Author Topic: geosurvey missiles?  (Read 2987 times)

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Online db48x (OP)

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geosurvey missiles?
« on: April 16, 2020, 10:20:47 AM »
I seem to recall doing this in the old days, but I think I'm missing something, or possibly there's a bug. I've launched missiles with geosurvey sensors at waypoints attached to planets, but when the missiles arrived they didn't survey the planet, and then they disappeared on the next 5-day tick. What am I doing wrong?
 

Offline Doren

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Re: geosurvey missiles?
« Reply #1 on: April 16, 2020, 10:55:59 AM »
Might not be actually implemented in C#? Or do you mean by old days in a C# version?

As far as VB went I think it as just as you said: launch geo missile at WP attached to a planet and have enough fuel for them to survive long enough to generate the geo points. I personally never did it just read how it's done so can only help with heresay
 

Online db48x (OP)

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Re: geosurvey missiles?
« Reply #2 on: April 16, 2020, 11:22:46 AM »
Maybe they just don't have enough fuel. I made them small with efficient engines for long range, but perhaps have to make them large with efficient engines for endurance.
 

Offline Kristover

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Re: geosurvey missiles?
« Reply #3 on: April 16, 2020, 11:27:26 AM »
I've never messed around with geosurvey missiles - I'm more of a geosurvey carrier with survey LACs kind of guy myself - but I'm going to try it on my latest test game.  I think the answer might be you need to make a larger than usual missile that can fly for more than a couple of days so it can survey an a small body.
 

Offline Ektor

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Re: geosurvey missiles?
« Reply #4 on: April 16, 2020, 01:03:56 PM »
I just had this issue. You probably need stronger sensors. I designed a first probe and it did nothing, but as soon as I designed a second one with a more powerful geo sensor, it worked. They will stay on the body until either the survey is complete, or they run out of fuel, only when they finish surveying and disappear you'll know the minerals. You need either more powerful sensors or more fuel.
 

Offline Garfunkel

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Re: geosurvey missiles?
« Reply #5 on: April 16, 2020, 01:04:03 PM »
I've done it once in VB6 and it is extremely inefficient. You need a big missile so that it can have plenty of MSP dedicated to the geosurvey sensor AND it needs a lot of fuel to stay alive while on planetary orbit - expect Mars survey to take at least a week.
 

Offline Scud

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Re: geosurvey missiles?
« Reply #6 on: April 17, 2020, 12:46:12 PM »
Quote from: Garfunkel link=topic=10790. msg124106#msg124106 date=1587060243
I've done it once in VB6 and it is extremely inefficient.  You need a big missile so that it can have plenty of MSP dedicated to the geosurvey sensor AND it needs a lot of fuel to stay alive while on planetary orbit - expect Mars survey to take at least a week.

It's more useful for small bodies like asteroids.  (Collecting 5-20 SP is easy, even with tiny sensors) That way a small ship can just zip through a system dropping buoys on every little rock.  The problem is, aurora doesn't automate this very well, so it's easier to use normal survey ships.
 
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Offline Cocyte

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Re: geosurvey missiles?
« Reply #7 on: April 24, 2020, 05:44:20 AM »
I've done it once in VB6 and it is extremely inefficient. You need a big missile so that it can have plenty of MSP dedicated to the geosurvey sensor AND it needs a lot of fuel to stay alive while on planetary orbit - expect Mars survey to take at least a week.
You don't need that much fuel for endurance. Engineless buoy had almost unlimited lives in the VB6 version and can be used as second stages.

I was using long duration sensor buoys as second stages of missiles back on the day, as it was very convenient for zero risk scouting of suspicious planets :

Code: [Select]
B/AS-1 Sensor Buoy

Missile Size: 0.947 MSP  (0.04735 HS)     Warhead: 0    Armour: 0     Manoeuvre Rating: 10
Speed: 0 km/s    Engine Endurance: 0 minutes   Range: 0.0m km
Active Sensor Strength: 0.1504   Sensitivity Modifier: 80%
Resolution: 100    Maximum Range vs 5000 ton object (or larger): 120,000 km
Thermal Sensor Strength: 0.1375    Detect Sig Strength 1000:  137,500 km
EM Sensor Strength: 0.1    Detect Sig Strength 1000:  100,000 km
Cost Per Missile: 0.621
Chance to Hit: 1k km/s 0%   3k km/s 0%   5k km/s 0%   10k km/s 0%
Materials Required:    0.2331x Boronide   0.3879x Uridium   Fuel x0

and the 2 carrier missiles were :

Code: [Select]

MRSD-1 "Blink" Medium Range Sensor Deployment system

Missile Size: 2 MSP  (0.1 HS)     Warhead: 0    Armour: 0     Manoeuvre Rating: 10
Speed: 3700 km/s    Engine Endurance: 150.2 hours   Range: 2,000.9m km
Cost Per Missile: 0.6534
Second Stage: B/AS-1 x1
Second Stage Separation Range: 50,000 km
Overall Endurance: 6 days   Overall Range: 2000.9m km
Chance to Hit: 1k km/s 37%   3k km/s 10%   5k km/s 7.4%   10k km/s 3.7%
Materials Required:    0.2106x Boronide   0.3504x Uridium   0.0924x Gallicite   Fuel x1100

LRSD-1 "Beacon" Long Range Sensor Deployment system

Missile Size: 4 MSP  (0.2 HS)     Warhead: 0    Armour: 0     Manoeuvre Rating: 10
Speed: 3500 km/s    Engine Endurance: 1,591.8 hours   Range: 20,056.1m km
Cost Per Missile: 0.7342
Second Stage: B/AS-1 x1
Second Stage Separation Range: 50,000 km
Overall Endurance: 66 days   Overall Range: 20056.1m km
Chance to Hit: 1k km/s 35%   3k km/s 10%   5k km/s 7%   10k km/s 3.5%
Materials Required:    0.2106x Boronide   0.3504x Uridium   0.1732x Gallicite   Fuel x3375

I remember trying geosurvey sensors in the same fashion, but it took ages to survey anything... A carrier with a fleet of geosurvey fighters was far more efficient for most endeavours.
Of course, don't forget to change the second stage separation range to 0 for geosurvey buoys.
 

Offline se5a

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Re: geosurvey missiles?
« Reply #8 on: April 26, 2020, 07:34:14 PM »
Try this using a two stage missile as Cocyte did, I think that may be your problem. (I've done the following with active and thermal sensors, though not yet geo/grav, it's a bit too micromanagy for my taste)

First design a bouy to hold your geo/grav sensors, check the "No Engines" checkbox.
Second design a delevery system with an efficent engine and the above bouy as a second stage, set the seperation range to 0.

load up the missile in whatever ship you're using, place a waypoint on the planet. target the waypoint, tell the FC to open fire, advance time a couple of seconds, and remember to tell the FC to cease fire so you don't waste those expensive missiles by firing your whole wad at one waypoint.
 

Offline Kof

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Re: geosurvey missiles?
« Reply #9 on: April 26, 2020, 07:52:59 PM »
it was very convenient for zero risk scouting of suspicious planets

Just for reference, what does a suspicious planet look like? Is it the shifty eyes? Trench coat? Dark glasses?
 
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Offline Ri0Rdian

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Re: geosurvey missiles?
« Reply #10 on: April 26, 2020, 07:53:59 PM »
I never tried this for one simple reason (well, maybe two..?)... Asteroids, possibly comets. Surveying them via missiles might kill most players, having to do the chore of waypoint and firing missile at tens of targets.

it was very convenient for zero risk scouting of suspicious planets

Just for reference, what does a suspicious planet look like? Is it the shifty eyes? Trench coat? Dark glasses?

Clothing and accessories are personal matter (even for planets)! I guess something like the cost 2 terrestrial world with liquid hydrosphere and Ammonia-Methane atmosphere I just found in a new system. Prime candidate for bad stuff!

Edit:
And now I found Alien installation there... so while not really suspicious anymore, it was really fishy (literally, there is liquid hydrosphere so I assume fish),  8) ;D
« Last Edit: April 26, 2020, 08:01:18 PM by Ri0Rdian »
 

Offline Garfunkel

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Re: geosurvey missiles?
« Reply #11 on: April 27, 2020, 09:42:19 AM »
I've done it once in VB6 and it is extremely inefficient. You need a big missile so that it can have plenty of MSP dedicated to the geosurvey sensor AND it needs a lot of fuel to stay alive while on planetary orbit - expect Mars survey to take at least a week.
You don't need that much fuel for endurance. Engineless buoy had almost unlimited lives in the VB6 version and can be used as second stages.
That's true but requires one to do 2-stage missiles. It might be easier to make a single-stage missile with enough fuel that the missile doesn't expire before surveying is done.


it was very convenient for zero risk scouting of suspicious planets
Just for reference, what does a suspicious planet look like? Is it the shifty eyes? Trench coat? Dark glasses?


Did I drunk-edit my post or what the heck?  Because I didn't type that or at least it doesn't show up in my post.

I mean, that is true. A sketchy planet, wearing a fedora, shades, and a trench coat, is safer to be scoped out farther away. But yeah, any CC:0 planet you could send a missile at - even if it gets intercepted, at least you then know that the neighborhood is busy.
« Last Edit: April 28, 2020, 08:13:10 PM by Garfunkel »
 

Offline Gabethebaldandbold

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Re: geosurvey missiles?
« Reply #12 on: April 27, 2020, 10:55:33 AM »
it was very convenient for zero risk scouting of suspicious planets

Just for reference, what does a suspicious planet look like? Is it the shifty eyes? Trench coat? Dark glasses?
nah, its the colony cost 0. that spells angry NPR
To beam, or not to beam.   That is the question
the answer is you beam. and you better beam hard.
 

Offline skoormit

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Re: geosurvey missiles?
« Reply #13 on: April 27, 2020, 11:07:47 AM »
But yeah, any CC:0 planet you could send a missile at - even if it gets intercepted, at least you then know that the neighbourhood is busy.

That's actually a good point.
If the intent of sending a geo survey missile is merely to avoid risking the loss of an expensive geo survey ship, you can achieve the same thing by sending a much-cheaper missile instead.
Just put the minimum possible thermal sensor on it.
If it makes it to the planet, you'll know if the planet is hot or not.
If it doesn't make it to the planet--well, now you know that the planet is hot.
 

Online db48x (OP)

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Re: geosurvey missiles?
« Reply #14 on: April 28, 2020, 11:31:53 AM »
Yep, I ended up making a small active sensor buoy as a second stage. This has saved the lives of hundreds of crewmen and, more importantly, dozens of officers. (I turned up the ruin generation chance and turned down the distance between NPRs so that I would have more excitement earlier.)

Next time I do this, I'll make the active sensor smaller. I wasn't really thinking very hard when I designed it, and it ended up being size 3 with 1.3 million km of range, which is a bit silly. Any defensive ships will be right on top of the planet most of the time, or they'll be a lot further away from it than that at a different planet.. The missile ended up being size 5, which could have been a lot better. Worked perfectly though.
 

 

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