What's Going On In Your Empire: C# Edition

[Droll]

After a period of "ohgodwereallgonnadie" that followed the discovery that there was an entire squadron of hostile alien warships sitting in a system right next door from Sol while I not only had no armed ships, but hadn't even researched any military technologies, the Terran Dominion can finally feel itself secure enough.  Luckily, the xenos didn't bother to survey that one system more, which gave me the time to close the tech gap and build a fleet.  Now, however, the Dominion is learning that crossing interstellar distances in the blink of an eye, harnessing the energies of stellar cores and confronting armadas of ships that could obliterate entire worlds are all rather trivial pursuits next to the challenge of moving some dudes and their stuff around.  The 18000-tonners that can keep space free of even the mightiest alien vessels are dwarfed by the monsters I need to make sure that ground troops land safely under fire from STO batteries.  Over fifty thousand tons of dropship are required to move a single battalion, and I need five of those blasted things for a brigade.  It'll take years just to build enough maintenance facilities to keep them from falling apart.  And in the process of designing my ground troops I realised just how much supplies a brigade consumes.  If the fighting takes more than two weeks, my soldiers will be down to finger pistols and shouting "bang!".  I could make a large "supply dump"-type HQ, but it won't fit in a dropship.  I'd have to make the ship even bigger, but a) that would be an engineering challenge (make it fast enough, durable enough, spacious enough), b) it'd take yet more time to expand the shipyards and build the darn thing.  I could set up a series of smaller supply HQs, but that makes for a really ugly command chain and doesn't save me from building a lot of additional dropship tonnage anyway.  And all this for a single brigade.  What must it look like when you drop multiple divisions to take a hostile homeworld?! Ugh.  Logistics while the enemy has anti-orbital firepower are a female dog.

How big are your batallions? Or brigades?

For me a brigade is a little less than but no more than 100k tons, a company is 3000-3500 depending on type, battalions at most 15000 and regiments 30 to 40k tons. The largest organization ive made is a division which is about 500k tons total. I need around 34 30k ton armoured transports in order to carry the whole thing. Transport convoys get really big really fast unless you want to have 200k ton behemoths.

[the obelisk]

After a period of "ohgodwereallgonnadie" that followed the discovery that there was an entire squadron of hostile alien warships sitting in a system right next door from Sol while I not only had no armed ships, but hadn't even researched any military technologies, the Terran Dominion can finally feel itself secure enough.  Luckily, the xenos didn't bother to survey that one system more, which gave me the time to close the tech gap and build a fleet.  Now, however, the Dominion is learning that crossing interstellar distances in the blink of an eye, harnessing the energies of stellar cores and confronting armadas of ships that could obliterate entire worlds are all rather trivial pursuits next to the challenge of moving some dudes and their stuff around.  The 18000-tonners that can keep space free of even the mightiest alien vessels are dwarfed by the monsters I need to make sure that ground troops land safely under fire from STO batteries.  Over fifty thousand tons of dropship are required to move a single battalion, and I need five of those blasted things for a brigade.  It'll take years just to build enough maintenance facilities to keep them from falling apart.  And in the process of designing my ground troops I realised just how much supplies a brigade consumes.  If the fighting takes more than two weeks, my soldiers will be down to finger pistols and shouting "bang!".  I could make a large "supply dump"-type HQ, but it won't fit in a dropship.  I'd have to make the ship even bigger, but a) that would be an engineering challenge (make it fast enough, durable enough, spacious enough), b) it'd take yet more time to expand the shipyards and build the darn thing.  I could set up a series of smaller supply HQs, but that makes for a really ugly command chain and doesn't save me from building a lot of additional dropship tonnage anyway.  And all this for a single brigade.  What must it look like when you drop multiple divisions to take a hostile homeworld?! Ugh.  Logistics while the enemy has anti-orbital firepower are a female dog.

How big are your batallions? Or brigades?

For me a brigade is a little less than but no more than 100k tons, a company is 3000-3500 depending on type, battalions at most 15000 and regiments 30 to 40k tons. The largest organization ive made is a division which is about 500k tons total. I need around 34 30k ton armoured transports in order to carry the whole thing. Transport convoys get really big really fast unless you want to have 200k ton behemoths.

Would you mind giving a rough breakdown of your formations?  I've tried basing my formations off of US Army formations, and my companies are only about over 1k, with Battalions around 5k and Brigades around 25k.

[Pedroig]

Would you mind giving a rough breakdown of your formations?  I've tried basing my formations off of US Army formations, and my companies are only about over 1k, with Battalions around 5k and Brigades around 25k.

That seems really low.  I use companies as bottom level OOB and even infantry only are hard to keep much under 2k, Battalions are impossible under 10k once you add supporting elements into the mix and the need to have 3-5 companies under a battalion.  Brigades are thus hard to keep under 50k.

Typical U.S. Army Infantry Squad:
5 PW Inf (Squad leader plus 4 riflemen)
4 PWI Inf (2 grenadiers and 2 automatic rifles)
1 Inf LOG-S

Typical U.S. Army Weapons Squad:
2 LAV (Dragon/Tow/Javelin) crews
3 CAP (MMG) crews
1 Inf LOG-S

Typical U.S. Army Platoon:
3 Infantry Squads, 1 Weapon Squad
2 LV LOG

Typical U.S. Army Company:  This is where I typically start, the above is to give framework. 
1 HQ
4 LV-LOG
Mortar Section:
2 LB (Light Mortar)
3 Platoons

Typical U.S. Army Battalion:
1HQ
8 LV-LOG
Mortar Battery:
8  MB (Heavy Mortar open apc)
4 MAA (Linebackers)
3 Companies

Typical U.S. Army Infantry Brigade Combat Team:
1 HQ
16 LV LOG
Brigade Fire Support:
16 HB (155 Field Artillery)
8 HAA (Patriots)
Engineers:
4 MV CON CON
3 Battalions plus one Cav Squadron
Cav Squadron:
2 Inf Squad with 1 LV MAC each
1 Inf Weapon Squad with 2 LV MAC
4 LV MAC

[Ardis]

How big are your batallions? Or brigades?

Mechanised infantry battalions are ~11k, plus a supporting artillery company 2. 5k, armoured battalions are ~7k, plus a similar artillery company.  3 mech infantry battalions and 1 armoured battalion per brigade.  Although each battalion carries some 1. 5-2k organic supply, so the actual amount of fighting hardware is lower.

But I'll be changing that into some simple "tanks + HQ" units, because I'm up against an enemy that can only be defeated with overwhelming amounts of brute force.

I was aware that attacking fortified ground troops would be difficult, but. . .  Damn.  I dropped the above brigade on some 16k enemy forces.  I needn't have worried about supply.  One battalion of mine was being wiped out every 8h.  I could barely hit anything (1200 shots, 60 hits), let alone inflict casualties.  Dug-in enemy + slight tech disadvantage = absolute slaughter.  I'm going to need Space Marines and heavy tanks.


On the flip side, it turns out STOs are blind and can't fire if there are no friendly ships to provide sensors, so once you eliminate the enemy space assets, you can safely approach the planet and don't actually need armour or shields on your dropships. Or maybe it's just the AI that can't handle this situation? Don't know.

[Morrigi]

On the flip side, it turns out STOs are blind and can't fire if there are no friendly ships to provide sensors, so once you eliminate the enemy space assets, you can safely approach the planet and don't actually need armour or shields on your dropships. Or maybe it's just the AI that can't handle this situation? Don't know.

If they have no ground-based tracking stations either, it would make some level of sense.

[smoelf]

Early on I came across some hostile ships in a nearby system. I thought it was star swarm but it turns out it was a regular NPR. I left the system alone for two decades, and then returned to test out my new ships. They got absolutely demolished by the NPR as they had way more ships than anticipated - including a different set of weapons.

It seems I have to step up my design game and prepare for all out invasion. Hopefully I can also get to try out ground combat.

[IanD]

Sol is in a mineral poor sector of the galaxy. So building thigs if difficult with very few deposits of Galicite or Uridium of more than 100,000 tons. Shipbuilding is complicated by the civilian CMC which occupied the massive Duranium deposits on Mercury before the Concordiat could plant its flag.

Some 30 odd years ago a peaceful geo survey vessel was destroyed by hostile aliens in Gliese 884. Within a few months a scratch force of Concordiat warships were ignominiously chased from the system by half-a-dozen alien ships which outranged (and out massed) the Concordiat force by a good 30 million kilometres.

Today in 2064 the Concordiat Navy returned to the system with a weapons system that should significantly outrange these warmongers. The Task Force moved into range of the alien home world, although no EM signature was detected, and found a considerably larger fleet, consisting of a battlecruiser, ten cruisers (or orbital structures) and seven destroyers. The nine missile cruisers of the fleet unleashed their barrage, 59 salvos of 117  size 5 missiles, with a few follow up salvos of 60 missiles each.

The wait seemed interminable, but at last the missile tracks coincided with the alien fleet. and then …..  nothing! All missiles were utterly destroyed by alien energy weapons fire. They did not even bother to attack the Concordiat Task Force, just ignored it as beneath contempt. The Corcordiat Task Force, all but 72 missiles expended, was left to return home with its tail between its legs!

P.S. Anybody got a spare fleet they're not using?

Ian

[DoctorDanny]

I can relate Ian. My first real combat was against a tiny fleet of 4 precursor ships.
I seriously underestimated them and my first fleet of 6 ships was annihilated.
Then came back ten years later with the future equivalent of the Spanish Armada.

It was the very last salvo that finally ended them.
Think I used over 2k missiles in total

[Droll]

Sol is in a mineral poor sector of the galaxy. So building thigs if difficult with very few deposits of Galicite or Uridium of more than 100,000 tons. Shipbuilding is complicated by the civilian CMC which occupied the massive Duranium deposits on Mercury before the Concordiat could plant its flag.

Some 30 odd years ago a peaceful geo survey vessel was destroyed by hostile aliens in Gliese 884. Within a few months a scratch force of Concordiat warships were ignominiously chased from the system by half-a-dozen alien ships which outranged (and out massed) the Concordiat force by a good 30 million kilometres.

Today in 2064 the Concordiat Navy returned to the system with a weapons system that should significantly outrange these warmongers. The Task Force moved into range of the alien home world, although no EM signature was detected, and found a considerably larger fleet, consisting of a battlecruiser, ten cruisers (or orbital structures) and seven destroyers. The nine missile cruisers of the fleet unleashed their barrage, 59 salvos of 117  size 5 missiles, with a few follow up salvos of 60 missiles each.

The wait seemed interminable, but at last the missile tracks coincided with the alien fleet. and then …..  nothing! All missiles were utterly destroyed by alien energy weapons fire. They did not even bother to attack the Concordiat Task Force, just ignored it as beneath contempt. The Corcordiat Task Force, all but 72 missiles expended, was left to return home with its tail between its legs!

P.S. Anybody got a spare fleet they're not using?

Ian

How fast were your missiles flying? If enemy point def is your point of failure consider investing in missile ECM.

[Droll]

I can relate Ian. My first real combat was against a tiny fleet of 4 precursor ships.
I seriously underestimated them and my first fleet of 6 ships was annihilated.
Then came back ten years later with the future equivalent of the Spanish Armada.

It was the very last salvo that finally ended them.
Think I used over 2k missiles in total

How big are your ASM warheads? If a single missile can't pen enemy armour you can end up "sandpapering" enemy armour, giving the enemy maximum utility.

[Droll]

After a period of "ohgodwereallgonnadie" that followed the discovery that there was an entire squadron of hostile alien warships sitting in a system right next door from Sol while I not only had no armed ships, but hadn't even researched any military technologies, the Terran Dominion can finally feel itself secure enough.  Luckily, the xenos didn't bother to survey that one system more, which gave me the time to close the tech gap and build a fleet.  Now, however, the Dominion is learning that crossing interstellar distances in the blink of an eye, harnessing the energies of stellar cores and confronting armadas of ships that could obliterate entire worlds are all rather trivial pursuits next to the challenge of moving some dudes and their stuff around.  The 18000-tonners that can keep space free of even the mightiest alien vessels are dwarfed by the monsters I need to make sure that ground troops land safely under fire from STO batteries.  Over fifty thousand tons of dropship are required to move a single battalion, and I need five of those blasted things for a brigade.  It'll take years just to build enough maintenance facilities to keep them from falling apart.  And in the process of designing my ground troops I realised just how much supplies a brigade consumes.  If the fighting takes more than two weeks, my soldiers will be down to finger pistols and shouting "bang!".  I could make a large "supply dump"-type HQ, but it won't fit in a dropship.  I'd have to make the ship even bigger, but a) that would be an engineering challenge (make it fast enough, durable enough, spacious enough), b) it'd take yet more time to expand the shipyards and build the darn thing.  I could set up a series of smaller supply HQs, but that makes for a really ugly command chain and doesn't save me from building a lot of additional dropship tonnage anyway.  And all this for a single brigade.  What must it look like when you drop multiple divisions to take a hostile homeworld?! Ugh.  Logistics while the enemy has anti-orbital firepower are a female dog.

How big are your batallions? Or brigades?

For me a brigade is a little less than but no more than 100k tons, a company is 3000-3500 depending on type, battalions at most 15000 and regiments 30 to 40k tons. The largest organization ive made is a division which is about 500k tons total. I need around 34 30k ton armoured transports in order to carry the whole thing. Transport convoys get really big really fast unless you want to have 200k ton behemoths.

Would you mind giving a rough breakdown of your formations?  I've tried basing my formations off of US Army formations, and my companies are only about over 1k, with Battalions around 5k and Brigades around 25k.

My military organization goes down to the company level which are the actual combat units. An infantry division looks like this:

Division HQ (500k)
  3x Infantry Brigade (100K)
    2x Infantry Regiment (40k)
      2x Infantry Battalion (15k)
        1x Spec-ops company (ATK-3250)
        3x Infantry company (DEF-3250)
        1x Support artillery section (SUP-1500)
    1x Motorized Regiment (40k)
      2x Motorized Battalion (15k)
        1x Mechanized company (ATK-3500)
        3x Motorized company (ATK-3500)
  1x Mechanized Brigade (100k)
     3x Mechanized regiment (40k)
       5x Mechanized Battalion (15k)
         4x Mechanized company (ATK-3500)
       1x Light Mechanized Battalion (15k)
         2x Mechanized company (ATK-3500)
         2x Motorized company(DEF-3500)
  1x Armoured Regiment (40k)
    2x Armoured Battalion (15k)
      1x Mechanized Company (ATK-3500)
      2x Armoured Company (ATK-3500)
      1x Medium artillery Battery (SUP-3500)
  1x Artillery Regiment (40k)
    2x Artillery Battalion (15k)
      1x Heavy Artillery Battery (REAR-3500)
      2x Medium Artillery Battery (SUP-3500)
      1x Motorized Company (ATK-3500)
  4x Logistics Battalion (LOG-15k)

Note that because of the way the brigades are designed they can be detached from the main division hierarchy and still function properly - with a defensive and offensive line. The numbers in brackets are HQ ratings and for combat units their size and typical field position. The actual size of a division on average hovers around 450k so individual support components such as the armoured and artillery regiment can be slotted in order to steer the division in a particular direction or kink.

If you are trying to base your formations off of real ones - do not do it through tonnage, do it by the no. of men. I just looked at the "military organization" wikipedia page and saw that companies had anywhere between 80-250 men. So I aimed at 250 men and a size of 3250 tons came about relatively naturally.

[karax268]

The citizens of luna watch in amazement as the domes that had kept then save for so many years were being dismantled. 

Along with the terraforming installations they were loaded on the armada of civilian freighters.  The terraformers were going to mars. 
The domes would go a bit further.  The NNI had found a suitable world on a far away system. 
Soon the human race will expand beyond their own Solar system. 

[Corvus]

The Commonwealth of Nova Australis stumbled on a ridiculous amount of minerals in Sol, including 56. 6 millions tons of Sorium on Jupiter.   But that was back in 1. 8.   1. 9 needs to make an appearnace now.

[Drgong]

Ran a 1.8 game for about 20 years as a test run.

Now the plan is to run a game in 1.9 and start a AAR when I start exiting sol...

[Second Foundationer]

After five years in government, United Planets President Simona Marcolini has been deposed by a vote in the Solar Assembly and exiled to a mining colony on Tempel 1.  She belongs to the minority, isolationist Nationalist movement [represented by a 0 promotion point "medal"] and had suspended the entire UN/UP fleetbuilding program after taking office.  Earth has a growing force of post-Einsteinian ground troops, but the only true spaceships mankind possesses are four survey ships, five ancient sorium-guzzling, slow cryo-equipped Luna Express freighters, one troop transport and one tug.  Ten giant Ceres terraforming stations exist, now in orbit around Mars, several more, five Jupiter harvesting platforms and a wormhole stabilization platform are under construction.

Our new president Lee, a Federalist [another faction affiliation "medal"], has ordered a stopgap plan to design and construct two Hydra orbital weapon stations patched together with what weapon technology we have and has reiinitiated the starfleet building program, but now, it will not fully begin before the breakthrough into Enhanced Quantum Engines [name for designed Ion Engines in this universe].  The Unionists vehemently disagree and demand that at least some armed ships be built immediately.  Meanwhile, ex-President Marcolini's sympathizers in the Ground Forces are beginning to make secret, long-term plans for taking over government by force [represented by a conspirator "medal"; it may come to nothing, then I only lost a few clicks a year in the commanders window; or it may induce my first venture into multi-faction Aurora if 1. 9. x continues to show no serious bugs].

In other news, the survey ship Aristoteles sent to neighbouring Athena will have to stay there for a while as it has no jump-capability of its own and must wait for the Newton or the Galilei to transit; when it does, it will have great discoveries to report to the Extrasolar Forces HQ [found a cold, almost habitable planet with at least some low grade minerals, plus 70% Defence research bonus and the solution to the corundium shortage on a hot, but decently massive 2. 0 colony cost dwarf planet].  And Luna's atmosphere is still thin, but now breathable, the anti-escape domes no longer need to be airtight and the emergency oxygen stations along the magnetic boot safety rails become unnecessary.  [These humans have a grav tolerance of >0. 2; nice C# improvement: wealth bonus for admins has become a bit more meaningful with LG infra because you have no free "pool" at home for civilians to draw from and 40 or 50 infra per year for free can make a difference. ]

The cracks that have emerged in the leadership look increasingly as if they could eventually lead to civil war or at least a secession here or there.  Earth is almost running out of corundium while humanity hasn't even left Sol in earnest.  And there may be other things lurking out there. . .

(A micro-AAR glimpse into my current Aurora universe, just for the variety, you understand. )