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Posted by: Steve Walmsley
« on: January 12, 2010, 10:09:08 AM »

Quote from: "dammrebel"
Quote
Finally, the active sensor only has a range of 50k. The resolution means it can track missiles so that would be fine if the ship is intended to tackle missiles as part of a fleet. For independent operations, you will need a long range sensor as well. If you create a sensor with a larger resolution it will be able to see a lot further. For example, a resolution 100 sensor of the same size would have a range of five million kilometers. You probably should try and make it larger as well so you can get the range out to perhaps 30-40 million km at least.


Ahh I came here looking for info on active sensor resolution. So a resolution 0 or 1 can track missiles? If he jumps the resolution to 100 then would he lose that ability as they may be to small to see? Or am I totally misreading what resolution means in this sense?
No that is exactly right. Here is the relevant section from the tutorial:

Now its time to add an active sensor. Open the Create Research Project window again, using either the Design button on the Economics window or Ctrl-F6 from the main menu. The first item in the Research Project Type list is active sensors, which is useful as that is what we need. There are five dropdowns this time. Lets make the size of the Antenna 2 HS. This increases the Sensor Strength of the component to 20, which our current Active Grav Sensor Strength of 10 multiplied by the 2 HS. In the text area that shows the details of the new active sensor, several of the fields are the same as the engines so I won't bother describing them again. New information includes the chance of destruction by electronic damage (from microwave weapons), the Resolution and the Range. Resolution Zero is actually resolution 1 but it is described as zero because it treats anything less than 1 as equal to 1.

The Range of an active sensor is equal to Resolution x Sensor Strength x 10,000. So by increasing the resolution you can dramatically increase the range. At the moment, the range is 1 (resolution) x 20 (strength) x 10,000 = 200,000 km. Try changing the resolution to 100 (or 5000 tons). Now the range is 20,000,000 km. So why, you are no doubt asking, wouldn't you have the highest resolution possible? Good question!

An active sensor is able to detect any ship of a size that is equal to or greater than its resolution at its maximum range. So this sensor could detect a ship of 5000 tons or greater (size 100) at 20m km. If the target is smaller than the resolution, the maximum detection range is equal to Max Range x (Target Size / Resolution) ^2. So using this sensor against a target that was size 80, the formula would be:

20m km x (80/100)^2 or 20m x 0.8 x 0.8, which equals 12.8 million kilometers

Against a target of size 20 (1000 tons), the max detection range would be 20m x 0.2 x 0.2 or 0.8 million kilometers

Against a missile (size 1 unless it's huge), 20m x 0.01 x 0.01 = 0.002m, or just 2000 km.

So you need to design active sensors based on the role intended for that sensor. An area search sensor might be designed with a large resolution to find large enemy ships while a sensor designed to detect fast attack craft, which are 1000 tons or less would need a resolution of approximately 20. Missile detection sensors are usually resolution zero. In this case, we want a general search sensor so lets stick with resolution 100. If we encounter an enemy that likes to design ships of 4000 tons or 6000 tons we can modify future sensor designs to take the best advantage of an appropriate resolution (80 or 120).

Steve
Posted by: dammrebel
« on: January 12, 2010, 10:03:48 AM »

Quote
Finally, the active sensor only has a range of 50k. The resolution means it can track missiles so that would be fine if the ship is intended to tackle missiles as part of a fleet. For independent operations, you will need a long range sensor as well. If you create a sensor with a larger resolution it will be able to see a lot further. For example, a resolution 100 sensor of the same size would have a range of five million kilometers. You probably should try and make it larger as well so you can get the range out to perhaps 30-40 million km at least.


Ahh I came here looking for info on active sensor resolution. So a resolution 0 or 1 can track missiles? If he jumps the resolution to 100 then would he lose that ability as they may be to small to see? Or am I totally misreading what resolution means in this sense?

Jeff
Posted by: Steve Walmsley
« on: January 04, 2010, 11:37:03 AM »

Quote from: "laz"
9 is the total power as the individual reactor produces 4.5.

Thanks for the feedback it helps me understand the concepts for the various components and connect the dots in what i am designing and how it is implemented into a design.

I'm getting to the stage in my game were I want to develop more specialised kinds of ships for certain tasks.

Sorium harvesters are one such thing. Does this component literally take sorium out of gas giants and convert it to fuel like a mobile refinary for fleets? I am thinking more of a way to find vast amounts of sorium to supply Earth and not rely on a bottleneck and finite source from its Colonies and Asteroid miners that it kindly is using to refine for fuel and supply industry/construction.
If you move a ship with one or more Sorium Harvesters into orbit of a gas giant with Sorium, it will convert the Sorium directly into fuel in its fuel tanks.

Quote
I've discovered a destroyed outpost ruin in a star system. I have the salvager technology that operates at 500 tons. How does this act of salvaging work when it comes to finding old ruins on a planet. Do you simply take a ship equipped with salvaging modules over to the planet or do I have to send it with a scientific xenology team? Does it transit the salvage back to a colony with reseach labs or is this all automatic/abstracted?
You will have to create a Xeno team and transport it to the planet. The Xeno team will try and decipher the alien language in the ruins, which may take a year or too. Once this is translated you may find several abandoned installations. You can send Engineer Regiments to try and recover these. If they are successful, they may turn out to be mines or factories, ship components or a variety of other things.

Quote
In the other thread about listening posts you were saying you develop installations and deploy them via cargo on ships. Is that what PDC's can be used for and deployed like a installation? OR do you have to deploy engineers and construct a base of some sort...tad confused there.
You can build prefab PDCs which appear as a number of PDC components. You can then transport these to another planet and assemble them. Assembly cost is 10% of construction cost and you will need either industrial capacity or engineers to carry out the assembly.

Quote
I still don't have a clue about how to build missiles
I will get around to a tutorial but essentially you choose how many MSP (missile size points) you will devote to the missile for each of several options. For example, a size three missile may have a 1 MSP warhead, 1 MSP fuel and 1 MSP Engine. As you change the size of different components, the overall missile size will change.

Steve
Posted by: Erik L
« on: January 03, 2010, 07:30:44 PM »

Quote from: "laz"
9 is the total power as the individual reactor produces 4.5.

Thanks for the feedback it helps me understand the concepts for the various components and connect the dots in what i am designing and how it is implemented into a design.

I'm getting to the stage in my game were I want to develop more specialised kinds of ships for certain tasks.

Sorium harvesters are one such thing. Does this component literally take sorium out of gas giants and convert it to fuel like a mobile refinary for fleets? I am thinking more of a way to find vast amounts of sorium to supply Earth and not rely on a bottleneck and finite source from its Colonies and Asteroid miners that it kindly is using to refine for fuel and supply industry/construction.
That is exactly what they are for. One thing I tend to do is have a fuel harvester supporting my survey operations. The harvester will sit in a nodal area and harvest. The survey ship return to it for refueling, rather than heading back to the homeworld or nearest colony.

Quote from: "laz"
I've discovered a destroyed outpost ruin in a star system. I have the salvager technology that operates at 500 tons. How does this act of salvaging work when it comes to finding old ruins on a planet. Do you simply take a ship equipped with salvaging modules over to the planet or do I have to send it with a scientific xenology team? Does it transit the salvage back to a colony with reseach labs or is this all automatic/abstracted?
Salvage ships are for salvaging the wrecks post-battle. As far as I know, they do nothing for ruins (unless Steve has changed this). You need a xeno and a cyber team to exploit the ruins.
Quote from: "laz"
In the other thread about listening posts you were saying you develop installations and deploy them via cargo on ships. Is that what PDC's can be used for and deployed like a installation? OR do you have to deploy engineers and construct a base of some sort...tad confused there.

I still don't have a clue about how to build missiles

PDC can be constructed as pre-fab, and carried out to a remote location via freighter. A listening post is usually just a deep space scanner installation. I like them near warp points that do not have a regular picket.

As for missiles, click the missile button on the research tab. It is very similar to building a ship, except all the components are controlled by a slider. Advancing tech changes the amount of "power" each slider tick represents. One thing you will want to know before designing your missiles is the size of your launchers, and the max range of your missile guidance. Okay, that's two. :)
Posted by: laz
« on: January 03, 2010, 06:36:46 PM »

9 is the total power as the individual reactor produces 4.5.

Thanks for the feedback it helps me understand the concepts for the various components and connect the dots in what i am designing and how it is implemented into a design.

I'm getting to the stage in my game were I want to develop more specialised kinds of ships for certain tasks.

Sorium harvesters are one such thing. Does this component literally take sorium out of gas giants and convert it to fuel like a mobile refinary for fleets? I am thinking more of a way to find vast amounts of sorium to supply Earth and not rely on a bottleneck and finite source from its Colonies and Asteroid miners that it kindly is using to refine for fuel and supply industry/construction.

I've discovered a destroyed outpost ruin in a star system. I have the salvager technology that operates at 500 tons. How does this act of salvaging work when it comes to finding old ruins on a planet. Do you simply take a ship equipped with salvaging modules over to the planet or do I have to send it with a scientific xenology team? Does it transit the salvage back to a colony with reseach labs or is this all automatic/abstracted?

In the other thread about listening posts you were saying you develop installations and deploy them via cargo on ships. Is that what PDC's can be used for and deployed like a installation? OR do you have to deploy engineers and construct a base of some sort...tad confused there.

I still don't have a clue about how to build missiles
Posted by: Steve Walmsley
« on: January 03, 2010, 09:19:46 AM »

Quote from: "Charlie Beeler"
2 reactors that generate 9 points each for a total 18 points per 5sec cycle.  The beams only need 8 points per cycle.  Assuming that this was for redundency.  
That was my initial thought at first too but I think 9 is the total power for both reactors, not the power for each.

Steve
Posted by: Charlie Beeler
« on: January 03, 2010, 09:01:30 AM »

Steve's observations are bang-on.  

Here are some of the things that I notice.

You've installed 6 beam weapons in pairs of 3 different types but only 2 beam fire controls.  I'd at least at a third so that each weapon type pair can be assigned to an FC and reduce the need to switch assignments during battle.

Your capacitors are limiting your rate of fire (ROF) severly.  The capacitor assigned during weapon build dictates how much power the weapon can store during a 5sec cycle.  So your lasers are 4-1 meaning that they require a total of 4 power stored before firing but can only store 1 per 5sec cycle giving you a 20sec cycle ROF.  

2 reactors that generate 9 points each for a total 18 points per 5sec cycle.  The beams only need 8 points per cycle.  Assuming that this was for redundency.  

My suggestion is to cut back to 1 offensive weapon type (2 or 3 mounted) with single FC (maybe a second for battle damage redundancy) and add CIWS if available.  Down grade the reactor size so that 1 reactor can supply a single mount and then add a needed to supply all mounts with maybe an extra 1 or 2 for bdr.

The fuel capacity and beams tend to support extended long range patrol.  But that is more of a personal flavor thing.

The armor belt is actually fairly good for the ship size.  I'd drop the single shield generator though, as Steve points out it only stops a single hit and not a very big one.
Posted by: Steve Walmsley
« on: January 03, 2010, 07:51:42 AM »

Quote from: "laz"
Can I have some feedback on my first military ship. Its intended to guard my colonies near Earth not going off into deep space pursuing enemies.

Repulse class Frigate    8600 tons     745 Crew     931.4 BP      TCS 172  TH 300  EM 60
2325 km/s     Armour 4-37     Shields 2-450     Sensors 1/1/0/0     Damage Control Rating 11     PPV 62
Annual Failure Rate: 591%    IFR: 8.2%    Maintenance Capacity 1068 MSP    Max Repair 86 MSP

Tokamak Pulsed Nuclear Engine (10)    Power 40    Fuel Use 100%    Signature 30    Armour 0    Exp 5%
Fuel Capacity 800,000 Litres    Range 167.4 billion km   (833 days at full power)
Beta R450/15 Shields (1)   Total Fuel Cost  15 Litres per day

Sovetsky Series 12cm Ultraviolet Laser (2)    Range 64,000km     TS: 3000 km/s     Power 4-1     RM 3    ROF 20        4 4 4 3 2 2 0 0 0 0
Twin Sovetsky Series 12cm Ultraviolet Laser Turret (2x2)    Range 64,000km     TS: 10000 km/s     Power 8-2     RM 3    ROF 20        4 4 4 3 2 2 0 0 0 0
Zulu Series Ion Torpedo Mk2  (2)    Range 64,000km     TS: 3000 km/s     Power 7-1    ROF 35        3 3 3 3 3 3 3 3 3 3
Samsung Precision Beam Control (2)    Max Range: 64,000 km   TS: 3000 km/s     84 69 53 37 22 6 0 0 0 0
Nissan Gas-Cooled Fast Reactor  (2)     Total Power Output 9    Armour 0    Exp 5%

Active Search Sensor S5-R1 (1)     GPS 5     Range 50k km    Resolution 1
Thermal Sensor TH0.33-1 (1)     Sensitivity 1     Detect Sig Strength 1000:  1m km

A good idea for displaying ships is to use the code brackets so the forum software doesn't wipe out a lot of the spaces that make the design more readable. Like this:

Code: [Select]
Repulse class Frigate    8600 tons     745 Crew     931.4 BP      TCS 172  TH 300  EM 60
2325 km/s     Armour 4-37     Shields 2-450     Sensors 1/1/0/0     Damage Control Rating 11     PPV 62
Annual Failure Rate: 591%    IFR: 8.2%    Maintenance Capacity 1068 MSP    Max Repair 86 MSP

Tokamak Pulsed Nuclear Engine (10)    Power 40    Fuel Use 100%    Signature 30    Armour 0    Exp 5%
Fuel Capacity 800,000 Litres    Range 167.4 billion km   (833 days at full power)
Beta R450/15 Shields (1)   Total Fuel Cost  15 Litres per day

Sovetsky Series 12cm Ultraviolet Laser (2)    Range 64,000km     TS: 3000 km/s     Power 4-1     RM 3    ROF 20        4 4 4 3 2 2 0 0 0 0
Twin Sovetsky Series 12cm Ultraviolet Laser Turret (2x2)    Range 64,000km     TS: 10000 km/s     Power 8-2     RM 3    ROF 20        4 4 4 3 2 2 0 0 0 0
Zulu Series Ion Torpedo Mk2  (2)    Range 64,000km     TS: 3000 km/s     Power 7-1    ROF 35        3 3 3 3 3 3 3 3 3 3
Samsung Precision Beam Control (2)    Max Range: 64,000 km   TS: 3000 km/s     84 69 53 37 22 6 0 0 0 0
Nissan Gas-Cooled Fast Reactor  (2)     Total Power Output 9    Armour 0    Exp 5%

Active Search Sensor S5-R1 (1)     GPS 5     Range 50k km    Resolution 1
Thermal Sensor TH0.33-1 (1)     Sensitivity 1     Detect Sig Strength 1000:  1m km
It looks like a pretty good attempt for your first one. Ship design in Aurora is not easy and publishing your designs is a great way to get feedback and learn. Please bear in mind that some responses will just list their ideas of how a design can be improved and it may look like criticism but people are just trying to help.

The ways I would suggest you could improve the design are as follows:

Every ship has an inherent thermal and EM sensor strength of 1, so you could either remove the strength-1 thermal sensor or make it larger so it improves on the ship's inherent rating.

A single shield with a strength of 2 will only prevent one hit, or part of one hit. Any shields are still useful but you might want to consider their overall strength. A lot of my own designs don't even bother with shields until higher tech levels. Armour level is fine.

You have some lasers and torpedoes with a tracking speed of 3000 km/s and you have a matching fire control with a tracking speed of 3000 km/s which is great. However, you also have lasers in a turret with a tracking speed of 10,000 km/s. If you link them to the existing fire control, you will lose the benefit of this high tracking speed because the tracking speed used in combat is the lower value of the weapon and the associated fire control system. You can create high speed beam fire controls by selecting the various options on the Fire Control Size vs Tracking Speed dropdown. A beam fire control with both long range and high tracking speed would be very large so beam fire controls are often specialised for one or the other. High tracking speeds for weapons and beam fire controls are necessary if you want to engage fast targets, such as missiles, with beam weapons

I am just guessing here but it looks like you went for perhaps just one or two engineering spaces and added a maintenance storage bay. Engineering spaces don't use hold maintenance, they also reduce the chance of system failure so it would probably be best to remove the storage bay and add more engineering spaces. The maintenance storage bay is more appropriate for supply ships or perhaps a jump cruiser filled with extra fuel and maintenance to it can act as a support ship.

Finally, the active sensor only has a range of 50k. The resolution means it can track missiles so that would be fine if the ship is intended to tackle missiles as part of a fleet. For independent operations, you will need a long range sensor as well. If you create a sensor with a larger resolution it will be able to see a lot further. For example, a resolution 100 sensor of the same size would have a range of five million kilometers. You probably should try and make it larger as well so you can get the range out to perhaps 30-40 million km at least.

Steve
Posted by: laz
« on: January 03, 2010, 05:06:11 AM »

Can I have some feedback on my first military ship. Its intended to guard my colonies near Earth not going off into deep space pursuing enemies.

Repulse class Frigate    8600 tons     745 Crew     931.4 BP      TCS 172  TH 300  EM 60
2325 km/s     Armour 4-37     Shields 2-450     Sensors 1/1/0/0     Damage Control Rating 11     PPV 62
Annual Failure Rate: 591%    IFR: 8.2%    Maintenance Capacity 1068 MSP    Max Repair 86 MSP

Tokamak Pulsed Nuclear Engine (10)    Power 40    Fuel Use 100%    Signature 30    Armour 0    Exp 5%
Fuel Capacity 800,000 Litres    Range 167.4 billion km   (833 days at full power)
Beta R450/15 Shields (1)   Total Fuel Cost  15 Litres per day

Sovetsky Series 12cm Ultraviolet Laser (2)    Range 64,000km     TS: 3000 km/s     Power 4-1     RM 3    ROF 20        4 4 4 3 2 2 0 0 0 0
Twin Sovetsky Series 12cm Ultraviolet Laser Turret (2x2)    Range 64,000km     TS: 10000 km/s     Power 8-2     RM 3    ROF 20        4 4 4 3 2 2 0 0 0 0
Zulu Series Ion Torpedo Mk2  (2)    Range 64,000km     TS: 3000 km/s     Power 7-1    ROF 35        3 3 3 3 3 3 3 3 3 3
Samsung Precision Beam Control (2)    Max Range: 64,000 km   TS: 3000 km/s     84 69 53 37 22 6 0 0 0 0
Nissan Gas-Cooled Fast Reactor  (2)     Total Power Output 9    Armour 0    Exp 5%

Active Search Sensor S5-R1 (1)     GPS 5     Range 50k km    Resolution 1
Thermal Sensor TH0.33-1 (1)     Sensitivity 1     Detect Sig Strength 1000:  1m km
Posted by: waresky
« on: January 02, 2010, 04:42:59 PM »

Welcome to all into this Crazyest Dream Game made ever before:).

months by months everyone can advance into knowest procedure..

errr..apologies for my bad english..but at last: Welcome:)
Posted by: Steve Walmsley
« on: January 02, 2010, 03:38:14 PM »

Quote from: "ussdefiant"
A question that could probably stand to be covered: Just what determines what classes you can build on any particular slipway once it's been tooled up? Less than 10% of the parts being different or something?
You can build any class to which you could refit the current class for less than 20% of the current class build cost.

Steve
Posted by: ussdefiant
« on: January 02, 2010, 03:33:45 PM »

A question that could probably stand to be covered: Just what determines what classes you can build on any particular slipway once it's been tooled up? Less than 10% of the parts being different or something?
Posted by: Erik L
« on: January 02, 2010, 12:10:44 PM »

Quote from: "Steve Walmsley"
The basic class design tutorial is up in the Tutorial thread

Steve

And updated to the Wiki.
Posted by: Steve Walmsley
« on: January 02, 2010, 11:18:28 AM »

The basic class design tutorial is up in the Tutorial thread

Steve
Posted by: Jarhead0331
« on: January 02, 2010, 10:02:48 AM »

Quote from: "Steve Walmsley"
I am working on a tutorial for class design at the moment. I will post it in a hour or two. Your inquiries and obvious desire for more detailed information have actually got me off my butt and creating a proper tutorial so many thanks from me and probably from a lot of other people!

Steve

Bravo! You rock the party that rocks the party...

As an aside, I've always been an excellent motivator!