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Topic Summary

Posted by: Sematary
« on: January 07, 2014, 04:56:09 PM »

I think it adds up to about 3 points for the raiders for every 4 TCN has. As for why the captain chose the course he did was after the pirates moved he was on a direct course to crossing their Ts. So doing nothing put the cruiser off the stern of the other two ships which is always a great place to be.
Posted by: Erik L
« on: January 07, 2014, 04:52:25 PM »

I'd be willing to bet if you pit those raiders against their intended target, a freighter the battle would have been much different.

As for the tonnage/tech thing. Lower tech usually means larger components. So a lot of the advantage is being chewed up in larger, less efficient comps. If they had been equal tech they might have had a better chance. I didn't see a logistic point value on the raiders, and was too lazy to add it up; but how did they compare to the TCN cruiser?

Hmm. I just noticed the TCN ship fired half as much as it could. It had a RoF of 2. The raiders had an RoF of 3/2. So in theory, all three ships could have shot each weapon twice. Those that survived that is.

If I'd been the TCN captain, I would have let the raiders bracket me and cross my T. Then I'd have pulled a 90 degree turn (either way) and let loose with broadsides to each. Given the tech disparity and the overkill, I'd have held off on the PD lasers.
Posted by: Sematary
« on: January 07, 2014, 04:24:14 PM »

I learned a lot from this battle. From a mechanics standpoint the biggest thing I learned is tonnage doesn't mean dick. There was only a 53 ton difference between the two ships at the end, but most of the pirates tonnage was tied up in things like engine for high thrust or powerplants to fully power the ships.

From a genre standpoint I learned just how much people aren't kidding when they say the paperwork for games like this is so long. I spent almost three hours last night and 6 hours today, knowing the rules better could probably shave several hours off of that though. I figured it took so long for the same reason some people spend 2+ hours making a character sheet for an RPG (for reference I tend to take 10-30 minutes on character sheets).
Posted by: Sematary
« on: January 07, 2014, 04:07:16 PM »

I put them at about half a tech level down from the cruiser and figured their 2:1 advantage would help them more as well as the fact that their tonnage was about the same. What really killed them was the power plants. That and the engines were one step lower but 21 plants vs 15 showed how much multipliers help.
Posted by: Erik L
« on: January 07, 2014, 04:04:04 PM »

That went about how I expected it would.

Those poor pirates. They need to steal better ships.
Posted by: Sematary
« on: January 07, 2014, 04:00:52 PM »

The three ships start out 36 hexes away from each other which is within the TCN's sensor range but outside the Pirates' sensor range.

Intiative: TCN 5, OB1 4, OB2 3. TCN moves first.

TCN uses 2 thrust to turn 60 degrees. It uses its remaining 8 thrust and puts it into vector 240.

This puts the TCN within sensor range of both Obsidian Blade ships.

OB1 uses one thrust to rotate 60 degrees. It puts 5 thrust into vector 60. It uses another thrust to rotate 60 more degrees and puts the last 5 thrust into vector 120.

OB2 moves the same as OB1.

OB2 attempts target lock on TCN and succeeds. Distance to TCN is 15 hexes which is too far for PD, and facing is wrong for broadsides.

OB1 attempts target lock on TCN and succeeds. Distance to TCN is 17 hexes which is too far for PD, and facing is wrong for broadsides.

TCN attempts target lock on OB2 and succeeds. OB2 is out of firing range.

TCN attempts target lock on OB1 and succeeds. OB1 is out of firing range.

End of turn 1

Initiative TCN 5, OB1 7, OB2 10 OB2 moves first.

OB2 does not use thrust this turn leaving its vectors at 0/5/5/0/0/0. Distance from TCN is 7 hexes.

OB1 moves the same. Distance from TCN is 9 hexes.

TCN does not use thrust which puts OB1 and OB2 3 hexes off its starboard directly behind them.

TCN is still locked on to OB2
TCN is still locked on to OB1.

First TCN broadside is 5 standard lasers, and 3 capital lasers aimed at OB2. 72 is the number to meet or beat.

SL rolls 20, 68, 95, 62, 41 with 5 hits for 20 EM and 40 thermal
CL rolls 56, 30, 73 with 2 hits for 24 EM and 48 thermal.
Broadside 1 does 44 EM and 88 Thermal.

Second TCN broadside is 5 standard lasers, and 3 capital lasers aimed at OB1. 72 is the number to meet or beat.

SL rolls 86, 32, 71, 57, 43 with 4 hits for 16 EM and 32 Thermal
CL rolls 23, 58, 67 with 3 hits for 36 EM and 72 Thermal.
Broadside 2 does 52 EM, 104 Thermal

First PD fire is aimed at OB1
PD rolls 02, 27, 28, 69, 51, 20, 42, 53, 96, 52, 47, 61, 78, 62, 55, 03, 10, 47, 32, 75 with 17 hits for 68EM and 136 thermal

Second PD fire is aimed at OB2
PD rolls 89, 71, 33, 94, 27, 44, 20, 16, 55, 61, 25, 47, 02, 71, 06, 00, 92, 66, 52, 59 with 17 hits (one is critical) for 68 EM, 136 Thermal and 1 roll on the crit hit table


OB1's shields mitigate 8 EM from the Second Broadside. That leaves 44 EM 5 of which are stopped by the shields. The remaining 39 is applied to shields bringing collapse to 41. The shields then mitigate 8 thermal from the Second Broadside. That leaves 96 Thermal 45 of which are stopped by the shields. 41 of the remaining 51 bring collapse to 0. The last 10 thermal is stopped by armor bringing thermal armor down to 10.

OB1 takes 68 EM and 136 Thermal from First Point Defense Fire. Shields are collapsed and stop none of the damage. 40 of the EM is stopped by armor bringing armor EM to 0. The remaining 18 is split between internal structure (which takes 9) and internal components. The sensor array is damaged with 1 hit. Another hit goes to internal structure. The engines are destroyed. The FTL drive is destroyed with the 4th EM hit. The 5th hit goes to structure, 1 capital laser is damaged with the 6th and 7th shots. 1 standard laser is disabled with the 8th shot. 1 PD laser is damaged with the 9th shot. Internal structure takes 11 hits total from EM damage.

The first 10 thermal is stopped by the armor bringing it to 0. Of the other 126, 63 goes to structure and the other 63 goes to components. 27 hits to structure, 5 power plants are disabled, 1 power plant is damaged, 1 capital laser is damaged, 1 capital laser is disabled,2 capital lasers are destroyed, 2 standard lasers are disabled, 2 standard lasers are damaged, 2 standard laser is destroyed, 1 PD laser is disabled, 1 PD laser is damaged, 3 PD lasers are destroyed, shield generator is destroyed, 1 hit to bridge damaging it, 1 hit to life support disabling it, 1 hit to sensors destroying them. The damaged power plant is ejected.

OB1 becomes a heavily damaged derelict with no crew left alive.


OB2 takes 44 EM from the First Broadside. 8 points are mitigated by the shields which also stop another 5. The remaining 31 brings collapse to 49. It also takes 88 thermal. 8 points are mitigated by sheilds which stop another 45. The remaining 35 brings collapse down to 14.

From the Second Point Defense Fire OB2 takes 68 EM, 136 Thermal, and 1 crit hit. 8 EM is mitigated by the shields which stop another 5. 14 more taken up collapsing the shields. The armor stops 40 of the 41 remaining and the last point of EM does 1 hit to structure.

Armor stops 20 of the 136 thermal damage. Structure takes 63 hits. The other 63 are spread out as follows. 31 hits to structure, 2 hits damage then destroy the shield generator, 3 power plant are destroyed, 2 capital lasers are destroyed, 2 standard lasers are disabled, 1 standard laser is destroyed, 2 PD lasers are disabled, 2 capital lasers are damaged, 1 standard laser is destroyed, 2 hits damage then destroy the engines, 2 hits disable then destroy the FTL drive, 1 hit disables the bridge, 1 hit disables the life support, 2 hits destroy the last two capital lasers, 2 standard lasers are destroyed, 1 PD laser is destroyed, 1 power plant is disabled, 1 standard laser is disabled, 1 PD laser is destroyed, 2 standard lasers are destroyed, 1 PD laser is disabled.


At this point TCN spends two points of thrust to do a combat roll and puts a capital laser shot directly into the two decimated ships to ensure that part of space is kept clean.
Posted by: Sematary
« on: January 07, 2014, 03:26:56 PM »

About half way through the damage write up. Its a long write up.
Posted by: Erik L
« on: January 07, 2014, 02:32:36 PM »

Doesn't matter really. The only exception is when it is being used as PD, then it has a specific time to fire. Otherwise all offensive fire is performed at the same time per ship.
Posted by: Sematary
« on: January 07, 2014, 02:28:30 PM »

Should it go before the broadsides, after, or does it not matter?
Posted by: Erik L
« on: January 07, 2014, 02:23:58 PM »

Quote from: Sematary on January 07, 2014, 02:20:27 PM
PD can be used offensively right? As in instead of using them to intercept missiles they can be used as normal guns within range 8.

Correct. Though they should be counted a separate volley from the standard and capital lasers.
Posted by: Sematary
« on: January 07, 2014, 02:20:27 PM »

PD can be used offensively right? As in instead of using them to intercept missiles they can be used as normal guns within range 8.
Posted by: Erik L
« on: January 07, 2014, 02:15:14 PM »

Depending on range, most likely the ships all started within detection range of each other.

With the shields up, lock on will be automatic for both sides. Their signatures are well over 100. For the case of the OB locking on to the TCN ship the formula is 369 (signature) - 40 (resolution) + 40 (acquisition) for a final chance of 369% :)
Posted by: Sematary
« on: January 07, 2014, 01:55:32 PM »

Thanks for pointing out about PD. I may be doing sensors wrong too, not sure. Writing it up right now. Crossing the T is what both sides are trying for. PD are turreted and the rest are broadsides.
Posted by: Erik L
« on: January 07, 2014, 01:39:38 PM »

Couple of points... PD class weapons are limited to a range of 8 (pg 12). You didn't say how the main weapons were mounted, so I'd assume half in each broadside. Refer to page 11.

My estimate of the outcome... It will come down to initiative. If the TCN cruiser can bring one of the OB ships in range and figure an 80% hit, the OB ship will have at least 25 pts internal damage after one broadside. Scratch that. Much more. The TCN lasers fire 2x per turn, so that is 32 EM and 64 TH (80% hit), which will do about 9 pts of internal from the thermals. The capital lasers, figure 2 of the 3 in the broadside hit, will do around another 130 pts of internal damage. Which should gut the ship.

If the OB gets initiative, one broadside will inflict about 15 damage. If the second ship hits, most of it's damage will penetrate as well, for about another 80ish damage.

The OB will need to watch out if they attempt to bracket because then the TCN ship would be able to fire on both, potentially ending the fight with a broadside to each. Best bets would be to cross the T's and fire at the bow/stern.

But that's just my opinion. I'm interested in seeing how it plays out.
Posted by: Sematary
« on: January 07, 2014, 01:01:49 PM »

I am using the newest set of rules straight from Erik.

The racial profiles are as follows with SR standing for Surrender Roll

TCN Racial Profile:
WP: 75
AR: 85
AG: 60
XE: 20
SR: 67

Obsidian Blade Racial Profile:
WP: 80
AR: 50
AG: 40
XE: 10
SR: 60

I am going to have one TCN Light Cruiser vs 2 large Obsidian Blade Escorts

Code: [Select]
TCN Cruiser
4,712 tons, 2094 power required, 2250 power produce, 248 crew 73 engineering crew, 14 command crew, 335 total crew, 2,477 LP

Signature: 335, 369 when shields are up, 569 when firing full broadside, 469 when firing broadside without PD Lasers

Main Sensor array: 1 ton, 46 LP
3 crew, 1 command crew
Base class 4, range 39, detection range 50, acquisition 45%, 1 ton, 10 LP
Channel Class 4, 40 channels, 10 LP
Signature Class 4 80m active, 20m passive, 20 LP
Resolution Class 4, 30m, 6 LP

Shields: 10 tons, 106 LP, 20 power, 34 signature
5 crew, 1 engineering crew
Shield regeneration generator, Gen 4, Regen 8, Power 20, 12 LP
Theta, power 12, EM 5, Thermal 50, Kinetic 25, Mitigation 9, Collapse 85, Sig 34, 10 tons, 94 LP

Armor: 10 tons, 75 LP
Theta, EM 45, Thermal 20, Kinetic 10, collapse 150, 10 tons, 75 LP

Point Defense Lasers (x20): Total 100 crew, 6 engineering, 300 tons, 740 LP, 100 power
15 cm, FDR 10, 1/2DR 15, 1DR 20, power 5, HTK 1, tons 15, 5 LP
Visible light EM 4, Thermal 8, Kinetic 0, 12LP
ROF Class IV, 2 per turn, 10 LP




Standard Lasers (x10): Total 50 crew, 3 engineering, 150 tons, 80 power 280LP
30 cm, FDR 16, 1/2DR 24, 1DR 32, power 8, HTK 2, 15 tons, 8LP
Visible light 4 EM, 8 Thermal, Kinetic 0, 12 LP
ROF 2 per turn 10 LP

Capital Lasers (x6): Total 30 crew, 3 engineering, 180 tons, 582 LP, 110 power
45 cm, FDR 22, 1/2DR 33, 1DR 44, Power 11, HTK 2, 11 LP, 30 tons
Visible light EM 12, Thermal 24, Kinetic 0, 12LP
ROF Class IV, 2 per turn, 10 LP
High Energy Focus

Standard Grav Pulse Engines: 10 thrust
Total 1325 tons, 90 LP, 1750 power
35 power per thrust per 1,000 tons.
325 tons
18 LP

Standard Antimatter Power Plants: x15, 2250 power, 210 tons, 450 LP
50% meltdown chance, 150 power, 14 tons, 30 LP

Damage Control Crew x4: 4 power, 20 tons, 40 LP

Class III FTL Engine: 150 tons, 30 power, 21 LP
Code: [Select]
Obisidan Blade Escorts
Streamlined 10% of hull
Agile 5% of hull

4,659 tons
2052 power required, 2100 power produced
83 crew, 77 engineering crew, 8 command crew

Signature: 232 signature, 264 with shields, 456 with full broadside, 356 without PD

Main Sensor Array: 1 ton, 35 LP
3 crew, 1 command crew
Base Class 3, range 28, acquisition 40%, detect range 40 hexes, LP 7
Channel class 3, 30 channels, LP 8
Signature class 3, 15 LP
Resolution class 3, 40, 5 LP

Shields: 10 tons, 15 power, 88LP, 32 signature
5 crew, 1 engineering
Regeneration Generator Gen 3, 6 regen rate, 15 power, 9LP
ETA, power 11, EM 5, Thermal 45, Kinetic 20, mitigation 8, 80 collapse, 10 tons, 88LP, 32 signature

Armor:
Eta 40 EM, 20 thermal, 10 Kinetic, 140 collapse, 10 tons, 70 LP

Point Defense Lasers (x5): 25 crew, 1 engineering, 75 tons, 25 power, 100 power
15 cm, FDR 10, 1/2DR 15, 1DR 20, power 5, HTK 1, tons 15, 5 LP
Near Infrared, EM 4, Thermal 6, LP 10
ROF Class III 3 per 2 turns, 5 LP

Standard Lasers (x6): 30 crew, 1 engineering, 48 power, 90 tons, 138 LP
30 cm, FDR 16, 1/2DR 24, 1DR 32, power 8, HTK 2, 15 tons, 8LP
Near Infrared, EM 4, Thermal 6, LP 10
ROF Class III 3 per 2 turns, 5 LP

Capital Lasers (x4): 20 crew, 2 engineering, 44 power, 120 tons, 104 LP
45 cm, FDR 22, 1/2DR 33, 1DR 44, Power 11, HTK 2, 11 LP, 30 tons
Near Infrared, EM 8, Thermal 12, LP 10
ROF Class III 3 per 2 turns, 5 LP

Class II FTL:
15 engineering
150 tons, 40 power, 18 LP

Standard Ion Pulse Engines: 12 thrust
15 engineering
40 power per thrust per 1,000 tons, 480 per 1,000
1525 tons

Standard Fusion Power Plants (x21): 2100 power, 336 tons, 420 LP
42 engineering
50% meltdown chance, 100 power, 16 tons, 20 LP
The starting courses of each are 90 degrees in relation to each other.