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Posted by: nuclearslurpee

« on: December 04, 2021, 10:11:03 AM »

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Quote from: L0ckAndL0ad on December 04, 2021, 09:26:07 AM

Well, given how easy it is to pick their ships apart one by one after some damage was done to each, CIWS isn't that bad of an idea, IMO. Using missiles would've been much smarter on their part though. IIRC Steve said something like some NPRs may evolve their doctrine over time under some circumstances, or am I imagining things? The fact that this particular NPR does not use missiles at all made this "reconnaissance" mission much much easier than it could've been.

The NPR will generally to a limited degree evolve its tactics over time, as it learns about your capabilities, but their actual ship design doctrine as far as I know is pretty much fixed at generation. At least, I don't know of anywhere in the DB where any kind of doctrinal evolution is stored.

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Lack of diplomatic options, or not knowing if they are engaged in contact/wars with somebody else, is something that makes me sad, yes. I REALLY love diplomatic relations. It's great to have an opportunity to use all the hardware that I spent countless hours designing, but more intricate diplomatic interplay is much more interesting to me any day of the week.

Big reason why many people play with multiple player races. If you can handle the roleplaying aspect instead of "playing to win" or playing "optimally" you can get a lot of that complexity the NPRs lack.

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Another unknown is... would their cocky behavior change even if we can manage to bring new peace? Would they continue to say one thing and do another like it happened before?

They would probably behave the same as before as the traits which govern behavior (particularly Xenophobia) are again fixed on generation. You might see some differences due to the fact that they have more intel on your race and are rightly worried about your power level, though.

Posted by: L0ckAndL0ad

« on: December 04, 2021, 09:26:07 AM »

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Quote from: nuclearslurpee on November 29, 2021, 09:30:15 AM

Unless the marines are very out of date, it really should not take so much unless the formation is designed very oddly. I suspect the big problem was that a lot of marines were lost in the boarding attempt. Attempting to board a ship at full speed from a relatively slow ship (e.g., battleships - as opposed to fast assault shuttles commonly used) will cause many boarders to be lost in the attempt, probably in the region of 80% to 90% actually under these conditions.

I can't find the logs right now, but I'm pretty sure it's both. Quite a lot of them died before entering, and the Trif technology is most likely higher than mine in some aspects, so... yeah.. Gruesome death that was, for a training exercise.

Quote from: nuclearslurpee on November 29, 2021, 09:30:15 AM

Am I the only one who find it hilarious that the NPR puts nine Gauss turrets on a 25,000-ton cruiser, and then thinks to itself "you know what this really needs? Yet another Gauss turret, but this time completely useless for actually escorting anything!" and slaps on a CIWS? Which is probably actually heavier thanks to the integrated BFC and sensor...

Otherwise it's not a bad ship, but head-scratchers like that are part of why NPRs struggle to look vaguely competitive against player races.

Well, given how easy it is to pick their ships apart one by one after some damage was done to each, CIWS isn't that bad of an idea, IMO. Using missiles would've been much smarter on their part though. IIRC Steve said something like some NPRs may evolve their doctrine over time under some circumstances, or am I imagining things? The fact that this particular NPR does not use missiles at all made this "reconnaissance" mission much much easier than it could've been.

Quote from: nuclearslurpee on November 29, 2021, 09:30:15 AM

This actually has nothing to do with range, firing at ground forces has no range component to accuracy but is affected only by the base %CTH (20%, reduced by 2/3) and fortification level - the latter is almost surely 6x times any planetary terrain modifier so hit rates in the 1% to 3% range are likely.

It will be better to get into range of the planetary STOs so that you can target them directly instead of shooting at the ground forces indiscriminately, this will reduce the collateral damage you end up dealing before landing troops.

Oh, I see. I do not think I really want a ground war right now anyway..

Quote from: nuclearslurpee on November 29, 2021, 09:30:15 AM

With the NPRs, diplomacy is difficult at best after a shooting war because there is no peace treaty mechanic, so they are at something like -9000 relations and this will take a very long time to reach back to -100 or better. However, if you have completely destroyed their navy and shipbuilding it is not impossible to park a diplo ship nearby and let it work for a decade or two.

Otherwise, for planetary conquest I would probably try to eliminate the STOs from orbit, this will cause collateral damage but it is unavoidable, and Str-18 particle lance STOs will eat alive any assault transports with less than 18 armor making a ground assault very difficult to pull off. Note that to destroy the STOs you do not need maximum-strength weapons, in practice you would find that the minimum caliber of weapon which can outrange the enemy STOs should be sufficient to kill any STO it strikes. Railguns are good as they get multiple shots per firing with low base damage thus less collateral damage, however range may be an issue if you have not invested a lot in railgun tech. Otherwise something like 15cm lasers, maybe 20cm depending on what kind of range tech you have to work with should be sufficient. Once all STOs are eliminated (check for short-range Gauss turrets!) you can start to mass troops on a nearby moon and then conduct landing operations - I hope you have built many transports for this purpose! You will likely need 5-10 million tons of ground troops to take a NPR home world.

I wonder if they have another shipbuilding-capable colony out there. Regardless, if they build new ships, they all are going to be quite fast and beefy. Even without missiles, they would be PITA to deal with, compared to the designs we've encountered so far.

Lack of diplomatic options, or not knowing if they are engaged in contact/wars with somebody else, is something that makes me sad, yes. I REALLY love diplomatic relations. It's great to have an opportunity to use all the hardware that I spent countless hours designing, but more intricate diplomatic interplay is much more interesting to me any day of the week.

Another unknown is... would their cocky behavior change even if we can manage to bring new peace? Would they continue to say one thing and do another like it happened before?

Posted by: nuclearslurpee

« on: November 29, 2021, 09:30:15 AM »

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Quote from: L0ckAndL0ad on October 23, 2021, 12:50:22 PM

It was humiliating. Three 36,000 ton battleships approached a small scout, sent their heavy marines in and failed miserably. Sure, of course we did blew up the scout with guns afterwards, but... yeah... The presence of marines on capital ships was a doubtful choice. They were put there for two reasons: 1) additional security of the ship against boarding; 2) allow taking over enemy ships if there's an opportunity.

Clearly, you need more marines to successfully board a ship. Anyway...

Unless the marines are very out of date, it really should not take so much unless the formation is designed very oddly. I suspect the big problem was that a lot of marines were lost in the boarding attempt. Attempting to board a ship at full speed from a relatively slow ship (e.g., battleships - as opposed to fast assault shuttles commonly used) will cause many boarders to be lost in the attempt, probably in the region of 80% to 90% actually under these conditions.

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(size 20 wh 65 heavy ASM is already in production)

It is a truth universally acknowledged, that a single AAR in possession of a good tech level, must become Warhammer.

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Operation Avalanche

Type: Reconnaissance in force

Human forces
several hundred thousand tons of bloody murder machines

The emphasis here is clearly on "in force" and I for one approve.

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A new plan emerged. What if we assault another jump point? The BIG ONE! Yeah, there are million thousand tons of combat ships there, but they are 11b km away from the JP. We can extend the end destination of this operation to the Trif homeworld!

Very much in force.

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Kotlin class frigates, fast and deadly with their spinal lasers, were guarding the EC jump point, when at 0054 four enemy ships entered the system. These were inferior, old generation designs: 1x CA, 2x DE, 1x JCS. They were... escorting a jump gate construction ship somewhere?

The NPR never disappoints... unless you are their mother, then you are very disappointed.

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What is interesting is that, for these ships to get to where they were now at current speed, they had to depart Beta III a while ago. Like, in the early days of September. About when we assaulted the gate camp in DC on Sept 5th. Something like that.

This is probably why there was no welcome party at the JP to this home system, the welcome party was still in transit.

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Lothlorien IV class Escort Cruiser

Am I the only one who find it hilarious that the NPR puts nine Gauss turrets on a 25,000-ton cruiser, and then thinks to itself "you know what this really needs? Yet another Gauss turret, but this time completely useless for actually escorting anything!" and slaps on a CIWS? Which is probably actually heavier thanks to the integrated BFC and sensor...

Otherwise it's not a bad ship, but head-scratchers like that are part of why NPRs struggle to look vaguely competitive against player races.

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Trif ground forces on the surface were targeted next. But it was quickly realized that at current range, the accuracy was too low to do any meaningful damage to them. Civilian casualties as a result of collateral damage were high and the idea was quickly abandoned.

This actually has nothing to do with range, firing at ground forces has no range component to accuracy but is affected only by the base %CTH (20%, reduced by 2/3) and fortification level - the latter is almost surely 6x times any planetary terrain modifier so hit rates in the 1% to 3% range are likely.

It will be better to get into range of the planetary STOs so that you can target them directly instead of shooting at the ground forces indiscriminately, this will reduce the collateral damage you end up dealing before landing troops.

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Operation Avalanche was a success. We did everything we wanted to, and then some. Lots of intel gathered, enemy shipyards and hundreds thousands of tons of military vessels destroyed, combat experience gained. Now, Humanity had to reevaluate their entire navy arsenal and structure. Also, how can we end this war? Sending an invasion force to take over the EC Beta III seemed like a difficult and bloody task. Should we just stop and let the diplomats talk again?

With the NPRs, diplomacy is difficult at best after a shooting war because there is no peace treaty mechanic, so they are at something like -9000 relations and this will take a very long time to reach back to -100 or better. However, if you have completely destroyed their navy and shipbuilding it is not impossible to park a diplo ship nearby and let it work for a decade or two.

Otherwise, for planetary conquest I would probably try to eliminate the STOs from orbit, this will cause collateral damage but it is unavoidable, and Str-18 particle lance STOs will eat alive any assault transports with less than 18 armor making a ground assault very difficult to pull off. Note that to destroy the STOs you do not need maximum-strength weapons, in practice you would find that the minimum caliber of weapon which can outrange the enemy STOs should be sufficient to kill any STO it strikes. Railguns are good as they get multiple shots per firing with low base damage thus less collateral damage, however range may be an issue if you have not invested a lot in railgun tech. Otherwise something like 15cm lasers, maybe 20cm depending on what kind of range tech you have to work with should be sufficient. Once all STOs are eliminated (check for short-range Gauss turrets!) you can start to mass troops on a nearby moon and then conduct landing operations - I hope you have built many transports for this purpose! You will likely need 5-10 million tons of ground troops to take a NPR home world.

Posted by: L0ckAndL0ad

« on: November 08, 2021, 01:10:21 PM »

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November 5, 2104

TF5's scouts have reacquired contact with Trif battlecruisers on Delta Carinae jump point. There were 2 BC, 3 BCJ, 4 DD, 2 JD. Their task group CO wasn't bright though - the entire gate camp fleet chased after the AEW craft, more than two times faster than their ships. Nothing else was found in the area.

Three days later, Coral Sea was close enough for a missile strike. Heavy Attack Group, which included ELINT-equipped C2IJ battleships, was shadowing the enemy force, monitoring their emissions and gathering data, while 30 LACs made attack runs with ASM-200s.

In the first wave, 22 out of 30 missiles have reached their targets. Escort Cruisers were priority targets, with two destroyed outright while the third got crippled and was detached to be later finished by human frigates. The second wave was... spectacular! With massed PD fire of cruisers gone, every single heavy ASM hit what it was aiming at, producing thirty strength 65 detonations. Four enemy battlecruisers perished in this giant nuclear fireball of death and destruction.

In the third wave, the destroyers were targeted. They were two generations newer than the battlecruisers, so ECM and higher top speed reduced our hit chances significantly (to ~79%-92%). But this did not help them much. What was left was swept by the beam fire of Heavy Attack Group.

After that, TF5 reassembled and left Eta Cassiopeiae on November 11.

A week later, Task Force 5 reached friendly space and received the last portion of fuel and supplies from replenishment tankers on their journey back to Sol.

Operation Avalanche was a success. We did everything we wanted to, and then some. Lots of intel gathered, enemy shipyards and hundreds thousands of tons of military vessels destroyed, combat experience gained. Now, Humanity had to reevaluate their entire navy arsenal and structure. Also, how can we end this war? Sending an invasion force to take over the EC Beta III seemed like a difficult and bloody task. Should we just stop and let the diplomats talk again?

Posted by: L0ckAndL0ad

« on: November 07, 2021, 11:32:12 AM »

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October 10, 2104

Coral Sea got close enough for its EW craft to reach the Trif home planet, and what they've found there was... really strange. A bunch of Beam Defense Bases and a shipyard complex were the only orbital contacts on the radar. Not a single ship was present. They've evacuated their civilian shipping!

But... where did all the military ships go to?

Just two days later, Task Force 1 (-), 10b km away from there, sitting damaged, outnumbered and outgunned at the Jump Point to Delta Carinae, got a part of the answer. Very unfriendly 2 BC, 3 BCJ, 3 CLE showed up on their sensors. As long range rescue shuttles have already departed from Eta Cassiopeiae, and there was 0 chance for TF1 to make even slight amount of damage to the incoming enemy force, it was decided that the retreat was in order. Task Force 5, still deep in-system near Beta star, was to fight their way out of here from now on.

With all the BDBs in orbit of Beta III, a carrier strike, or any sort of missile strike at all, was impossible. Too much PD to go through. So the frigate squadron and the heavy attack group were detached from TF5 to attack the planet while it's least guarded. Faster frigates arrived first, and came into laser range on October 14.

Now, a question of what Humanity should attack came up. Glassing the planet with all its population from orbit seemed very... inhumane, even if practical. We weren't ready to commit such a xenocide. The next strategic target would be the orbital shipyards. And that's what the frigates attacked. Their fire from max range was really ineffective, however. Coolant and repair supplies went below 50% across the flotilla pretty fast and they were ordered to retreat back to TF5 Main Body.

When several days later the battleships came in, things turned out much better. They've also burned through most of its onboard coolant and spare part supplies, but THE SHIPYARDS WERE NO MORE. We've destroyed ALL of them. This meant a lot for the war effort! If this was the only major Trif planet with production capacities, it'll take them a while before they can continue building military ships in large numbers. We did not expect to hit such a target when the operation was first envisioned, but here we are.

Trif ground forces on the surface were targeted next. But it was quickly realized that at current range, the accuracy was too low to do any meaningful damage to them. Civilian casualties as a result of collateral damage were high and the idea was quickly abandoned.

Next, BDBs were targeted. They were not seen as strategic target this time, but we needed to get as much information on their capabilities as possible. So each different one was attacked and destroyed. Heavy Attack Group's supplies went even lower now, and we tried to close in to improve accuracy.

It was too much. At 219 thousand kilometers from the planet, STOs opened up on TG 5.1. And, like any proper Trif warship, they were also equipped with strength 18 particle lances. 14 deadly beams have found their targets. Destroyer Dade with Commander George Theodopoulos in charge got torn into pieces almost instantly, with only a quarter of her crew making it to life pods in time. Battleships were hit, but their shields saved them from any damage.

Cruiser C.H.M. Jones received multiple hits, with Captain Joan Sirman and 138 sailors dying immediately. All engines and many critical systems were lost, and so the XO gave order to abandon ship to prevent further loss of lives. 35 missiles were launched in anger from the tubes of C.H.M. Jones, as 312 of the original 450 complement reached the escape pods. All missiles were shot down, of course.

TG 5.1 pulled back from the planet, while the rescue shuttles on board CV Coral Sea were called upon to retrieve the life pods. STO contacts were targeted, but very few were actually hit. It was time to return home. TF 5 reformed and headed for the Jump Point to Delta Carinae.

Posted by: L0ckAndL0ad

« on: November 07, 2021, 09:34:05 AM »

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September 30, 2104

While Task Force 5 was advancing towards Trif home planet, the only Jump Point in Eta Cassiopeiae (that we know of) was guarded by a small group of human ships: 1 CA 4 DD of what used to be Task Force 1. It was leading to a no man's land type of system Delta Carinae, and was the only way for TF5 to return home.

It was foolish to expect that TF5 managed to find and neutralize all the ships that were coming from Beta III planet since our arrival. At 2307 on Sept 30, seven ships showed up near the Jump Point, going at almost 15 thousand km/s. These were immediately identified as Myth Drannor IV class diplomatic ships. But given their military components and high speed, I was very cautious.

Diplomatic ships turned around 90m km from the TF1 and kept lurking on the edge of our sensors. TF1 stayed put and kept guarding the Jump Point. In the following days, they disappeared. We were hoping that Trif would start saving their own people from life pods, and fast diplo ships were a good fit for such a mission, but the distress beacons kept calling for help. It was clear at this point that Duchy of Trif wasn't going to rescue anyone, in their own damn home system, and we had to call for another Ranger sortie from Sol to get them out.

But it paid off. We gained another piece of valuable intel by interrogating a recently rescued Trif naval crew. They've given us full specs of the latest generation of Trif Escort Cruisers:

Lothlorien IV class Escort Cruiser (Duchy of Trif)

Off-Topic: show

Their engine technology was clearly superior! 1200 Gauss Cannon shots per minute, 9 levels of armor and ECM 30 also looked impressive and hellishly hard to counter with our current arsenal.

At 0340 on October 5, Task Force 1 (-) was alerted by another group of contacts. 4 DD, 2 JD, 2 DE, all Gen III ships with top speed of 9120 km/s came from the direction of Beta III. As with the previous group of diplomatic ships, they started running in circles on the edge of our sensors, maybe trying to draw missile fire at maximum range where they can spoil them.

By 1930, another group of destroyers appeared from the direction of the primary star: 4 DD, 1 JD, 1 DE. But these guys kept coming towards TF1 and weren't turning back. As the range closed to several million kilometers, it was clear that the battle is inevitable, and we had to keep the control of the Jump Point, standing our ground firmly. Some of the Ranger class shuttles with rescued Trif crews on board were still in the system and had to come through here in the following days, or they'll need a rescue effort of their own.

The first missile volley fired from our four destroyers have annihilated one enemy ship and damaged armor of three more. They kept coming. Human cruiser C.C.N.Y. Victory fired its full salvo of ASMs moments later, stopping another ship and dealing mild damage to few others. Close range beam combat was about to start, and human vessels needed to speed up and close the distance to maximize their offensive potential.

2 Trif DD, 1 JD and 1 DE have made it far enough to be able to fire their Particle Lances, focusing on the cruiser. Multiple successful strength 18 hits have made CA's shields disappear instantly, with one of them penetrating the armor and dealing damage to internal modules. 10 human sailors died, and some secondary weapons got disabled, but the ship remained operational. Humans returned fire, destroying another Trif DD. Shorter ranged 120mm FUV Lasers on our destroyers weren't super effective, but at 64 thousand kilometers they did the job well enough to wreck one more DD 10 seconds later.

At this point, enemy JD and DE turned around and ran for their lives, not able to effectively return fire. An immediate order was given to move out to finish the disabled destroyer that lost all of its engines. But it turned out that its guns were still very much operational. And one of them hit the cruiser, dealing her a severe blow: 30 crew lost, one engine disabled, one of the main fuel tanks vaporized, long range radar and damage control station destroyed.

Any sort of chase was deemed too dangerous. The attack was repelled and that was it. We had to ignore the disabled Trif DD near the jump point, and keep guarding it as long as possible. Repair efforts on C.C.N.Y. Victory quickly restored the disabled engine and that meant it was good enough to stay here and fight if needed again.

Posted by: El Pip

« on: November 05, 2021, 06:07:06 AM »

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A series of engagements that validates the view of Tactical Adviser nuclearslurpee - Humanity does indeed have overwhelming tactical superiority so the enemy's vast numbers are not as threatening as they appear on paper.

Posted by: L0ckAndL0ad

« on: November 05, 2021, 04:05:41 AM »

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December 24, 2104

By 0400, the enemy destroyer group fell behind and we've lost contact with them. 8 human frigates approached Trif battlecruiser squadron and fired all of their heavy ASMs. This would be the first employment of ASM-200 Demiurge in combat.

There was no intel on thickness of enemy BC armor. Or their maximum firing range. For future standoff ASM attacks on this group, CLEs were the main threat, so all 16 ASM-200s were allocated against escort cruisers. Intel rated their armor at level 6. And, oh boy, did they wreck them! With nine strength 65 detonations and one strength 82 secondary explosion that occurred, the first cruiser was hit so badly it lost all power, and the other two were destroyed outright!

The heavy ASM was clearly a better weapon for dealing with densely armored opponents. 66% PD bypass rate, however, did not look that good, compared to previous employment of ASM-62 en masse. Frigates were equipped with two missile fire control systems, one for each missile, which should maximize PD countermeasure efforts. But such a weapon would most likely have a hard time penetrating much more concentrated anti-missile defenses. So, arming the fleet with a mixture of both heavy and lighter missiles seems more flexible. Maybe even calling the heavy ASM a torpedo would be appropriate, given the similarity to the old day wet navy torpedoes on Earth? And treating them as such employment wise.

The Trif battlecruisers have lost all their dedicated anti-missile support, unless the destroyers were to join them. The frigate flotilla tried to reach the wounded CLE to finish it off, but the BCs were getting in a way. As human battleships were still on their way, the frigates closed in for a brief attack, testing enemy battlecruiser armor.

It was a brave thing to do, getting close to these giant battle wagons. But seeing how good our lasers are against their defense, or if they had missiles, or some other trick up their sleeve, was one of the main goals of this operation, and so it had to be done. Frigates, slowly but surely, pinched away at one enemy BC and one BCJ and managed to damage their engines, forcing the enemy task group commander to detach them. From there on, the superior speed of the frigates allowed opening up the distance, and, with some skilled maneuvering around the battlefield, a total destruction of 1 BC, 1 BCJ, and finishing off the remaining CLE.

As battle raged on, MSP and coolant supplies had to be used to make fast repairs and keep the overheated beam weapons from exploding. Frigates, even with their potent 500mm SXR Spinal Lasers, were not well suited to deal with such a big number of heavy ships. So they were ordered to disengage and reacquire contact with the enemy destroyers. And that's what they did. They weren't that hard to find, as they trailed behind the BCs.

In the following engagement, frigate captains got a bit cocky and closed into enemy weapon range, tanking particle lance fire with shields and sometimes retreating back to recharge. Friendly laser fire grew deadlier as frigates closed in and allowed for a swift and decisive victory against the destroyer group.

Now, the frigates were ordered back to rejoin the main body of Task Force 5 for resupply, while battleships got into range to duel with Trif battlecruisers. Well, it wasn't going to be a "BB vs BC duel", given human superior numbers and weaponry. We weren't going to send our BBs alone. But, you may say that we tried to fight with one hand behind our back, holding onto ASMs and using lasers solely instead. A decision most likely not welcomed by unarmored and unshielded destroyer crews, but that's a pretty old duty for tin cans.

On September 27, at 2211, a combined human Heavy Attack group, comprised of 2 BBJ, 4 BB, 2 CA, 4 DD came into Missile Defense radar range with 4 Trif BC and 2 BCJ. To maximize our firing efforts, initial range was set to 100k km, but had to be increased once to recharge shields. Enemy ships never tried firing on our smaller vessels, and so they were spared the deadly lance fire.

100k was enough for 400mm SXR lasers to successfully penetrate 8 layers of armor, but the enemy battlecruisers only had 7. So it was more than enough to annihilate enemy ships one by one as our concentrated fire teared their defenseless hulls apart. Another day, another victory, and no losses.

As there was no more enemies to crush, TG 5.1 was ordered to rejoin the rest of the force and continue moving towards enemy home planet.

Posted by: L0ckAndL0ad

« on: November 04, 2021, 03:00:29 PM »

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At 1700 on September 19, 2104, our two heavy attack groups have made a synchronized squadron jump into Eta Cassiopeiae, the home system of Trif. The first group landed 110 thousand kilometers away from the existing Gate, which felt a bit too close for comfort. Second group appeared ~600k out. Strangely enough, there was nobody hostile waiting on the other side. No welcoming party.

Eta Cassiopeiae had two stars. Alpha was orbited by a single gas giant. Beta, the outer system, was 10.7b km away and had 7 planets of various types, the third of which was Trif home planet. Alpha was just 460m km away from the JP, and so the fast frigate flotilla that accompanied the assault force was sent to search for targets there. 12 hours later, their radars picked up a group of ships near the gas giant. They were all of the same unidentified class that looked like a bunch of big civilian hulls.

Human frigate captains were hesitant at first. Destroying Trif military ships was not that morally ambiguous. Or taking out trespassing snoopers of various kind. But this was different. These were civilian ships, probably harvesting fuel in their own system. Maybe even for profit, unrelated to any military actions. However, we were not attacking the crews. We were attacking the ships which were a part of a complex military leviathan. Even if the fuel from the harvesters did not go directly to supply the enemy warships, their activity was most likely taxed to exert funds used to build the war machines anyway. The ships had to be destroyed. And so they were. They did not even try to escape or surrender. They exploded, one by one, until none remained intact.

When it came to rescuing the life pods in this system, came up the bitter memories of all those human souls we've lost after being ambushed by Trif ships. Trif never picked our survivors. But we did gather prisoners for intel before. Or was it just out of decency, to make us feel that we're better than the enemy? Regardless... Here, in this instance, we felt that Trif should deal with their own casualties and what little cryo capacities we have around should be reserved for our own use. War is hell.

Couple of hours later, CV Coral Sea have arrived. Three Early Warning craft were sent out in the direction of the outer system. 10b km is too far away for us to reach, but we could scout a thin line from here to half way there (or 4.5b km, to be exact), in case someone is coming from Beta to get us.

There was no need to wait for scouts to reveal anything because we already knew where the enemy was. Coral Sea was already accompanied by a pair of underway replenishment vessels. So all the groups were combined into a single formation which allowed for a long journey deep into the Eta Cassiopeiae. Defender class destroyers had the shortest range of all ships, 10b km, and so the trip could not be done without serious involvement of auxiliary ships.

I forgot to mention that we've already fully surveyed the EC system for jump points previously. And the one we came from was the only one we knew existed. So the chance of finding the enemy going towards us from somewhere other than the Delta Carinae jump point or Beta star was pretty slim. Coral Sea had only 6 long range EW craft on board, and even using twice as much would never suffice to cover the entire vastness of space surrounding us.

The scouting plan went great! On September 22, a group of hostile warships was detected 2.5b km out in the direction of Beta system. A second group was picked up just 20 minutes later. The vanguard comprised 4 DD, 2 JD, 2 DE. They were followed by 5 BC, 3 BCJ, 3 CLE. Now that's quite a welcoming party!

What is interesting is that, for these ships to get to where they were now at current speed, they had to depart Beta III a while ago. Like, in the early days of September. About when we assaulted the gate camp in DC on Sept 5th. Something like that.

As attacking craft on Coral Sea were capable of striking at 400-500 million km away, and we had 2 billion more to go, the frigates were detached to advance independently, while the rest of the force moved in long range travel formation with replenishment ships. There was still enough time to decide on a best way to spend the limited ammo and supplies we had. We could make 4 full carrier strikes with heavy ASMs. But our battleships and frigates were in perfect shape for a beam fight, so reserving ammo for another engagement seemed like a more favorable option.

Posted by: L0ckAndL0ad

« on: November 01, 2021, 03:25:49 PM »

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Operation Avalanche

Basics

Type: Reconnaissance in force
Target: Delta Carinae system
Distances:
----
2.2b km Sol: Earth - Umi JP
85 km Umi: Sol JP - Delta Carinae JP
1.66b km DC: Umi JP - Eta Cassiopeiae JP
11b km EC: Delta Carinae JP - Eta Cassiopeiae B III
----
~4b km to the far end of DC system, 15b km TOTAL from Earth to Trif home planet

Enemy forces

Previously observed 3x CA 1x CLE 1x JD 2x DD 3x DE in Delta Carinae guarding Umi JP, while Eta Cassiopeiae is suspected to be the homeworld where million of tons of enemy ships are stationed. One fast scout in Umi system near Delta Carinae JP keeps watch on approaches. CAs and DDs are armed with str-18 particle lances, escort ships with Gauss Cannons. No missile capability shown yet.

Human forces

1x CV Coral Sea: Coral Sea
2x BB Surigao C2IJ: Chesapeake, Trafalgar
4x BB Surigao: Guadalcanal, Jutland, Surigao, Tsushima
6x CA Challenger R2: C. C. N. Y. Victory, C. Francis Jenkins, C. H. M. Jones, Ca Ira, Cabana, Calypso

17x DD Defender R2: D Artagnon, d Entrecasteaux, D. W. Harrington, Da Nang, Dabra-Markos, Dacca, Daclau-Sar, Dadao, Dade, Dade County, Dagger, Daggett County, Dagon, Dague, Dahan-i-Kasha, Dahan-i-Kusna, Defender

8x FF Kotlin: Ceram, Fremantle, Kotlin, Mann, Metida, Perry, Roum, Viscount

Carrier Wing One (CV Coral Sea):
6x AEW E-1 Watcher
6x FTR F-2A Retribution
30x LAC A-2A Absolution
2x JSC SJ-2 Torchbearer
3x RS H-1 Sotiris

1x RB Ananke
4x ARS Recovery
8x AOR Reliant

Human OOB

2x Heavy Attack Groups:
1x BB (C2IJ)
2x BB
1x CA
2x DD

1x Frigate Flotilla:
8x FF

1x Carrier Group
1x CV
3x CA
8x DD

4x UNREP Divisions:
2x AOR

1x Reserve
1x CA
4x DD

Goals

- Practice Jump Point assault against actual enemy (Duchy of Trif)
- Gain combat experience employing existing systems, weapons and ships
- Observe enemy ship types, formation compositions, behavior, weapons and other technology

Basically, we need to learn as much information as possible on what the TRIF Navy is made of, how good our existing ships and tactics are, what works, what doesn't, and what can we change to make things better.

Planning

I knew there were combat ships waiting in Delta Carinae on Umi JP, ready to ambush whatever comes their way. The problem is, intel indicates that all of their ships, even destroyers, are armed with str-18 particle lances. Second generation ships have 240k km range on their beams. So the newly constructed BBs were chosen to make the jump assault, given their ability to withstand heavy fire.

Two heavy groups will make a simultaneous assault on JP. The carrier group and frigates are to follow into Delta Carinae system, hunting down whatever comes their way. Rescue and Salvage ships will come in to gather the remains of enemy ships, while supply divisions will move around between forces when practical.

September 5, 2104

It takes too long to train crews for all the newly built ships to 100%. So I waited roughly halfway through the process and assembled the forces as soon as enough ammunition and fighters were available to start the operation. Only fully trained units have seen combat with Trif previously. But this operation gives an opportunity to see how quickly mobilized and freshly built up forces can be used in combat, and how it affects their effectiveness and the outcome.

There was a Trif scout in Umi system, monitoring Delta Carinae JP. A single old destroyer was sent to deal with it, before the main forces were to reach the JP. But the scout came to be faster than our destroyer (7396 vs 6031 km/s). Regardless, the scout retreated far away from the JP allowing the assaulting forces to arrive undetected.

At 02:56:35, two heavy attack groups made squadron jumps into Delta Carinae system, dropping out 450-600k km away from the Jump Point. They were met by 3x CA, 1x CLE, 3x DE. Trif welcoming party started moving into beam range, or running away from the jump point, allowing the frigate flotilla to make a standard transit via the gate and join the fight very quickly.

When ships were about to come into the beam range, the first dilemma arose: spending all missiles against such insignificant targets seemed very wasteful, while not firing seemed dangerous for ships not equipped with shields. Therefore smaller missiles from cruisers and destroyers were sent against enemy cruisers, annihilating all four in less than a minute. Battleships kept their heavy ASMs safely under the the thick armor and shields.

Focused laser fire from frigates, battleships and cruisers quickly finished the remaining Destroyer Escorts. By 0300, the entire enemy force was reduced to a bunch of floating wrecks, with no damage taken by human ships.

Frigates were sent in the direction of Eta Cassiopeiae as scouts, while heavy attack groups formed a single fleet and went to hold position near the system's primary star. As there was only one planet, a gas giant, and several comets, there was no place for Trif to make an outpost. Regardless, all orbital bodies were scouted and watched closely. By the time CV Coral Sea arrived into Delta Carinae and AEW scouts went out to scan, it was pretty clear that there was nothing in this system at all. No other combat ships, no civilian traffic.

Delta Carinae was empty.

A new plan emerged. What if we assault another jump point? The BIG ONE! Yeah, there are million thousand tons of combat ships there, but they are 11b km away from the JP. We can extend the end destination of this operation to the Trif homeworld!

As Resupply Base Ananke was relatively nearby, the Heavy Attack force went back to rearm missiles for its cruisers and destroyers. Unforeseen circumstances delayed their return and by September 13, only frigates and the carrier group were deep inside Delta Carinae. Kotlin class frigates, fast and deadly with their spinal lasers, were guarding the EC jump point, when at 0054 four enemy ships entered the system. These were inferior, old generation designs: 1x CA, 2x DE, 1x JCS. They were... escorting a jump gate construction ship somewhere?

This new arrival presented VERY little new information and no danger, so heavy ASMs on Kotlins were held in reserve. Thankfully, the frigates had shields that can stop one or two lance hits, so flushing out the tubes quickly should not be a problem if necessary. As expected, there was no need for missiles, as speed and range advantage gave an opportunity to dissolve all targets into burning hulks by 0125. Badly trained crews made synchronized firing impossible, but it was good enough.

As with previous engagement, Ranger class rescue shuttles from Sol came by to gather the survivors from the life pods, and returned prisoners back to Earth. But most of the wrecks presented little interest to Humanity and were ignored.

Posted by: L0ckAndL0ad

« on: October 23, 2021, 12:50:22 PM »

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November 8, 2102

Up til October of this year, things were pretty calm. We've seen a few harmless Trif ships lurking about and nothing else. 6 new battleships (4 usual + 2 Jump-capable), 4 carriers, 4 fast frigates, 1 missile destroyer and various support ships were built. But missile and fighter production was not fast enough to provide sufficient amount of parasite craft and ammo to make everything operational and combat ready.

A plan emerged. There was a known area where Trif concentrated their warships: a Umi - Delta Carinae jump point. While Humanity wasn't capable of waging full scale offensive operations yet, it could've used additional intel on enemy warship designs, capabilities and tactics. So, a force reconnaissance attack, a raid, was envisioned. New battleships allowed for creation of two heavy JP assault groups that could potentially destroy everything we've seen so far around the jump point with minor to no losses. Other existing task forces could back those groups up and allow temporarily to take control of this critical jump point. Then, a single carrier could be equipped with enough fighters and ammo to raid Delta Carinae in the direction of Trif homeworld, striking anything it can uncover, and then go back home.

Still, the crews weren't ready yet, fighters and missiles were in production... But the battleships were already there. And every single one of them had a small complement of heavily armed and armored marines on board (250t each). So, when Trif scout jumped into Umi from Delta Carinae, it appeared as if it was a perfect opportunity to allow the new crews to train boarding operations in realistic environment.

Battleships were already divided into two groups (2 BB + 1 BB with C2IJ capability each). Sending both groups seemed silly and it was deemed that 3x 250t MARDET platoons (3x 31 marines in heavy powered armor) would be enough to take down a single small scout...
Yeah, right... Nothing even close. All three teams managed to reach the scout, taking losses even before breaking into the hull. But in the following firefight, all three lost tempo, bogged down and got annihilated altogether.

It was humiliating. Three 36,000 ton battleships approached a small scout, sent their heavy marines in and failed miserably. Sure, of course we did blew up the scout with guns afterwards, but... yeah... The presence of marines on capital ships was a doubtful choice. They were put there for two reasons: 1) additional security of the ship against boarding; 2) allow taking over enemy ships if there's an opportunity.

Clearly, you need more marines to successfully board a ship. Anyway...

Trif reacted with sending a part of the their JP blockading force to Umi. Kinda too late, because our battleships left the scene by that point. Another task force was sent from Sol to deal with invading ships and made it so effortlessly. Full salvo from 3 cruisers (3x35 size 6 wh 12 missiles) was enough to annihilate enemy CA, raising the question about the size of the main anti-ship missile for the navy again (size 20 wh 65 heavy ASM is already in production). The rest of the ships were no match for long range laser fire, as they carried no lances.

Posted by: L0ckAndL0ad

« on: October 21, 2021, 03:16:01 AM »

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October 21, 2099

We've had the usual rounds of Trif diplomatic messaging saying they consider us being cool ("neutral"), followed by attempts of our Diplomatic Corps vessels reaching out and getting attacked, barely escaping, snoopers wondering about human star systems, etc. There was also an increase in Trif activity around Rubino area, ~6bn km away from Sol. Reports indicated that Trif sent geo survey vessels and Jump Point stabilization vessels there, but we still wanted to be reasonable and ignored this.

Then, in the early days of October, a Trif heavy cruiser was identified in the outer regions of Rubino, ~650m km away from the primary star, when it, apparently, switched from EMCON Alpha to do a brief radar ping to check its surroundings. Given recent attacks on our diplomatic vessels in border systems, having Trif heavy cruiser present in our settled space was the last straw.

Duchy of Trif was declared hostile. Humanity was officially at war.

Planet of Fand, orbiting Rubino-A M2-V star, is the main settlement in the system, but has no facilities to support spaceships. No maintenance, refueling, rearming, no nothing. It's just a mining settlement with a population of 15m people (out of 22m in the entire system). Under current circumstances, a single heavy cruiser was stationed at Fand to provide protection, and was to be rotated annually. CA Calypso of Challenger R2 class, under CPT Werner Windisch, was standing watch at Fand, alone.

Off-Topic: show

A full-size task force (3 CA 8 DD) was sent from Sol to Rubino, but it was going to take a while. More than 10 days. So CA Calypso went solo to intercept the intruder, CA Mallorea II 003. Enemy CA was traveling slowly, at just 1492km/s, allowing it to be easily found on long range radar, after getting another course correction from active sensor signature intercept. At 0700 on October 4th, 2099, CA Calypso identified two more ships traveling with enemy CA. It was a CLE and a civilian JP stabilization ship.

We've met these types of cruisers before. Intel records showed that Trif CA was armed with str-18 particle lances, and CLE with Gauss Cannons. So far, there was no indication that the enemy used any type of missiles at all. Str-18 lance was the major threat to CA Calypso, so it was decided to start the engagement with missiles. The initial volley of 14 (2x7) standard size 6 ASM missiles was fired from 40m km, with 10 of them hitting enemy CA and 4 being intercepted by PD fire. The enemy group continued moving as if nothing happened.

Second missile volley was fired (21 missiles in 5 salvoes), but also made no effect.

At this point, CA Calypso began to close into beam fire range. Given the inferior speed of enemy warships, it was decided that we could disengage and move outside of enemy particle lances range if needed. Trying to stay within 300,000 km of the enemy, Calypso opened fire with its laser weapons against enemy CA. In the following attack, the distance jumped between 270 and 310 thousands km, and so only 375mm Far UV Spinal Laser was making any good damage (str 6 hits), with 200mm lasers making occasional str 1 glances.

After enduring our fire for six minutes and not firing anything in return, CA Mallorea II 003 surrendered!

The rest of the enemy ships were chased and gunned down just as easily, but neither decided to surrender. The entire close range beam battle was resolved in just 11 minutes. Two life pods with ~100 Trif were rescued.

It turned out that CA Mallorea was actually far more deadly to Calypso than previously thought. On paper, it had a significant speed of 7807 vs 6028 km/s of our Challenger class. Thankfully, it was traveling with slower ships and did not break formation, limiting its main advantage, which resulted in total defeat. On Humanity's part, a complete uselessness of size 6 ASM missiles against enemy cruiser was made quite obvious. Humanity was looking into creating a much larger missile before, but the number of missiles in the salvo was given higher priority, so nothing was actually built to this point. Now Humanity was interested in size 20+ missile, at least, in order to deal with heavy armored ships.

Posted by: nuclearslurpee

« on: October 15, 2021, 09:24:54 AM »

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Quote from: L0ckAndL0ad on October 15, 2021, 01:59:06 AM

Quote from: nuclearslurpee on October 14, 2021, 08:18:42 AM
I continue to be confused as to why the Human admirals are not confident in winning this war...

According to intel, Trif have more than 1.4m tons of combat vessels that we've actually seen:

10 BCs / 7 BCJ
10 CA / 1 CJ
25 CLE
12 DD / 9 JD
24 DE

From what we know, ALL their BC, CA, DD and their jump versions are armed with str-18 lances. Escorts are armed with GCs turrets. We have not seen any missile capability, but there's probably more where that come from.

Candidly, with NPR fleets the total tonnage is usually a poor measure as they are not able to effectively combine their fleets into a larger offensive force, so you can usually defeat an NPR by wiping out 200,000-300,000 ton fleets one at a time at your doorstep. Meanwhile, ECM 40 is a big advantage against the NPRs which do not really rush the ECCM techs as it means you can sit around at about 2/3 maximum range with decent hit chances and shoot them with impunity. Overwhelming tactical superiority makes up for a quantitative disparity in total forces.

Posted by: L0ckAndL0ad

« on: October 15, 2021, 01:59:06 AM »

Insert Quote

Quote from: nuclearslurpee on October 14, 2021, 08:18:42 AM

I continue to be confused as to why the Human admirals are not confident in winning this war...

According to intel, Trif have more than 1.4m tons of combat vessels that we've actually seen:

10 BCs / 7 BCJ
10 CA / 1 CJ
25 CLE
12 DD / 9 JD
24 DE

From what we know, ALL their BC, CA, DD and their jump versions are armed with str-18 lances. Escorts are armed with GCs turrets. We have not seen any missile capability, but there's probably more where that come from.

Humanity, on the other hand, has barely 400k tons of combat vessels, and almost no auxiliaries yet to support them.

Quote from: nuclearslurpee on October 14, 2021, 08:18:42 AM

It does seem that the Trif are, for now, happy not to invade Human space, but are very insistent that we stay out of their space. This would be fine, however they seem to have a double standard and think they can do whatever they want in our space. Not sure if we should tolerate this as the Trif seem to be acting like bullies about it.

Yeah, it's humiliating, frankly. People are dying and we can't do anything about it. They don't even bother to rescue the survivors! They leave them there to die!

Posted by: nuclearslurpee

« on: October 14, 2021, 08:18:42 AM »

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Quote

Well, that's not "neutral", isn't it?

The Trif admiralty is very neutral on the subject of shooting human ships, they do not care and will let their captains do whatever they want.

Quote

Human military ships were slightly refit with new ECM packages (now using ECM 40)

I continue to be confused as to why the Human admirals are not confident in winning this war...

It does seem that the Trif are, for now, happy not to invade Human space, but are very insistent that we stay out of their space. This would be fine, however they seem to have a double standard and think they can do whatever they want in our space. Not sure if we should tolerate this as the Trif seem to be acting like bullies about it.