Author Topic: My Current Games First Warship, the Recon-Class Frigate  (Read 1053 times)

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Offline xenoscepter

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My Current Games First Warship, the Recon-Class Frigate
« on: March 12, 2019, 10:06:33 PM »
This ship is my empire's first warship, at least in my current game. Where every other ship that I've posted up to this point was designed with effectively zero actual game time, this is my first ever warship built with the benefit of game-play experience. This is a Conventional Start; so my tech and industry is still very much nascent (I'm only 28 years in), but I'm ready to begin colonizing, have several good worlds picked out, (Although I'm still searching for a new source of Boronide, but I've got two decades and three Geosurvey Ships, I'm sure I'll find SOMETHING.) and have already found two Jump Points to the Unex System, I think? They say Unex in orange letters, so I assume that's a go. So I felt it was about time to have a response in case anyone payed me a visit... well, more realistically in case I MYSELF payed anyone a visit as I didn't spawn in any NPRs at start, but rather am allowing the System Generation thingy-kabob to make ones with a one in ten chance, out a hundred thousand systems.

Anyway, this here is a 5,000 ton Beam Frigate. I don't intend to make many of these, just about 6-12 of 'em before I switch to Light Cruisers (In Progress) They're quick buggers with Magneto-Plasma Engines and... okay-ish sensors. The design is a bit ad-hoc, as I'm just transitioning from these to bigger fish, mebbe 10-15,000 tonners. I expect it to survive contact... if not necessarily WIN. BTW: I have Pre-Cursors and Star Swarm enabled. I expect Pre-Cursors to turn this ship into pulp; assuming what everyone says about them is true. Star Swarm I know a lot less about (DON'T SPOIL ANY OF EM FOR ME!), but I know they use Mesons... so I'll just try to out range them. So here it is:

Code: [Select]
Recon class Frigate    5,000 tons     105 Crew     821.5 BP      TCS 100  TH 375  EM 0
5000 km/s     Armour 3-26     Shields 0-0     Sensors 1/1/0/0     Damage Control Rating 21     PPV 6
Maint Life 2.55 Years     MSP 1103    AFR 200%    IFR 2.8%    1YR 237    5YR 3558    Max Repair 312.5 MSP
Intended Deployment Time: 9 months    Spare Berths 0   

StarTech Systems X2 Experimental Naval Engine (1)    Power 500    Fuel Use 65.51%    Signature 375    Exp 12%
Fuel Capacity 1,500,000 Litres    Range 82.4 billion km   (190 days at full power)

10cm Experimental Naval Laser [IR] (2)    Range 30,000km     TS: 5000 km/s     Power 3-3     RM 1    ROF 5        3 1 1 0 0 0 0 0 0 0
Experimental Naval Beam FCS (1)    Max Range: 60,000 km   TS: 5000 km/s     83 67 50 33 17 0 0 0 0 0
Spirra Spark (1)     Total Power Output 6    Armour 0    Exp 5%

Pioneer Electronics Naval-Rated Sensor Suite [MR] (1)     GPS 4000     Range 20.0m km    Resolution 100

This design is classed as a Military Vessel for maintenance purposes

EDIT: The soon to be 10,000 ton Light Cruiser that will supplement and eventually replace this ship, the Intrepid-Class.

Code: [Select]
Intrepid class Light Cruiser    10,000 tons     209 Crew     1978.69 BP      TCS 200  TH 750  EM 0
5000 km/s     Armour 6-41     Shields 0-0     Sensors 32/32/0/0     Damage Control Rating 23     PPV 11.25
Maint Life 1.69 Years     MSP 1371    AFR 266%    IFR 3.7%    1YR 575    5YR 8625    Max Repair 625 MSP
Intended Deployment Time: 9 months    Spare Berths 7   
Magazine 63   

StarTech Systems X1 Experimental Naval Engine (1)    Power 1000    Fuel Use 43.67%    Signature 750    Exp 12%
Fuel Capacity 2,000,000 Litres    Range 82.4 billion km   (190 days at full power)

12cm Experimental Naval Laser Cannon [IR] (1)    Range 40,000km     TS: 5000 km/s     Power 4-4     RM 1    ROF 5        4 2 1 1 0 0 0 0 0 0
Experimental Class-2 Naval Particle Beam Weapon (1)    Range 60,000km     TS: 5000 km/s     Power 5-5    ROF 5        2 2 2 2 2 2 0 0 0 0
Experimental Naval Beam FCS (1)    Max Range: 60,000 km   TS: 5000 km/s     83 67 50 33 17 0 0 0 0 0
Spirra Spark (2)     Total Power Output 12    Armour 0    Exp 5%

Experimental Class-3 ASM Launch Tube (1)    Missile Size 3    Rate of Fire 90
Experimental Naval Missile FCS (1)     Range 10.6m km    Resolution 50
Class-3 ASM (21)  Speed: 24,000 km/s   End: 4.4m    Range: 6.3m km   WH: 3    Size: 3    TH: 80/48/24

Pioneer Electronics Naval-Rated Sensor Suite [SR] (1)     GPS 64     Range 5.1m km    MCR 558k km    Resolution 1
Pioneer Electronics Naval-Rated Sensor Suite [MR] (1)     GPS 4000     Range 20.0m km    Resolution 100
Pioneer Electronics Naval-Rated Sensor Suite [LR] (1)     GPS 9600     Range 40.7m km    Resolution 200
Pioneer Electronics Naval-Rated Passive Sensor Suite [TH] (1)     Sensitivity 32     Detect Sig Strength 1000:  32m km
Pioneer Electronics Naval-Rated Passive Sensor Suite [EM] (1)     Sensitivity 32     Detect Sig Strength 1000:  32m km

ECM 10

Missile to hit chances are vs targets moving at 3000 km/s, 5000 km/s and 10,000 km/s

This design is classed as a Military Vessel for maintenance purposes

NINJA EDIT: And the Class-3 ASM

Code: [Select]
Missile Size: 3 MSP  (0.15 HS)     Warhead: 3    Armour: 0     Manoeuvre Rating: 10
Speed: 24000 km/s    Engine Endurance: 4 minutes   Range: 6.3m km
ECM Level: 1
Cost Per Missile: 2.15
Chance to Hit: 1k km/s 240%   3k km/s 80%   5k km/s 48%   10k km/s 24%
Materials Required:    0.75x Tritanium   0.5x Uridium   0.9x Gallicite   Fuel x250

As always, feedback is appreciated. I'm somewhat proud of this one, and I have already laid the first of her class, the C.S.S. Recon, C.S.S. Ranger, and C.S.S. Seeker, to the First Battle Group on the 1st of May, year 28.
« Last Edit: March 13, 2019, 12:02:56 AM by xenoscepter »
 

Offline Father Tim

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Re: My Current Games First Warship, the Recon-Class Frigate
« Reply #1 on: March 13, 2019, 02:11:30 AM »
"Unex" = Unexplored
 
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Online Jorgen_CAB

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Re: My Current Games First Warship, the Recon-Class Frigate
« Reply #2 on: March 13, 2019, 09:06:17 PM »
If you are going to build ships for extremely long range patrol projection like this you need way better fuel efficiency on your engines. You are using 2000t on that recon corvette for fuel alone and about 15% of the ships cost is the fueltanks not counting all the other things you need on the ships such as maintenance, armour and crew.

You might also accept that you need tankers to escort long range patrol ships instead of carrying all that fuel in the ships themselves.

The ships that I build with a fuel economy roughly as yours have usually have a range of around 15-25 billion km.

I also think that a ship that are doing recon certainly need passive sensors as well as active ones. The active sensor are mainly for combat and painting the opponent to attack them. With beams you instead would like a resolution 1 active sensor and at least a good EM sensor. You should also build one ship as a dedicated thermal scout.
 
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Offline MarcAFK

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Re: My Current Games First Warship, the Recon-Class Frigate
« Reply #3 on: March 13, 2019, 10:04:24 PM »
The onlhy thing that really sticks out to me is the high fuel use. You'll need lots of refineries or harvesters to support many of these, if you need them to travel far anyway.
" Why is this godforsaken hellhole worth dying for? "
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Offline xenoscepter

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Re: My Current Games First Warship, the Recon-Class Frigate
« Reply #4 on: March 13, 2019, 10:05:54 PM »
     It's just named the Recon-Class... I couldn't think of a better name at the time. It's a Frigate for combat role. I like having a minimal logistics arm, true I pay for it in tonnage that could be used for armor, weapons, sensor, etc. However, I like not having to worry about running out of fuel. I do run tankers, and colliers, and resupply ships of course, but I would rather my ships be more independent in this way, as I never know when the enemy might cut me off. It's also a lot harder to hunt a few logistics ships than many of them; so that is definitely a factor.

     Honestly, my first attempts had like... three years of deployment, three years of fuel, and just as much MSP... these are tiny and efficient compared to those blusters. I don't know, call me crazy, but I like my ships to be as self-sufficient as possible. I prefer decent defenses on fast ships with adequate armament capable of extended deployments that carry at least enough fuel and MSP to match that deployment. Is their performance exemplary? I don't know yet, but probably not. However, that's my fleet doctrine, and I aim to refine it until it is the best it can be. However, I do appreciate the feedback, and apologize for the confusion caused by the name. The Recon-Class is very much an ad hoc design when I realized that the Intrepid wasn't going to gross 5,000-Tons, meaning I needed a warship for the interim while my shipyard expanded it's three slipways by another 5,000 Tons. So it isn't a great design. I have come to realize I'll need a logistics arm, eventually, but I'm aiming for it be as small as possible.  :)

 I think it's sound, after all; who knows what will happen in battle? Maybe I'm suddenly cut off by FACs I didn't see coming. Maybe the Star Swarm comes out of nowhere and eats my logistics ships, and now I have to figure out a way to resupply my fleet, only they are in the middle of a retreat and badly wounded, so they are basically human chow. Maybe we stray to close to some Pre-Cursors, who happen to launch nine-hundred Box Missile salvos with ten missiles each, obliterating my escorts and tanker arm. Or perhaps obliterating a Task Group leaving my escorts and supply group as easy pickin's for the enemy fleets? I don't know what will happen, and frankly I want to be prepared. Dead ships can't shoot back, slow ships can't flee much less evade, as long as the guns are working and the ship is moving we can fight; but if we have no ammo, no fuel, no maintenance supplies and a battered, bruised old girl with empty tanks and two engines shot all to pieces... then we just ran out of hope.

And of course, Cheers!  ;D
 

Offline xenoscepter

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Re: My Current Games First Warship, the Recon-Class Frigate
« Reply #5 on: March 13, 2019, 10:08:03 PM »
High Fuel Use, oh yeah you can say that again...  ::)

These are some thirsty girls, but they're also FAST AF. It'll give 'em some longevity since I intend to retire 'em to guard duty later. The Intrepid can watch for threats with it's Passives and the Recon can go check 'em out... and vaporize 'em if need be.
 

Offline MarcAFK

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Re: My Current Games First Warship, the Recon-Class Frigate
« Reply #6 on: March 13, 2019, 10:10:10 PM »
My first ships are usually like this because of low engine tech, I keep them around earth for fast intercept.
They're definitely not long distance campaign ships :p
" Why is this godforsaken hellhole worth dying for? "
". . .  We know nothing about them, their language, their history or what they look like.  But we can assume this.  They stand for everything we don't stand for.  Also they told me you guys look like dorks. "
"Stop exploding, you cowards.  "
 

Online Jorgen_CAB

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Re: My Current Games First Warship, the Recon-Class Frigate
« Reply #7 on: March 14, 2019, 02:56:49 AM »
High Fuel Use, oh yeah you can say that again...  ::)

These are some thirsty girls, but they're also FAST AF. It'll give 'em some longevity since I intend to retire 'em to guard duty later. The Intrepid can watch for threats with it's Passives and the Recon can go check 'em out... and vaporize 'em if need be.

Yes...  but tecnichally you should build an engine that is larger with lower power multiple instead of all that fuel. The ship will use the same speed, be cheaper, use less fuel and perhaps even fit more other stuff as well.

If you want long distance ships you should experiment with that.
 
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Offline Iranon

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Re: My Current Games First Warship, the Recon-Class Frigate
« Reply #8 on: March 14, 2019, 05:33:35 AM »
Performance-optimum for a given tonnage is a 2:5 split of fuel to engines, more fuel and you'd be better off with larger and less stressed engines. If you can reach your speed target with engines below 1.0 power, 50% propulsion tonnage is the most cost-efficient. 1.0 is awkward because of how costs scale - 1.2 costs 120% to build, 0.8 costs 64% to build.

So 40% engines, 10% fuel is a fine compromise for a high-performance warship. Outside tonnage limitations (fighter/FAC constraints, stealth, roleplaying considerations with treaty tonnage limits), I prefer slightly more in engines and less fuel.

The ratios are what is important for design efficiency, you may want to adjust your standard engine and/or ship sizes to hit the ratio that matches your preferences so you don't have to adjust everything by hand. Size 40 engine at 0.8 power, 10 HS of fuel would fit into the frigate for better performance with some space left over, but speed won't be a clean number and you can't just double it for your cruiser, you'd have to sacrifice some mission tonnage.
 

Offline xenoscepter

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Re: My Current Games First Warship, the Recon-Class Frigate
« Reply #9 on: March 14, 2019, 01:04:11 PM »
I will experiment with that! The whole point right now is learning, after all!  :D
 

Offline Cavgunner

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Re: My Current Games First Warship, the Recon-Class Frigate
« Reply #10 on: March 26, 2019, 12:40:47 AM »
Iranon seems on the mark, and he's made similar comments about my own designs in my older posts.  It's really easy to overlook just how much tonnage is being wasted on excessive fuel capacity, a problem that is easily compounded when you want the ship to have a certain operational range but the engines are just too inefficient for the role.  Your light cruiser requires as much fuel to make one round trip as my current Earth can produce in a month and a half.  And that's just one ship!  A squadron of these would drain my empire's fuel reserves dry in just one operation.  Since you appear to be at a slightly lower tech level than my current game, I assume you'd face the same problem.  And then we have to ask, does it bring enough firepower to make a difference once it arrives?  Slow that baby down just a tad, cut down on the number of fuel tanks, and you'll be able to open up vast amounts of tonnage for MOAR DAKKA and other goodies.
 

Offline Michael Sandy

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Re: My Current Games First Warship, the Recon-Class Frigate
« Reply #11 on: March 26, 2019, 12:51:52 PM »
The demands of a recon frigate are somewhat contradictory.  You want long enough range so that it can get wherever you wish to scout, but you also want your scouting element to be able to outrun an enemy it detects.  I suggest you split up some of the elements.  Have a long endurance carrier that gets the scouting element to the system, and the scouts themselves can be stripped down to the bare minimum.

For example, 1 HS of max boosted engines, .4 HS of fuel, and a .1 HS active sensor will allow a very cheap ship that can get every bit of information about a body you can get without geosurvey.  And it will likely be fast enough to run away if it spots a large anti-ship active sensor.

Going with a scout carrier concept also gets some future proofing, as you could switch out your scouts and also replace them with railgun fighters quite easily.
 

 

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