Author Topic: Tractor-Trailer Freighter Design  (Read 1503 times)

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Offline skoormit (OP)

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Tractor-Trailer Freighter Design
« on: May 04, 2021, 01:06:04 PM »
TL;DR:
You can probably save cost on freighters by splitting them into two designs: a tug ship and an unarmored cargo station.

User xenoscepter had a post a while back (as in, 364 days ago) about using engineless container vessels as carriers.
What if we applied the same concept to freighters?

Here is a typical single-hold freighter design:
1 standard cargo hold
1 one cargo shuttle bay
1 bridge
1 engineering space
some engines
some fuel storage
crew quarters as needed
armor as needed

Civilian shipping companies use this outline for the "Small" design.
In my current game, the civvy design has three size-60 engines, which gives nearly optimal net speed per cost for a single cargo hold at my tech levels.
(You can get roughly 9% more speed per cost by adding a 4th engine, another 4.5% by adding a 5th engine, and another 2% by adding a 6th engine. A 7th engine squeezes out another 0.3% gain, and after that it's downhill; the marginal cost per engine outweighs the marginal speed gain.)

Optimizing throughput cost is good, and raw speed is good, but it is also good to keep your designs small (to minimize shipyard costs), so I mimic the civvies early and use the 3-engine design.

Design specs:
Code: [Select]
302.3 BP
35,568 tons
759 km/s
12.6 Bkm range (more precisely: 12.578...)

Care to guess what the most expensive component is?
It's armor. High Density Duranium, comprising 31.8% of the cost.
(The engines are second at 26.7%.)

I don't really need armor on these things. If they are ever attacked, they are going to die. The armor is only going to delay their destruction, and not for long.
But I can't take the armor off and keep the engines on it.
So why not split it in two? Let's make a tractor-trailer.

The trailer has the cargo hold and shuttles, and no armor.
The tractor has the engines and fuel, and a tractor beam, and must have armor.
They both have a bridge and crew quarters and a standard Engineering Spaces component.

Cost of trailer: 111.9 BP
Cost of tractor: 172.2 BP

(You could make a logical argument for leaving the bridge and the engineers off of the trailer, if the trailer is always going to be traveling with a tractor, but a) the game won't let you make a bridgeless ship over 1000t, and b) a commercial ship without engineering spaces will have a very high AFR, as if it were a military ship. You can work around these game limitations by adding some custom ship components to the database, though. Caveat hackor.)

Anyway, design specs of the combo:
Code: [Select]
284.1 BP
35,415 tons
762 km/s
12.6 Bkm range (more precisely: 12.633...)

That's a cost savings of 6% while actually increasing speed and range by 0.4%.

There are other benefits to using the tractor/trailer combo:

Trailers can be built by industry.
--It's probably not a great idea in the long run to be using your industrial capacity to build cargo holds, but the flexibility can come in handy.

Tractors aren't married to trailers; they can be used to tug other things.
--For example, I might build small(ish) orbital miners/terraformers if I already have a small tug design to use with them.

You can leave a trailer parked somewhere by itself for storage.
--You could store an entire system's mineral output at a JP, where a long-range hauler will pick it up for intersystem distribution.

Retooling shipyards for new engine designs is cheaper and faster as well.
--This actually might be a bigger deal than the 6% cost savings on the design. It takes a long time to retool a big freighter yard with many slipways. Anything that lets me get that done faster is a boon for my empire.

Drawbacks?

The obvious one: the trailer has no armor.
--I don't think this matters much.
--I almost never send freighters anywhere near hostiles. If my freighters are surprised by hostiles somewhere, they are probably going to die regardless of armor. I keep at least a minor patrol ship at every colony, and a very-short-range fighter docked in a small carrier at every JP, but a) the space between JPs and colonies is big, and b) the fighter at the JP has <1Mkm range. If a surprise hostile appears in some random location near a freighter in one of my "safe" systems, odds are very high that my response time to that location is way, way longer than it will take a hostile ship with any weapon to blow up that freighter.
--In fact, this might be an advantage rather than a drawback. If a hostile appears near a tractor-trailer, at least I have the option to ditch the trailer and run away with the tractor, which has ~4x the speed of the integrated freighter.

A bit more micromanagement.
--For every combo, you have to give the tractor an order to tug the trailer at least once. You can forget about it after that, and treat it just like a normal freighter, but those are extra clicks that will add up over the course of the game.
--You also have to manage two shipyards building these designs at different rates. In the time it takes to build a tractor, you can build nearly 2.5 trailers (if building in a shipyard). You'll be adding slipways to the tractor yard more than twice as often as the trailer yard, which means it won't be as simple as just remember to build a trailer every time you start a new tractor. If you are like me, you'll probably just decide to build enough extra trailers to cover one year's output of tractors, and then check once per year to see if you need to build more trailers this year. (This would be less annoying if you could queue up shipyard orders like you can industry orders.)

Extra shipyard cost up front.
--But in the long run, shipyard costs are lower. Details below.

Any other drawbacks? Am I overlooking something?




« Last Edit: May 04, 2021, 03:25:44 PM by skoormit »
 
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Offline nuclearslurpee

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Re: Tractor-Trailer Freighter Design
« Reply #1 on: May 04, 2021, 01:39:55 PM »
You highlight something important here, briefly:

Quote
Tractors aren't married to trailers; they can be used to tug other things.
--For example, I might build small(ish) orbital miners/terraformers if I already have a small tug design to use with them.

However this understates the point: once you've built a trailer, it's good basically forever. Not just cargo containers, but cryo storage superpods, tanker trailers, ordnance trailers, even troop transport pods. The only real change you ever need to make is upgrading the cargo shuttle or refueling system which is rarely an urgent need for commercial ships and can be done fairly cheaply as a refit. This is a huge savings especially for expensive things like cryo pods, as you can just rebuild the engine part (tug/tractor) for a fractional cost.

There is also huge flexibility in that you can have multiple kinds of tugs/tractors, for example the heavy tugs that usually pull a terraforming station around could also pull a smaller cargo container at high speed if you need urgent shipping (or all of your TRPs are already in place and your heavy tugs are just chilling).

You can also have your tractors drop the pods off at a planet and they can load/unload while waiting for a tractor, which can especially in the early Sol days make logistics run much more efficiently (granted, probably to the point of outpacing construction capability). Of course this adds micromanagement compared to semi-permanent tractor/trailer pairings.

I suspect the logic here and as you lay out above matches the similar reasons why we use tractor-trailers in the real world for (overland) shipping, to say nothing of railroad trains. The usual tendency is to think of Aurora as analogous to wet navies but space is not an ocean and this is one of those divergent cases.
 
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Offline misanthropope

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Re: Tractor-Trailer Freighter Design
« Reply #2 on: May 04, 2021, 02:59:28 PM »
this is my invariable practice.  i build two sizes of pod, around 250k and around 60k.  you can get away with just one class of tug, too; the big pods generally aren't at a priority to be moved quickly. 

i often build my battle fleet around a slow-but-cheap chassis, and if you do so (with commercial-grade engines) you can just reuse an obsolete 'military' engine into your tugs.  more environmentally conscious than recycling, people!

tug-based commerce is always going to be clickier than using "whole" ships, but if you maintain a large number of a standardized tug, the management hassle is very small.
 
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Offline skoormit (OP)

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Re: Tractor-Trailer Freighter Design
« Reply #3 on: May 04, 2021, 03:23:28 PM »
Something I forgot to mention (I'll go back and add this):

You do have to build an extra shipyard up front, which has a cost of 2400BP.
So that's a disadvantage.
However, we will come out ahead in shipyard costs in the long run.

Slipway costs are directly proportional to shipyard size.
Since the size of a tractor plus a trailer is roughly the same as the size of the integrated freighter, the cost of a tractor slipway plus a trailer slipway is roughly the same as the cost of a slipway for the integrated freighter.
Because the build time of a trailer is roughly 40% of the build time of a tractor, our trailer yard can match the output of our tractor yard with only 40% of the slipways.
Adding a trailer slipway costs ~622BP. By the time we have saved that cost 4 times, we have more than made up for the cost of the extra yard at the start.
At what point have we saved the cost of 4 trailer slipways?
After we have added 6 slipways to the tractor yard.
(If we have 7 total tractor slipways, we need 2.8 trailer slipways to keep up. We can't have a partial slipway, so really we have 3 trailer slipways, which means we have added 2 trailer slipways alongside our 6 tractor slipways, which is a savings of four trailer slipways over the cost of adding six slipways to the integrated freighter yard.)
 

Offline Gator_Chomp

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Re: Tractor-Trailer Freighter Design
« Reply #4 on: May 04, 2021, 03:49:43 PM »
I had a similar idea the other day
Code: [Select]
Trailer class Cargo Ship      1,012,932 tons       334 Crew       2,205.6 BP       TCS 20,259    TH 0    EM 0
1 km/s      No Armour       Shields 0-0     HTK 57      Sensors 14/11/0/0      DCR 1      PPV 0
MSP 1    Max Repair 200 MSP
Cargo 1,000,000    Cargo Shuttle Multiplier 100   
Lieutenant Commander    Control Rating 1   BRG   
Intended Deployment Time: 3 months   


Girl Scout EM Sensor EM1.0-11.0 (30%) (1)     Sensitivity 11     Detect Sig Strength 1000:  26.2m km
Girl Scout Thermal Sensor TH1.0-14.0 (30%) (1)     Sensitivity 14     Detect Sig Strength 1000:  29.6m km

This design is classed as a Commercial Vessel for maintenance purposes
This design is classed as a Space Station for construction purposes

I put some armor on this tug because I'm going to use it to haul a large military jump station into more dangerous regions.
Code: [Select]
Ox class Tug      280,137 tons       2,558 Crew       22,264.7 BP       TCS 5,603    TH 80,000    EM 0
14278 km/s      Armour 2-381       Shields 0-0       HTK 628      Sensors 14/11/0/0      DCR 1      PPV 0
MSP 2,049    Max Repair 400 MSP
Tractor Beam     
Lieutenant Commander    Control Rating 1   BRG   
Intended Deployment Time: 6 months   

Glute Commercial Inertial Fusion Drive  EP1600.0 (50)    Power 80000    Fuel Use 1.12%    Signature 1600    Explosion 5%
Fuel Capacity 21,250,000 Litres    Range 1,221.2 billion km (989 days at full power)

Pea Shooter CIWS-250 (4x10)    Range 1000 km     TS: 25,000 km/s     ROF 5       
Girl Scout Thermal Sensor TH1.0-14.0 (30%) (1)     Sensitivity 14     Detect Sig Strength 1000:  29.6m km
Girl Scout EM Sensor EM1.0-11.0 (30%) (1)     Sensitivity 11     Detect Sig Strength 1000:  26.2m km

This design is classed as a Commercial Vessel for maintenance purposes

Terraformers are good candidates for stations since they're parked for years at a time.
Code: [Select]
Camper class Terraformer      1,262,166 tons       5,016 Crew       26,953.7 BP       TCS 25,243    TH 0    EM 0
1 km/s      No Armour       Shields 0-0     HTK 687      Sensors 14/11/0/0      DCR 1      PPV 0
MSP 2,013    Max Repair 500 MSP
Lieutenant Commander    Control Rating 1   BRG   
Intended Deployment Time: 6 months   
Terraformer: 50 modules producing 0.0375 atm per annum


Girl Scout EM Sensor EM1.0-11.0 (30%) (1)     Sensitivity 11     Detect Sig Strength 1000:  26.2m km
Girl Scout Thermal Sensor TH1.0-14.0 (30%) (1)     Sensitivity 14     Detect Sig Strength 1000:  29.6m km

This design is classed as a Commercial Vessel for maintenance purposes
This design is classed as a Space Station for construction purposes
 
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Offline Droll

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Re: Tractor-Trailer Freighter Design
« Reply #5 on: May 04, 2021, 04:11:34 PM »
I see that the girl scouts got sick of selling cookies and decided the next logical step was to make complex deep space sensor technology.