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VB6 Aurora > Aurora Chat
Are Missiles the Ultimate Meta...
Steve Walmsley:
--- Quote from: BasileusMaximos on December 15, 2019, 03:13:42 PM ---So is there a place for small but potent missile launched from small bomber vessels from a carrier WWII style?
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Yes, absolutely. Read my current campaign :)
Father Tim:
--- Quote from: BasileusMaximos on December 15, 2019, 11:19:35 AM ---Are Missiles the Ultimate Meta...
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No. They are the Dark Side of the the Force. Easier, faster, more seductive, but not stronger.
--- Quote ---...Or can missile defenses eventually negate them?
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Yes. Anything your opponent can do can be negated in Aurora. This is the essence of why the AI is doomed -- you can tailor your sensors, speed, weapons, sizes, ship types, doctrine, fleet composition, and locations to exploit your enemies' weaknesses. In VB 6 Aurora the AI will not do the same against you. The proposed AI for C# Aurora will address a few of these issues, but not many.
--- Quote ---I'm a bit discouraged to hear that spamming enough missiles get anything done and the only real limitation is that you need to build and stow them. However, with sufficiently advanced tech can you counter most missile barrages?
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Missiles are tactically very strong, but strategically a huge weakness. I have defeated countless enemies by running them out of missiles (whether locally or empire-wide) and then destroying their useless hulks. It is not particularly difficult to make a ship that is less expensive than the missiles needed* to destroy it. Indeed, the fiction sections on this sitea are full of examples of Empires shooting absurd quantities of AMMs that cost half as much as the missiles they are meant to destroy at 5v1 rates.
And again, at virtually any tech level, you can build 'missile-proof' defenses if you know the details of the missiles you are trying to counter and design things specifically against them.
--- Quote ---And going off that, how effective are super-fast, deadly and short ranged missiles launched from carrier-based stealth bombers from up close?
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That depends strongly on how fast and how stealthy the bombers are, and how "up close" they get.
--- Quote ---Is that a good strategy?
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Is it fun for you? That is LITERALLY the only difference between a good strategy and a bad one.
If you don't know, try it and find out. If it's mostly fun -- but annoying in ways A, B, and C -- then don't be afraid to use SpaceMaster mode to alter A, B and/or C.
Father Tim:
--- Quote from: Jorgen_CAB on December 15, 2019, 02:39:03 PM ---Missiles are suppose to be the primary weapon in the game with beam weapons as an important secondary weapon. Beam weapons is still important, just not for general space superiority.
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They absolutely are not, and I will fight to the last electron on this topic. I abhor and oppose any suggestion that 'modern wet-navy combat works like X, therefore Aurora must work like X'. Aurora has to have room for Star Wars and Firefly/Serenity and WH40K and the Lost Fleet and BattleTech and Age-of-Sail-in-space, and any other style of space fantasy / science fiction a player wants to play.
NO weapon in Aurora should be "the primary weapon" -- it is detrimental to the game (and fun) for there to be one right answer, and all the rest wrong answers. Missiles need to not be mandatory; parasite craft need to not be mandatory; civilan wealth generation keeping the empire alive needs to not be mandatory.
Every time one dictates that Aurora has to follow this or that assumption, one is cutting off some player's fun.
Jorgen_CAB:
--- Quote from: Father Tim on December 15, 2019, 06:16:44 PM ---
--- Quote from: Jorgen_CAB on December 15, 2019, 02:39:03 PM ---Missiles are suppose to be the primary weapon in the game with beam weapons as an important secondary weapon. Beam weapons is still important, just not for general space superiority.
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They absolutely are not, and I will fight to the last electron on this topic. I abhor and oppose any suggestion that 'modern wet-navy combat works like X, therefore Aurora must work like X'. Aurora has to have room for Star Wars and Firefly/Serenity and WH40K and the Lost Fleet and BattleTech and Age-of-Sail-in-space, and any other style of space fantasy / science fiction a player wants to play.
NO weapon in Aurora should be "the primary weapon" -- it is detrimental to the game (and fun) for there to be one right answer, and all the rest wrong answers. Missiles need to not be mandatory; parasite craft need to not be mandatory; civilan wealth generation keeping the empire alive needs to not be mandatory.
Every time one dictates that Aurora has to follow this or that assumption, one is cutting off some player's fun.
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I think you misjudged that comment...
When you are playing with say a multi-faction campaign the most successful faction will almost always use a healthy mix of missiles and beam weapons. No matter how you view it missiles are king when it comes to deliver a long range lethal powerful strike. That is the benefit of using missiles tactically. The problem is over reliance on any one weapon system as neither is very effective unless you are allot stronger to start with.
As all fleets evolve in the same environment in such campaigns and all sides change their designs and try to adapt and gain the upper hand all the time.
Missiles simply us the tip of the spear while beam weapons is the sword, they are both important and fill a purpose.
That is my experience from playing several rather complex campaigns.
Borealis4x:
--- Quote from: Father Tim on December 15, 2019, 05:47:13 PM ---
--- Quote from: BasileusMaximos on December 15, 2019, 11:19:35 AM ---Are Missiles the Ultimate Meta...
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If you don't know, try it and find out. If it's mostly fun -- but annoying in ways A, B, and C -- then don't be afraid to use SpaceMaster mode to alter A, B and/or C.
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When you say you can use SpaceMaster to alter that game to your liking, does that mean you can give beam weapons unlimited range like they would have in real life in space?
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