Author Topic: The Official Chronicle of the Duranium Legion (Read 34950 times)

nuclearslurpee · « **Reply #150 on:** June 30, 2022, 10:58:34 PM »

OOC Note: As a reminder for the benefit of the reader, the agenda and attendance for the Naval Conference can be found in the first post of Chapter XXI and may be of some use to keep track of the various personalities involved as well as to be apprised of upcoming topics of discussion - about which speculation is as always encouraged!

N.B. Comment replies on the bottom of the preceding page, for all two of you who care.

----

25 May 4009

1300: Session on Future Directions for the Fleet Scouting Role, Duranium Legion Naval Conference

As one might expect, the need for a revision or replacement of the original Bellerophon design was obvious even to those outside of the Lords Admiralty, and had been for some time albeit some members of the Legion Navy had been sounding the alarm for a good deal longer than others (most curiously, the earliest proponents of such a rework had originated from the Mining Department of all places). Such alarmism had, given time, worked its way into the ship design offices, and a task group had been quietly assigned to prepare a sensible design proposal representing iterative improvement with minimal rocking of boats. This project had proceeded at a moderate pace and a design was completed in due time, and in fact had worked its way through most of the various rungs of the bureaucratic ladder to secure internal approval. In fact, senior members of the ship design offices had anticipated submitting the finished proposal to the procuration office for final approval between June and August 4009, just in time for new construction orders to be issued for the Legion Special Projects Division as shipyard spaces were freed on the commissioning of Bad Intentions and Blatant Insult. In short, all was proceeding as planned until the Naval Conference occurred.

Unfortunately for those in the ship design offices, the Naval Conference brought to the Bellerophon redesign project the greatest enemy of those offices, this being the attention of the Lords Admiral. Regardless of how well-designed the Bellerophon Mk II class might be on paper, it lacked one critical feature necessary for acceptance, namely it had not been the brainchild of a Lord Admiral and thus carried minimal value as a tool for political maneuvering and points-scoring. Left alone, then, the eminently sensible product of the honest work and field expertise of the ship design offices would likely flounder in the Conference chambers before ultimately being passed over in favor of some harebrained scheme involving missiles, hangar bays, or some other high-ranking nonsense. Thus, it fell to the senior leadership of the ship design offices to devise a solution which might give their proposal at least a fighting chance in the Conference chambers.

Fortunately, a potential solution did exist. The senior leadership reasoned that while every Lord Admiral would surely desire to present their pet design as a favored candidate, not every Lord Admiral would devote the time and effort towards developing a suitable design in the first place. Thus, if the right Lords Admiral could be persuaded to back the design as if it were their own pet project, sufficient political will might be generated that a sensible result might be obtained, for once. Curiously, after much discussion the staff in the ship design offices identified two particular Lords Admiral who possessed the necessary combination of strong political support and lack of Bellerophon-related ideas that this plan could stand some chance of success. While subsequent attempts to reach out to these candidates proved largely successful, the result would certainly lend credence to the old saying about strange bedfellows.

----

Thus, as the 25 May afternoon session of the Naval Conference commenced, Lord Grand Admiral Tethys Argyron was pleased to present her supported redesign of the Bellerophon class, developed “in conjunction with” the fine men and women at the ship design offices for the occasion:

Off-Topic: Bellerophon Mk II Standard Upgrade class Frigate • show

As the Lord Grand Admiral prepared to expound upon the virtues of this surely impressive piece of design work, a loud objection was raised from the floor, as Lord High Admiral Jack Macaria demanded to know why the design specifications being presented by his colleague just so happened to be exactly the same as those he was scheduled to present immediately thereafter. Lord Grand Admiral Argyron, sensing the clear implication, vociferously insisted that the design was original work, developed “in conjunction with” the ship design offices as she had previously stated, and was certainly not in any way plagiarized from anyone, least of all her esteemed colleague. Lord High Admiral Macaria was quick on the draw, insisting with equal fervor that this was funny to hear, considering that the exact same statement was true of the design specifications he held in his hands.

Fortunately, Lord Admiral Criasus had the presence of mind to discern that a certain measure of subterfuge may have occurred, and suggested to the two quarreling officers that the question could be resolved by consulting the head of the ship design offices to ascertain the facts of the case. This suggestion sufficed to prevent an imminent exchange of blows, largely as both would-be combatants were quite eager to know the truth of the matter themselves. A fire team of the Imperial Guard detachment was dispatched, and returned after a tense thirty minutes escorting the head of the ship design offices with great haste and all due respect. Sheepishly, and more than a bit rattled, the man quickly clarified that his staff had enlisted the support of both Lords Admiral for the same design, developed by his own offices well ahead of the Conference, and had apparently made a small oversight in communicating to those Lords Admiral. Lord Grand Admiral Argyron and Lord High Admiral Macaria were, of course, still rather put out at this sequence of events, but at least the immediate tension had been resolved and there was no risk of body blows in the very transient present moment.

At this point, the reader could be forgiven for attributing this as a heinous blunder on the part of the ship design staff. Indeed, failing to inform the chosen candidates about each other’s involvement was an oversight with no rational nor strategic basis, and the head of the ship design offices could not expect much in the way of future career advancement. However, the general thrust of the plan remained valid, as having once been put on the spot neither Lord Grand Admiral Argyron nor Lord High Admiral Macaria were willing to back down and admit error, thus both continued to express their support for the class, however reluctantly and however secretly glowering over having been forced to agree with one another by unforeseen circumstances. Similarly, many among the assembly took notice of this unlikely alliance, which would be a key factor in their own decision-making processes.

The design itself was certainly solid and deserving of support, as would be expected from a ship class not designed by a harebrained Lord Admiral. In exchange for the high-resolution sensor array, considered superfluous by most of the Naval establishment, the armor thickness had been increased by 33%. Additionally, the combination of space efficiency savings and fire control system improvements would allow for an increase in fuel loading and a corresponding 50% increase in range, a useful capability for the fleet scouting role of the class. Otherwise, pre-existing capabilities had been maintained, with the designers trusting in improved armor and doctrinal manuals to do most of the heavy lifting. The Conference attendees generally agreed on this, and while some minor discussions were had over the potential value of increasing the fuel load even more, and possibly the crew accommodations to support longer deployment times, might prove more beneficial than up-armoring the class, ultimately the design was found generally agreeable by those in attendance.

This is not to say, of course, that alternatives were not explored by the Conference nevertheless. Perhaps the most compelling revision was presented by Lord Admiral Gaia Pandia, who advocated for a Bellerophon variant which was better-suited for the critical commerce raiding role:

Off-Topic: Bellerophon Mk II Raider class Frigate • show

The key feature distinguishing this design from the more conservative upgrade preferred by the ship design offices was the upgunned pair of 127 mm light railgun batteries, which if adopted would be the first Legion Navy weapons of this caliber. The justification for this upgrade, Lord Admiral Pandia was quick to remark, was not so much a vain attempt to improve combat firepower, but rather to arm the frigates with weapons which could penetrate the thin armor typically seen on civilian and auxiliary vessels, in hopes of cripping enemy vessels and coercing quick surrenders by inflicting internal damage in the first volley of fire. To accomplish this upgunning, Lord Admiral Pandia proposed replacing the large missile warning array with the smaller onboard targeting system deployed on most other Legion Navy vessels. This was justified, in her view, by the fact that the command cruisers at the heart of every battle fleet would provide anti-missile sensor capability already, thus there was no need to duplicate this capability in a class of ships which were, after all, doctrinally optional. Otherwise, she emphasized, most of the other improvements in the previous Mark II proposal were maintained, including the increased armor thickness and fuel load.

As the ‘raider’ design in most respects hewed close to the previous proposal, quite accidentally, and as the Lords Admiral had expressed few great reservations about the latter, criticism of the former centered principally on the lack of anti-missile sensor capability. Lord Admiral Glycon Limos, commander of the Duratus Naval Corps, raised the point that removing anti-missile capability from the Bellerophons would make them much less flexible and valuable as attached squadron elements, whereas their current loadout would enable them to provide backup anti-missile sensor support in case of misfortune befalling the command cruiser of a battle fleet. Furthermore, refitting the existing Bellerophons to the proposed variant would leave the Legion Navy without any dedicated anti-missile sensor elements until the command cruisers were finally deployed, which would require several years to accomplish even with best estimates. Perhaps, the Lord Admiral suggested, the production of dedicated commerce raiders should wait at least until the rest of the fleet was properly equipped to support such an endeavor.

On the other hand, some among the Lords Admiral were less inclined to place so much value on the anti-missile capabilities of the Bellerophon class. Perhaps the most vocal proponent of this view was, predictably, Lord Admiral Niobe Chryson, who held that the improved 127 mm armament of the ‘Raider’ variant enabled the frigates to make a meaningful contribution in battle, something which had not been possible to date. While the previous session had established that the 102 mm railguns of the existing class made no serious contribution to fleet point defense, Lord Admiral Chryson went further and claimed that the long-range anti-missile sensor arrays had no appreciable impact either. While ostensibly the long range gave a battle fleet superior missile tracking and thus accuracy of defensive fire, in practice the nominal 10% or 12% improvement in accuracy had proven simply unnecessary - point defense work against the Belaire had never required the full weight of fire provided by the available destroyer squadrons - or else woefully insufficient to prevent heavy losses, as against the Mongolicans in the Battle of Gliese 1. Lord Admiral Chryson was eagerly supported in her claims by Lord High Admiral Hilaera Antilochus, who wisely left unspoken her obvious preference for this more specialized redesign which would preclude attempts by the Home Fleet Command to deploy its frigates on Survey Command types of missions.

While these and other points of debate were raised, ultimately few others of the Lords Admiral were particularly invested in the topic, with most having already made up their minds along the lines laid out by Lord Admiral Limos. As such, the discussion of the ‘Raider’ variant died down after not too much time, and Lord Admiral Criasus opened the floor for any other proposals. Taking this cue, Lord High Admiral Geras Makedon took center stage, presenting perhaps the most novel and unique proposal for a Legion warship yet seen throughout the Naval Conference to this point:

Off-Topic: Bellerophon Mk II Carrier class Frigate • show

The key feature of the design, immediately apparent to all present, was the pair of 250-ton capacity boat bays and associated reconnaissance fighter complement. While the concept of mounting a single boat bay for the purpose of carrying scout craft was not new in Legion Naval doctrine, doing so for such a small ship as a frigate was unheard of, let alone doubling the traditional carrying capacity. Further, to accommodate the reconnaissance wing, the large active sensor array traditionally mounted on the Bellerophon-class frigates had been removed entirely, in addition to reducing the missile warning array to a smaller onboard targeting system. By gutting the class’s innate active sensor capabilities, Lord High Admiral Makedon - with the assistance of his subordinate, Lord Admiral Pothos Aleus - had devised the first primary-carrier-role ship class in Legion Naval history. Perhaps acutely aware of his precarious standing in doing this, Lord High Admiral Makedon was quick to emphasize that this proposal was not necessarily meant to replace the Bellerophons as a mainline fleet scout frigate, but could perhaps be considered as an experimental proposal meriting a squadron’s worth of ships to be constructed as a proof of concept.

Criticism was immediate and harsh, perhaps even more so than would usually be expected for an “experimental” class proposal. Much fuss was made about the fact that the ‘Carrier’ variant had made even greater sacrifices of actual fleet scouting capability than the previous ‘Raider’ variant, which had already been roundly lambasted for such deficiencies. Lord Admiral Aleus was quick to counter this, arguing that the long-range active sensor capability was secondary compared to the passive sensor capability, since no Legion weapon system functioned at ranges beyond 200,000 km anyways. In cases where active detection against a target was necessary for any reason, the fighter loadout of the class would be adequate to accomplish the task. Most of the Lords Admiral did not find this line of reasoning persuasive, although Lord Admiral Pandia did note that a passive sensor-only scouting doctrine could be effective in a commerce-raiding role, though even she would have preferred to keep the flexibility of active detection capabilities as well.

In the realm of well-considered and specific criticisms, Lord Admiral Palaestra Abderus of the Mining Corps noted that the fuel loading of the ‘Carrier’ variant was quite bare. At a mere 35,000 liters increase over the original Bellerophon design, this variant would only have enough fuel to barely travel 20 billion km and refuel each of its parasite craft once from empty. Logistically, this seemed incredibly limiting compared to the extended range being proposed for other variants, which would allow a degree of independence while still supporting battle fleet operations. Lord High Admiral Makedon attempted to justify this by noting that the combined range of the frigate and AR-56 parasite came out to over 40 billion km, but even he was forced to concede that the R-56 passive scout lacked similar range and thus the overall package represented a significant dip in passive scouting capabilities, compared to the other variants under consideration.

Curiously, perhaps the most thought-provoking comment came from Lord Admiral Chryson, who observed that the AR-56 Osprey class of recon fighters possessed the same 20 billion km range as any other Legion Naval vessel, and thus raised the question of why an entire frigate with minimal combat utility was needed when a fleet of recon fighters could do the same job with much less fuss and far fewer catastrophic losses. This observation was followed by a period of uncomfortable silence, which was only resolved by Lord Admiral Criasus, who noted that while his colleague’s question held substantive merit for discussion, it would have properly been raised in that morning’s session, and thus the session would regrettably be forced to move on towards more relevant topics. Thus, the Lords Admiralty were once again saved from the introspective horror of feeling a bit silly about themselves by the minutiae of procedure.

This is not to say that no Lords Admiral were made to feel silly about themselves at another time during the session, as several designs were proposed by various members of the assembly which were clearly far-fetched and meant to primarily show off whatever passed for “creative thinking” among the Lords Admiralty rather than as serious proposals. An outlier all its own, however, was the rather perplexing suggestion of a ‘Deep Space’ variant made by Lord Admiral Limos:

Off-Topic: Bellerophon Mk II Deep Space Scout class Frigate • show

With a top speed of only 3,750 km/s and an incredible fuel range of 85 billion km, this design was clearly not intended as a mainline fleet scout, and Lord Admiral Limos stated as much upfront. Rather, this design was intended as a supplementary proposal once the refit or replacement of the mainline Bellerophons was completed. The ‘Deep Space’ variant would augment the Legion Navy’s capabilities by providing for deep space scouting and long-range patrol roles. As such, he explained, the standard H-375 ‘Gryphon’ engines would be replaced with a pair of high-efficiency engines allowing a substantial increase in range, and the anti-missile sensor capability would be reduced as the class would not be expected to operate in close connection with a battle fleet. The reader might be surprised to learn that, according to the Conference minutes, no substantive discussion of this proposal was held, in fact not even a cursory dismissal of the proposal was advanced. In hindsight, however, it is clear that Lord Admiral Limos’ actual intent with this proposal had been in large part to devise a class which could encroach into the mandate of the Survey Command, thus angering the hot-tempered Lord High Admiral Hilaera Antilochus. This goal was accomplished successfully, followed shortly by the additional accomplishment of once again justifying the presence of the Imperial Guard detachment in the Conference chamber.

Once the pair of would-be combatants had been escorted out of the chamber, Lord Admiral Criasus called the session back to order. As the hour was growing late, and the members of the assembly peckish, the next proposal to be presented was certain to mark the conclusion of the day’s events. This dubious honor fell to none other than Lord Admiral Niobe Chryson, who presented perhaps the most predictable replacement for the Bellerophons yet, given its author:

Off-Topic: Chryson Proposal class Scout Destroyer • show

This was in fact a remarkably restrained presentation from the mercurial Lord Admiral. Indeed, the weapon batteries remained as 102 mm rather than the heavier 152 mm batteries one might have expected to see, and the hull type was merely destroyer-sized rather than cruiser-sized. The proposal even included a modest increase of 56,000 liters of fuel providing a useful range improvement for minor scouting missions.

Unfortunately, the Lords Admiral were not known for celebrating restraint. Both Lord Admiral Palaestra Abderus and Lord High Admiral Aeneas Chalcon, as experts on Legion industrial concerns, roundly criticized the heftier build cost of the ‘Chryson’ destroyer design, providing the same essential capacities as the ‘Standard’ Bellerophon Mk II design proposed by the ship design offices, but at a one-third markup accounting for additional armor, amenities, and point defense emplacements. The point defense capabilities were further criticized by Lord Admiral Aleus, who complained that the class tried to accomplish too much when purpose-built Charybdis-class destroyers had proven more than adequate in the fleet defense role. Lord Admiral Chryson tried to counter this criticism by noting that, as a reasonably capable destroyer-sized hull, her proposed design could easily fit into a typical destroyer squadron to provide sensor coverage, even on detached duties. This valiant attempt at a defense was soundly eviscerated by the assembly at large, which took severe issue with Lord Admiral Chryson’s apparent attempts to circumvent the doctrines being established at this very Naval Conference to suit her own preferences.

Notably, however, no real objections were raised to the concept of a destroyer-sized fleet scout equipped with adequate point defense batteries. Rather, the complaints were related principally to the design itself and its severe additional expense for minimal gains over the better proposals for Bellerophon Mk II variants. Additionally, Lord Admiral Abderus noted that the frigate-sized proposals had shown better fuel performance and total range, a clear advantage over the overwrought destroyer-sized class. Finally, Lord High Admiral Chalcon stated for the record that the proposed hull type would not be compatible with the same shipyard as the Charybdis class or a similar future variant, owing to the hefty cost of the sensor suite, and that even if compatibility were not an issue, yard space would be as destroyer hulls were easily the most in-demand hull type for the Legion Navy at that time given the ubiquitous need for heavy point defense capabilities on all fronts.

With Lord Admiral Chryson left to feel silly about herself, or perhaps more likely to glower in a corner plotting some measure of revenge, the Speaker of the Assembly called for motions put to a vote so the session might reach its conclusion. The votes proceeded at an unsurprisingly quick pace, given the hour of day and the desire of the Conference attendees to satisfy their appetites after such a long, hard day of work. The results are briefly summarized below:

The ‘Standard Upgrade’ Mk II variant, as proposed by the ship design staff and supported by Lord Grand Admiral Argyron and Lord High Admiral Macaria, was accepted as the primary replacement for the Bellerophon class by a vote of 12 to 2, with Lords Admiral Chryson and Pandia dissenting.
In a divisive decision, the ‘Raider’ Mk II variant, proposed by Lord Admiral Pandia, was accepted on a trial basis, to form a separate squadron of standard 3+1 composition, the ships of which would be constructed only once the entire existing Bellerophon roster had been refitted to Mk II standards. The vote passed in a confusing manner, with one vote (Lord Admiral Pandia) in favor of immediate construction, 6 votes in favor of the given result, 5 votes dissenting, and two members abstaining.
The ‘Carrier’ Mk II variant was rejected entirely in a 12-2 decision, with Lord High Admiral Makedon and Lord Admiral Aleus the sole supporters.
Various proposals taken less seriously, including Lord Admiral Limos’ ‘Deep Space’ variant, were not considered for a vote, over occasional objections.
The ‘Chryson’ destroyer-size proposal was officially “Not Accepted”, with Lord Admiral Chryson voting in favor of acceptance, 5 Lords Admiral voting for outright rejection, and the remainder voting for the less-harsh measure of non-acceptance. Notably, this indicated that at least some members of the assembly considered the use of larger hull types for fleet scouts a worthwhile future consideration, but the current design was at this time clearly considered unworkable.

With this, the fifth day of the Naval Conference came to a close, leaving only three more sessions before the official closing statements in which to finish the comprehensive redesign of the Legion Navy.

----

OOC Notes: And thus, the fleet scout question is resolved. Mostly. And has been overcomplicated with a second variant. Some doors have been slammed shut, but one door has been left wide open - and at some point in time we can only expect that the question of independent recon fighters will be revisited with interest. Really, we could not expect anything else from this bunch of Lords Admiral, I think.

Next up will be the session on Miscellaneous Business, truly a wildcard meeting in which anything might happen! Or at least it will not be more shipchat™, we will have that going for us at least. Given the current rate of posting I think we can be optimistic about hearing this part of the story sooner than later. Maybe. Perhaps. It is not impossible. At any rate, with only three sessions left plus the closing remarks, there is perhaps some light now at the end of the tunnel? We shall see.

El Pip · « **Reply #151 on:** July 07, 2022, 03:12:29 AM »

Quote from: nuclearslurpee on June 30, 2022, 10:58:34 PM

N.B. Comment replies on the bottom of the preceding page, for all two of you who care.[/i]

As one of that select and venerated elite, I can assure it was appreciated.

Quote from: nuclearslurpee on June 30, 2022, 10:58:34 PM

some members of the Legion Navy had been sounding the alarm for a good deal longer than others (most curiously, the earliest proponents of such a rework had originated from the Mining Department of all places).

The traditional home of all excellent engineers who's fate is to be overlooked by political types. Though given the terrible consequences of being the subject of political attention being overlooked is often the best option, as the Legion Design Office will doubtless agree.

Quote from: nuclearslurpee on June 30, 2022, 10:58:34 PM

shipyard spaces were freed on the commissioning of Bad Intentions and Blatant Insult.

Legion ship naming policy remains on-point and culturally appropriate.

Quote from: nuclearslurpee on June 30, 2022, 10:58:34 PM

At this point, the reader could be forgiven for attributing this as a heinous blunder on the part of the ship design staff. Indeed, failing to inform the chosen candidates about each other’s involvement was an oversight with no rational nor strategic basis, and the head of the ship design offices could not expect much in the way of future career advancement.

Did he even want career advancement is the question? What better way to avoid unwanted promotion into the political shark pit than this?

Quote from: nuclearslurpee on June 30, 2022, 10:58:34 PM

neither Lord Grand Admiral Argyron nor Lord High Admiral Macaria were willing to back down and admit error, thus both continued to express their support for the class, however reluctantly and however secretly glowering over having been forced to agree with one another by unforeseen circumstances.

Legion Doctrine is clear here - one must continue to blindly and violently support one's original plan, even once it has become apparent it is a bad idea.

Quote from: nuclearslurpee on June 30, 2022, 10:58:34 PM

This is not to say, of course, that alternatives were not explored by the Conference nevertheless. Perhaps the most compelling revision was presented by Lord Admiral Gaia Pandia, who advocated for a Bellerophon variant which was better-suited for the critical commerce raiding role:

I admire the shear gumption in calling the commerce raiding role critical and not even admitting the possiblity that such an outrageous suggestion needs anything as boring or prosaic as evidence.

Quote from: nuclearslurpee on June 30, 2022, 10:58:34 PM

Lord High Admiral Makedon - with the assistance of his subordinate, Lord Admiral Pothos Aleus - had devised the first primary-carrier-role ship class in Legion Naval history. Perhaps acutely aware of his precarious standing in doing this, Lord High Admiral Makedon was quick to emphasize that this proposal was not necessarily meant to replace the Bellerophons as a mainline fleet scout frigate, but could perhaps be considered as an experimental proposal meriting a squadron’s worth of ships to be constructed as a proof of concept.

It does indeed resemble an experimental carrier being too small, with far too few aircraft, a lack of proper facilities and so on. He should have stuck it all on a destroyer sized hull, which would also be too small but would at least address the worst of the criticisms and concerns.

Quote from: nuclearslurpee on June 30, 2022, 10:58:34 PM

This observation was followed by a period of uncomfortable silence, which was only resolved by Lord Admiral Criasus, who noted that while his colleague’s question held substantive merit for discussion, it would have properly been raised in that morning’s session, and thus the session would regrettably be forced to move on towards more relevant topics. Thus, the Lords Admiralty were once again saved from the introspective horror of feeling a bit silly about themselves by the minutiae of procedure.

If the Legion ever find a way to weaponise bureaucracy and use it against their external enemies (instead of their internal rivals) they will conqueror the galaxy in a couple of weeks.

Quote from: nuclearslurpee on June 30, 2022, 10:58:34 PM

At any rate, with only three sessions left plus the closing remarks, there is perhaps some light now at the end of the tunnel? We shall see.

Traditionally the light at the end of the tunnel is the oncoming train. But in deference to our setting, perhaps the light is an opening Aether Rift?

As you noted this is probably the best outcome that was possible given the calibre of the assembled leadership, which is admittedly a fairly low bar to clear. Are the Standard and Raider variants inter-buildable? Look like they might be close, its a BFC, guns and one sensor swap so maybe? A small detail I suppose. Interesting the preference is for upgrades and not new builds, there were other options there (new build Standard IIs for the fleet and refit the older Is into Raider variants for instance) not pursued. The conference is thinking upgrade to their existing fleet and not expansion of the number of available squadrons.

nuclearslurpee · « **Reply #152 on:** July 07, 2022, 08:33:26 AM »

Quote from: El Pip on July 07, 2022, 03:12:29 AM

Did he even want career advancement is the question? What better way to avoid unwanted promotion into the political shark pit than this?

On the other hand, one can always promote into the political shark pit and then sit quietly at the edge of the pit, letting everything be someone else's problem. Or dive directly into the fracas, doing the same.

Quote

I admire the shear gumption in calling the commerce raiding role critical and not even admitting the possiblity that such an outrageous suggestion needs anything as boring or prosaic as evidence.

We did in fairness have a previous half-chapter of evidence given, already well beyond the standards of Legion Naval debate as it was. Of course, it is understandable if the readership does not recall such things offhand, certainly one wonders if any of the Lords Admiral bother to recall such things in which case we do indeed return to the mystifying lack of evidence presented.

Quote

It does indeed resemble an experimental carrier being too small, with far too few aircraft, a lack of proper facilities and so on. He should have stuck it all on a destroyer sized hull, which would also be too small but would at least address the worst of the criticisms and concerns.

One suspects that some amongst the readership would prefer to solve all of our problems by sticking them onto destroyer-sized hulls. Command cruisers? Too big and expensive! Make it a command destroyer, the enemy will never see it coming!

Quote

As you noted this is probably the best outcome that was possible given the calibre of the assembled leadership, which is admittedly a fairly low bar to clear. Are the Standard and Raider variants inter-buildable? Look like they might be close, its a BFC, guns and one sensor swap so maybe? A small detail I suppose. Interesting the preference is for upgrades and not new builds, there were other options there (new build Standard IIs for the fleet and refit the older Is into Raider variants for instance) not pursued. The conference is thinking upgrade to their existing fleet and not expansion of the number of available squadrons.

It's been a while since I checked all the variants in-game but I believe most of them were interbuildable from the existing frigate yard (currently tooled for Mk I Bellerophon+Excelsior classes).

As far as upgrades versus new builds, the idea is to ensure that existing (a word loosely defined) capabilities are preserved before branching out, and the Standard variant Mk IIs are the ones which preserve the large anti-missile arrays. Once the refits + replacements are taken care of, the more experimental Raider variants can be built for trial purposes, frigates are soon to be optional attachments after all so it should in theory be trivial to just send these to an appropriate theater, place them nominally under the command of some Captain, and wish them good hunting. Of course, those of us not in leadership positions know that battlefield theory rarely ever meets battlefield practice.

Andrew · « **Reply #153 on:** July 07, 2022, 09:56:59 AM »

What we really need is the menu for the refreshments , lunches and other meals of the conference, possibly with recipes. This is after all the real purpose of a conference good free meals at public expense

nuclearslurpee · « **Reply #154 on:** July 07, 2022, 10:46:36 AM »

Quote from: Andrew on July 07, 2022, 09:56:59 AM

What we really need is the menu for the refreshments , lunches and other meals of the conference, possibly with recipes. This is after all the real purpose of a conference good free meals at public expense

If this AAR turns into a sci-fi recipe blog, will something have gone very wrong, or very right?

Probably the latter, if it is done in the style of Danger 5.

nuclearslurpee · « **Reply #155 on:** September 03, 2022, 06:57:11 PM »

ANNOUNCEMENT:

As one might guess from the conspicuous relocation of this thread to this new subforum, I am intending to move on to another project. This one may or may not have run its course, notably the Naval Conference I would still like to complete someday if only for posterity, but to be frank ~~2.0~~ 2.1 is out and I want to publish something about it.

I would like to pose one question to the readers, regarding future thread formats: Personally, I always liked the all-in-one-thread format as it preserves the comments alongside the updates and in theory promotes a robust discussion. However, with the Aurora forums being a bit quieter than other AAR forums I frequent, maybe this is not the best approach? What do the readers think? Is this format good, do people prefer to separate each update into its own thread with comments, or to have parallel update and comment threads as Steve and Kurt do? All opinions are welcome and in fact are actively solicited as it will be a little while until I have anything publishable on the new work.

lumporr · « **Reply #156 on:** September 04, 2022, 01:34:32 AM »

Quote from: nuclearslurpee on September 03, 2022, 06:57:11 PM

ANNOUNCEMENT:

As one might guess from the conspicuous relocation of this thread to this new subforum, I am intending to move on to another project. This one may or may not have run its course, notably the Naval Conference I would still like to complete someday if only for posterity, but to be frank ~~2.0~~ 2.1 is out and I want to publish something about it.

I would like to pose one question to the readers, regarding future thread formats: Personally, I always liked the all-in-one-thread format as it preserves the comments alongside the updates and in theory promotes a robust discussion. However, with the Aurora forums being a bit quieter than other AAR forums I frequent, maybe this is not the best approach? What do the readers think? Is this format good, do people prefer to separate each update into its own thread with comments, or to have parallel update and comment threads as Steve and Kurt do? All opinions are welcome and in fact are actively solicited as it will be a little while until I have anything publishable on the new work.

Only since you are actively soliciting...

As a reader primarily of Steve's fiction and Kurt's long-running Starfire campaign, I prefer to have the comments separated so I can just scroll and follow along like a book. Then again, I also nearly never feel the need to comment, and only occasionally look at the companion threads.

I will also say that I can't really follow along with many stories at once, and with how long AARs tend to be (and my current backlog), I only lightly follow along with the ones I see posted regularly. This might also contribute to the lack of reader response, if I had to guess.

StarshipCactus · « **Reply #157 on:** September 04, 2022, 02:45:18 AM »

I personally prefer the comments and story seperate. It's not too much of an issue though.

Foxxonius Augustus · « **Reply #158 on:** September 04, 2022, 12:24:56 PM »

If I'm honest, I prefer a combined thread as it preserves context better than separate threads. The main AAR posts tend to stand out enough to catch my eye. I just want to add that I am sad to see this story coming to an end, I understand why, but I am still sad. More than any other I have seen, this AAR really made me believe it if that makes sense. Full of action and intrigue and dramatis personae. I loved every post.

Warer · « **Reply #159 on:** September 06, 2022, 06:57:03 PM »

Either or I guess. Sadly this site lacks thread marks ala space battles and sufficient velocity so you can't have both but oh well.

Sad to hear this coming to a close but it happens. Hope you have fun with your new project, looking foreward to it!

Also if I could ask what other sites are host AAR content like this?

nuclearslurpee · « **Reply #160 on:** September 09, 2022, 07:09:52 PM »

Quote from: lumporr on September 04, 2022, 01:34:32 AM

I will also say that I can't really follow along with many stories at once, and with how long AARs tend to be (and my current backlog), I only lightly follow along with the ones I see posted regularly. This might also contribute to the lack of reader response, if I had to guess.

I've actually been quite pleasantly surprised by the reader response to this work, I think it is only behind Steve and Kurt among modern authors in terms of reader commentary. There is at least one full page (15 posts) of comments with no update, I'm rather proud of this.

That said, it did take nearly a full page of updates to start really generating comments, so there is a definite lag time and update frequency definitely affects reader involvement.

Quote from: StarshipCactus on September 04, 2022, 02:45:18 AM

I personally prefer the comments and story seperate. It's not too much of an issue though.

I think this will be the model for the new work, at least I think we will try it and see.

Quote from: Foxxonius Augustus on September 04, 2022, 12:24:56 PM

If I'm honest, I prefer a combined thread as it preserves context better than separate threads. The main AAR posts tend to stand out enough to catch my eye. I just want to add that I am sad to see this story coming to an end, I understand why, but I am still sad. More than any other I have seen, this AAR really made me believe it if that makes sense. Full of action and intrigue and dramatis personae. I loved every post.

I thank you profusely for your high praise, and I do think you will be particularly happy with the new work.

Quote from: Warer on September 06, 2022, 06:57:03 PM

Either or I guess. Sadly this site lacks thread marks ala space battles and sufficient velocity so you can't have both but oh well.

Sad to hear this coming to a close but it happens. Hope you have fun with your new project, looking foreward to it!

Also if I could ask what other sites are host AAR content like this?

Lack of threadmarks is indeed saddening, although a table of contents can help alleviate the need in theory and I will be trying this out for the next work.

The Paradox AAR forums host a great deal of high-quality work. The culture tends to vary by subforum, I mostly hang out in the HoI3 section which has a very dedicated, active, and close-knit community for such an old title. In the newer game sections it usually pays to follow authors rather than an entire section as the quality of work varies more wildly for the more popular titles. In a different section of the forums you can find Blue Emu's Aurora LPs as well which tend to have a rather laid-back style.

The Something Awful forums also host a number of Let's Plays for Aurora written over the years, and I suppose other games as well. There they have sometimes the opposite problem, the reader response may be so great that there are several pages between updates, which often devolve into a mix of questionable spam and even more questionable fanfiction efforts. Still, the audience engagement at SA has allowed authors to do some very cool concepts beyond even what the community games on this forum or Discord usually can pull off.

----

Planning to put out the pre-update material this weekend, and then possibly the first update depending on how much playtime I get this weekend and what kind of action evolves. Thanks all for the comments above to clarify the format of the next work!

Warer · « **Reply #161 on:** September 10, 2022, 05:27:43 AM »

Quote from: nuclearslurpee on September 09, 2022, 07:09:52 PM

Lack of threadmarks is indeed saddening, although a table of contents can help alleviate the need in theory and I will be trying this out for the next work.

The Paradox AAR forums host a great deal of high-quality work. The culture tends to vary by subforum, I mostly hang out in the HoI3 section which has a very dedicated, active, and close-knit community for such an old title. In the newer game sections it usually pays to follow authors rather than an entire section as the quality of work varies more wildly for the more popular titles. In a different section of the forums you can find Blue Emu's Aurora LPs as well which tend to have a rather laid-back style.

The Something Awful forums also host a number of Let's Plays for Aurora written over the years, and I suppose other games as well. There they have sometimes the opposite problem, the reader response may be so great that there are several pages between updates, which often devolve into a mix of questionable spam and even more questionable fanfiction efforts. Still, the audience engagement at SA has allowed authors to do some very cool concepts beyond even what the community games on this forum or Discord usually can pull off.

Thanks for the response. Sadly Something Awful has cut off access to anons so I can no longer read all the LPs on there, oh well. Good luck!

nuclearslurpee · « **Reply #162 on:** September 10, 2022, 09:58:15 AM »

Quote from: Warer on September 10, 2022, 05:27:43 AM

Thanks for the response. Sadly Something Awful has cut off access to anons so I can no longer read all the LPs on there, oh well. Good luck!

I've noticed they seem to do that around this time of year for no good reason. Usually comes back in a couple of months.

Warer · « **Reply #163 on:** September 10, 2022, 10:31:55 AM »

Quote from: nuclearslurpee on September 10, 2022, 09:58:15 AM

Quote from: Warer on September 10, 2022, 05:27:43 AM
Thanks for the response. Sadly Something Awful has cut off access to anons so I can no longer read all the LPs on there, oh well. Good luck!

I've noticed they seem to do that around this time of year for no good reason. Usually comes back in a couple of months.

...Well thats rather bizzare. My guess is trying to encourage people to buy a membership and or chase off people who aren't going to get one? But thats besides the point, thanks for the info.

Good luck with Duranium Legion 2 Uridium Boggloo

Garfunkel · « **Reply #164 on:** October 03, 2022, 07:06:39 AM »

Hot damn dude, half of the thread length is this naval conference! That's amazing 🤩

Anyway, sorry for not commenting earlier, always something came in the way of reading this thread. But you've really spun a lovely story here so congratulations and I'm eagerly looking forward for.the next installment.

Author Topic: The Official Chronicle of the Duranium Legion (Read 34950 times)

nuclearslurpee (OP)

The Duranium Legion - Chapter XXI, Part 6: A Fracas About Frigates (2/2)

El Pip

Re: The Duranium Legion - Chapter XXI, Part 6: A Fracas About Frigates (2/2)

nuclearslurpee (OP)

Re: The Duranium Legion - Chapter XXI, Part 6: A Fracas About Frigates (2/2)

Andrew

Re: The Official Chronicle of the Duranium Legion

nuclearslurpee (OP)

Re: The Official Chronicle of the Duranium Legion

nuclearslurpee (OP)

Re: The Official Chronicle of the Duranium Legion

lumporr

Re: The Official Chronicle of the Duranium Legion

StarshipCactus

Re: The Official Chronicle of the Duranium Legion

Foxxonius Augustus

Re: The Official Chronicle of the Duranium Legion

Warer

Re: The Official Chronicle of the Duranium Legion

nuclearslurpee (OP)

Re: The Official Chronicle of the Duranium Legion

Warer

Re: The Official Chronicle of the Duranium Legion

nuclearslurpee (OP)

Re: The Official Chronicle of the Duranium Legion

Warer

Re: The Official Chronicle of the Duranium Legion

Garfunkel

Re: The Official Chronicle of the Duranium Legion