic=11850.0 This ship uses long-range Size 2 AMMs, while fielding a pair of Strength 2 Particle Beams for defense. The combo of Compact ECM / ECCM modules are equal in mass to a single regular sized module of either type. 12 reloads give the ship little staying power, but this ship isn't designed to defeat enemy missiles on its own. Rather it is a defensive ship, meant to provide AMM support to planetary Anti-Missile STOs and/or Orbital Defenses. The range also allows the ship to function in a limited escort role, ideally in-system functioning in support of dedicated, Beam-Based intersystem PD escorts. Three layers of armor give it defense against low caliber Railguns, Lasers and other minor weapons, while an Emergency Cryogenic Transport gives the crew some respite in the event of damage to the Life Support systems. Minimalist passive sensors help to round it out and keep it from being totally blind. The two 300-Ton magazines afford it an extra 6 HtK apiece.
 
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Offline Suxxor

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Re: MaxTech AMM Frigate, Sarissa Class
« Reply #1 on: December 28, 2021, 06:12:53 AM »
The issue is how fast can you build them. For my taste, it has too few AMM launchers -> ship needs to be massed.
« Last Edit: December 28, 2021, 08:37:11 AM by Suxxor »
 
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Offline xenoscepter (OP)

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Re: MaxTech AMM Frigate, Sarissa Class
« Reply #2 on: December 28, 2021, 09:28:36 AM »
The issue is how fast can you build them. For my taste, it has too few AMM launchers -> ship needs to be massed.

 --- How many AMM Launchers would you put on a 6,250 Ton ship?
 

Offline Vandermeer

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Re: MaxTech AMM Frigate, Sarissa Class
« Reply #3 on: December 28, 2021, 10:15:17 AM »
If they were size-1 I would go with 30, but it could be 40-50 depending on fleet role-separation and your usual engine ratio. (30 is with 40%engine, high engineering and basic sensor suite still)
The lategame size-2 AMMs with supposedly eccm are hard to judge though. Normally I would avoid them since targeting lower tech enemies will be easy anyway thanks to high maneuver, so ecm doesn't deride any functionality. If you are really making them out to counter something beastly like 270kms missiles then you would still be fine using less than half of the above (=15), since yours are 100% hits where on other tech stages you count with 33-66% usually.
That means your 10 might actually be fine. What I wonder though is why you only pack 12 full salvos. Even with more launchers I still get 16 to 20 of those. Maybe you should miniaturize the launchers further. 10s is rarely a needed fire interval for long range AMM I think, because they fly way longer before results come in, and are fired in succession anyway (so you will have launchers at the ready if not totally overwhelmed).
playing Aurora as swarm fleet: Zen Nomadic Hive Fantasy
 

Offline Droll

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Re: MaxTech AMM Frigate, Sarissa Class
« Reply #4 on: December 28, 2021, 10:23:20 AM »
The issue is how fast can you build them. For my taste, it has too few AMM launchers -> ship needs to be massed.

 --- How many AMM Launchers would you put on a 6,250 Ton ship?

IMO for me the sticking point is the missiles. AMMs do not really need ECM, just ECCM. It should also not be too hard at max tech to make size 1 missiles with ECCM, probably lose out a bit on the range.

This would allow you to have size 1 launchers which is good for multiple reasons:
  • Twice the ammo capacity
  • Reduced size 1 launchers can still fire every 5s, this means that not only are the launchers smaller, even if you don't add more, the 10 you have would behave like 20 of the size 2s.

Other than that you want more ammo capacity. For ASMs I usually aim for 10 salvos sans reloads but for AMMs I go way higher than that.

The idea of the size 2 AMM works mostly at lower tech where the space needed for the warhead makes ECCM inclusion problematic. Or I guess if you want true area defense you can use AWACS and long range AMMs.
 

Offline Suxxor

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Re: MaxTech AMM Frigate, Sarissa Class
« Reply #5 on: December 29, 2021, 04:04:29 AM »
The issue is how fast can you build them. For my taste, it has too few AMM launchers -> ship needs to be massed.

 --- How many AMM Launchers would you put on a 6,250 Ton ship?
Firstly I'd never build 6500 tons amm ship. For me the constraint is defending from incoming barrage. Let's take Invader AMM spammer as target to protect from. I personally wouldn't go under 30. My experiments with massed s1 launchers led me believe that 50 launchers per ship is "optimal", 3-4 such ships in battlegroup. Such ships can be used both defensively and offensively to saturate amm defense - just load different ordnance from supply ship. As far as I'm concerned, the tradeoffs (lower speed, greater size) are worth it. Space is too big and going somewhere 10 000 or 26 000 doesn't make a difference.

Plus those lasers won't make a dent in decent missile barrage from comparable tech.
« Last Edit: December 29, 2021, 12:01:27 PM by Suxxor »
 

Offline bdub1

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Re: MaxTech AMM Frigate, Sarissa Class
« Reply #6 on: January 10, 2022, 07:13:40 PM »
Hmm
Its an interesting concept
I always like making Max-Tech ships, so I decided at a stab at this concept, with more specialized missiles and 250t more displacement, for a nice round 6500 tons
i'm not sure if it'd be more effective, and i havent played in awhile, so be kind?
Anyway


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Spruance class Corvette      6,500 tons       199 Crew       10,352.1 BP       TCS 130    TH 1,080    EM 8,280
34616 km/s      Armour 10-31       Shields 276-368       HTK 68      Sensors 375/0/0/0      DCR 34      PPV 16.65
Maint Life 2.49 Years     MSP 4,455    AFR 78%    IFR 1.1%    1YR 997    5YR 14,952    Max Repair 4500.00 MSP
Magazine 367   
Captain    Control Rating 2   BRG   CIC   
Intended Deployment Time: 6 months    Morale Check Required   

Balcerzak-Curnow Photonic Drive  EP4500.00 (1)    Power 4500.0    Fuel Use 15.91%    Signature 1080.0000    Explosion 15%
Fuel Capacity 375,000 Litres    Range 65.3 billion km (21 days at full power)
Oppenheim Defence Omega S276 / R368 Shields (1)     Recharge Time 368 seconds (0.8 per second)

Wiktor-Mines Size 1 Missile Launcher (75.00% Reduction) (15)     Missile Size: 1    Rate of Fire 5
Italiano & Bunk Advanced Defence Systems Size 6.00 Missile Launcher (30.0% Reduction) (3)     Missile Size: 6.00    Rate of Fire 615
Otoole-Boehle Missile Fire Control FC71-R1 (5%) (1)     Range 71.8m km    Resolution 1
Redus Electronic Systems Missile Fire Control FC196-R1 (5%) (1)     Range 196.7m km    Resolution 1
AMM-3 Scutum (295)    Speed: 270,000 km/s    End: 1m     Range: 16.1m km    WH: 1    Size: 1.00    TH: 12780/7668/3834
(F)ASM (12)    Speed: 270,000 km/s    End: 3.1m     Range: 50.1m km    WH: 69    Size: 6.00    TH: 1530/918/459

Redus Electronic Systems Active Search Sensor AS207-R1 (1)     GPS 1800     Range 207.3m km    MCR 18.7m km    Resolution 1
Wachowiak Electronics Industries Thermal Sensor TH5-375 (1)     Sensitivity 375     Detect Sig Strength 1000:  153.1m km

Compact ECCM-10 (1)         ECM 100

The AMMs have a similar range, and better tracking infact, however they possess no eccm or ecm of their own, relying on their speed,
Same for the s6 asms backing them up, for a close range punch to anything getting close.
Thoughts are welcome.