Missile Cruiser

[Girlinhat]

I like to use Mk's when it's upgraded, like a new engine level or such, and variant -A's to signify "this one has onboard sensors" or "this one has slightly longer range".  *shrug*

And I agree, serious ASM need to be ~size 5.  Smaller really doesn't pack enough punch or enough range.

[Atlantia (OP)]

OK, and how do others feel vis a vis Size 5 ASM? Also, more importantly, how do you all feel about my ship designs?

[scoopdjm]

Well I'd just say that your ships are good, every thing has been accounted for. The only thing is that, what are they? Cruisers, they're small enough to be frigates or destroyers you asm is like 8500k right? You can literally add another 10000 tons. Also furthering the subject of size, a size 5 IS effective it's just not cruiser material go up to like size 10, use the 5s for frigates.

[Jacob/Lee]

Just in case you get confused, class names are completely useless and are only good for classifying ships. You can have a 100 ton superdreadnought for all the game cares.

[Atlantia (OP)]

Uhm, for the size of my ships, what's the proper 'ship type'? I have no sense of what the relative size is between frigate, dreadnought, cruiser, etc.

[Jacob/Lee]

Uhm, for the size of my ships, what's the proper 'ship type'? I have no sense of what the relative size is between frigate, dreadnought, cruiser, etc.

I'd guess Frigate or Cruiser. Though I'm not a naval expert, you can just give it a random class name/one that sounds cool/whatever. Consult wikipedia if you really care that much.

[Hawkeye]

Ok, let´s have a look

For ICF drives, they are quite slow. Not as big a problem with missile ships, as they are supposed to have the range to touch someone but it still might be an issue.
They have quite heavy armor for the size (those would be DDs/DDLs in my games and tincans don´t get a lot of armor in my book)
They also have a whole lot of maintenance parts. Could easily get away with half of it, given you have fuel for less than a year (yes, they will probably sit most of the time in orbit somewhere, but then there should be maintenance facilities, where they sit, so they won´t add time on their maint-clock).

The escort cruiser looks ok-ish.
The range of the res-1 active against size-6 and smaller missile should be around 1 mkm which is rather short, but it is in-line with the range of your AMMs. Personally, I like to engage hostile missiles somewhat farther out.

The missile cruiser looks good.
Given the size, 8 x size-5 launchers is quite good. Don´t let yourself being talked into bigger ones
Yes, large missiles pack a bigger punch, but each missile shot down by PD is a lot less damage dealt. Personally, I am in the "missile spam" camp. Size-4 and lots of ´em  -- blot out the sun kind of lots.
I also avoid using several different missiles of the same size on one ship - or at all - simply for logistics reasons. It is a PITA to keep the battlefleets supplied with missiles as it is, no need to further complicate things. Also, if I have a long-range shipkiller, I intend to use it and stay out of the range of counterfire. Yes, there will be times, a short-ranged, heavy hitting missile might come in handy, but is it realy worth the trouble?
In addition, I can already hear your captains screaming in rage, when they have pounded the enemy´s shields down from long range and finally start to punch some holes in their enemy ships only to be told that the long-range stuff is all out any you have to close to short range to finish the job. Which will take half an hour and allow the enemy to recharge their ships _and_ blast away at you while closing.

[Erik L]

Steve decoupled ship designations from ship size because a WWI battleship masses about what a modern destroyer does.

[Girlinhat]

Corvette, Destroyer, Cruiser, Battleship, Dreadnaughts and other assorted 'superships'.  I learned this hierarchy from playing Navyfield   Destroyers are usually line ships, cheap and easy weapon platforms, battleships are expensive monsters that can pack a punch and endure one.  Cruisers are a sort of hybrid, many people giving cruisers more speed.

Of course it's all arbitrary...

[orfeusz]

For me it's always:
<8K Frigates/Corvettes - special purpose
~8k - Destroyers - Fast
~20k - Light Cruisers - Special purpose
~30k - Cruisers/Heavy Cruisers - Big firepower (bone of my fleet)
~50k - Battleships - DURABLE
~60k - Light Carriers

Yes, I like big ships 

[scoopdjm]

That's how I organize my ships usually with One battleship or carrier supported by a variety of cruisers or destroyers. But really size is relative. I'd also like to add up your search sensors 9.2m is right on top of you. Some ships can engage you from outside that diatance

[Garfunkel]

I use size-8 missiles but I always play with conventional start so to get WH-9 in the beginning, you need size. Personally I prefer to build a lot of smaller ships - my destroyers having as little as 2 launchers but I have plenty of them. But that's just personal preference.

In any case, I'd heartily recommend building a dedicated sensor ship. No armour, no shields, no weaponry, just massive sized active and passive sensors. Make it somewhere between, 7k-10k tons depending on your shipyards. Even with low tech level, sensors the size of 2,5k or so will reveal a big chunk of a solar system. You can keep them safely behind your battle line as well, as the AI will probably try to target them first.

[Vynadan]

To the designs:
You could try to fine-tune their speed so they match. That's something I usually do, but it's not necessary unless there's an extreme difference between the two.

Their maintenance is still pretty high, but better than before.

Missile size 4 is just fine, if you ask me. My main ASMs are usually size 2 or 4, depending on my tech level, and fighters stock size 1s. I do have larger designs in size 6, 8 and 10, but those are either dedicated bombs, carriers, or LRMs. I have never had the feeling my missiles were too low in the damage department or really needed more size. With more smaller missiles I can easily saturate PD and they aren't as expensive as larger missiles for the same damage output.

To the classification:
I don't give a blork about tonnages. I usually designate my designs by their function. Your 8kt escort would be a frigate in my books and the 5kt ship a destroyer. From experience I can say that my frigates tend to go up to 8-10kt and stay on par with my destroyers. Cruisers often have a slightly larger tonnage and except for carriers I rarely go above 20kt.

[Gidoran]

You can tell when you've maximized the efficiency of your ship's engine power at certain speeds that pop up per level. For example, Ion drives kind of 'peak' at about 4000 kilometers a second, with the next two stages down being 3750 km/s and 3333 km/s. Magnetoplasma drives have 5000km/s as their 'peak', ICF 6000km/s... It basically tacks on an extra 1000. The annoying thing is it doesn't remain stable over tonnage, so if you have a 9000 ton ship and you upgrade the engines you'll end up slapping on 750 more tons on it to get a flat speed of 5000km/s.

As for missiles, there's reasons to do either size: Smaller missiles tend to be more accurate, but either suffer from low range or low damage. Larger missiles are more inaccurate, but not only have bigger warhead capabilities but you can slap armor on them.

The best of both worlds is short-range, high damage, high accuracy small missiles packed as the second section of a long range, slow, armored missile, where they release the missiles outside of enemy PD range.

[Andrew]

Only one problem with the later designs you still have a maintenance life of 8.24 years. I aim for about 1 year, maybe 2 for a warship. Put the space saved in magazines.
The armour is very heavy, this is not a bad thing! but you could get away with a level of 5 or 6 .
Missile size your AMM's will kill any ordinary missile they will occasionally fail if there are armoured missiles however most NPR's do not use armoured missiles . Some of the spoiler races may cause problems.

For ASM's many people use size 5 and lower ASM's as it allow larger salvo sizes and faster reload times making overloading defenses easier. However larger missiles are a viable option (although I find the size 50 missiles some people use a bit silly for missiles ) Paericularly on PDC Launchers I use missiles up to about size 12.