Author Topic: Aurora and the blind newbie  (Read 2404 times)

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Offline Caplin (OP)

Aurora and the blind newbie
« on: June 30, 2010, 05:23:59 PM »
Hi All,
A friend of mine recently turned me on to Aurora, which is the only
single-player 4x game accessible to the blind.  
I should qualify that statement a bit.  The screens I've used thus far work
with my screen reader, though they are far from ideal in most cases.  I can
carry out ship design, research, and economic managementt with an effort.
I've even managed to  deploy task forces and give orders with the taskforce
screen.
The question I have is: what am I missing without access to the "map" portion of
the system map window?  I think tactical combat might be problematic, unless a
way exists to judge relative distances and directions textually.
It's a testament to the game's quality that this is my only concern.  I want to
thank Steve and everybody else for supporting such a remarkable free program.
Any advice, tips, or whatever would be greatly appreciated.  I am happy
to try to answer any questions about accessibility you all might have.
Hoping to hear back soon, and thanks in advance.
All the best,
Zack.
 

Offline UnLimiTeD

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Re: Aurora and the blind newbie
« Reply #1 on: July 01, 2010, 06:30:24 AM »
Wow, thinking about it, that IS pretty impressive for a game.

The Map shows the planets and other stuff you don't need to "see".
In a combat situation, it could get a little tough judging the distances to, say, a population you want to protect, or quickly seeing if there is a hostile fleet approaching etc.

When in actual Combat, I normally use the combat screen, which shows distance on most possible targets, and in question, theres always the auto fire option, but don't use that on Anti-Missile Escorts, or they will target enemy ships instead.
You can set those up to fire at enemy missiles automatically, though.
In combat, movement orders are also normally set relative to targets, like follow in X distance (which probably is optimal weapon range).

If you have a good conception of the positions, you can probably extrapolate the overall situation of the battle by the ship positions relative to each other.
In aurora, it's normally several fleets/subfleets fighting, not dogfights or skirmishes.

In the end, it might end up changing the gameplay a little, you'll have to concentrate more on way-marks, like Planets, so battles are likely to take place either around planets or on collision course with an enemy fleet, as waypoints won't be set.
I think for taskforce training, waypoints might be necessary, though, I personally never had problems without.

I imagine it is considerable effort to play this game without visuals, the interface must be a nightmare, but if you already get along with that, I guess that won't stop you now. :D
 

Offline Caplin (OP)

Re: Aurora and the blind newbie
« Reply #2 on: July 02, 2010, 09:39:07 AM »
Hi,
Thanks for the quick response.  
As an update, In my current game it is now 2032, and my first extrasolar
exploration is taking place.  
Thus far, I have avoided combat--in fact I have no military ship designs at the
moment.  I wonder if this is a bad idea?
Accessibility-wise, the taskforce screen is a nightmare.  I managed to figure
out how to transfer ships from one force to another after minutes of fumbling.
The biggest issue is that the button to carry out the transfer is a graphic
without a text  label, so I had no idea until I actually tried clicking it that
it would, indeed, transfer ships.
Speaking of task forces, is there any tutorial to explain the functions of all
the buttons and controls on that screen?  I gather most of them are rarely used,
but some seem to be redundant.  A cursory search around here hasn't yielded
anything useful.
Other than the nightmare of taskforces,, things seem to be going well.  I've
especially found the system summary screen (f9) to be invaluable.
Thanks again for the quick response.  I hope we can iron out these little access
quirks and soon we'll have a truly accessible 4x game on our hands.
Hope to hear from you.
Best,
Zack.
 

Offline UnLimiTeD

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Re: Aurora and the blind newbie
« Reply #3 on: July 02, 2010, 12:31:09 PM »
Congratulations.
Well, I obviously never had problems with Graphics in that way, it's an arrow of sort.
But the task force screen isn't that much accessible to other people as well, theres still a few buttons I'd have to guess without knowing the gameplay that they likely influence.
I guess theres probably a quick overview in the wiki tutorial, but, honestly, I'm not sure about that. I guess I'm not qualified to be a forum guide :)
About combat:
Sooner or later, unless you turned that off, you will encounter [Possible Spoiler ahead] Precursors, automated Warships guarding systems, and maybe even face enemies actively attacking you, and as such, it would probably be of advantage to have Warships.
If you want to just expand save, I'd recommend building War Ships without Engines, called OWP, Orbital Weapon Platform, or whatever the specific Player calls them.
They'll just hover over the planet you've built them at, and if fitted properly will prevent hostile Missile attacks on your population.

I guess it is somewhat a valid tactic to only use your military defensively.

If you go that route, I'd recommend big, heavily armored Warships with low speed and Gauss Turrets for Fleet Anti Missile Defense, with long range Weaponry, like Missiles.

Also, I'd recommend to you to turn off Task force training in any game you start, It'll be a hassle training up task forces (that can take several years) so they'll always follow your orders on time, and sometimes they even need waypoints to do so, which you can't set.

Good luck there.
 

Offline Mini

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Re: Aurora and the blind newbie
« Reply #4 on: July 03, 2010, 01:43:58 AM »
You could also build Planetary Defence Centers (PDCs) which are like OWPs but they sit on the planet instead of orbit around it, and have 5 free armour rows. They are usually restricted to using meson cannons and missiles as other weapons are reduced in power or blocked by any atmosphere on a planet. PDCs are also restricted from having some components (such as engines) because they can't physically move from where they were built on a planet, being built into it.
 

Offline UnLimiTeD

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Re: Aurora and the blind newbie
« Reply #5 on: July 03, 2010, 04:46:59 AM »
They also have the advantage of being built by Construction Factories, however, I didn't mention them because if an enemy bombards the PDC, that indirectly effects the population.
 

Offline Caplin (OP)

Re: Aurora and the blind newbie
« Reply #6 on: July 03, 2010, 05:15:40 AM »
Hi,
Truth be known I decided to restart eventually.  Sol really got the short end of
the stick mineral-wise, and I ran into some rather aggressive chaps at Epsilon
Eridani.  (I'm not sure if they were an NPR or the precursors you mentioned,
but they blew my helpless jump ship up with missiles before I could blink.
So...  I made lots of mistakes in that game which I hopefully won't be
repeating.
I do have some other questions now.  Specifically, I was trying to use mass
drivers to do mineral delivery from Titan to Earth.
With a bunch of automated mines on surface, do I need people there to load the
driver and fire it?  Also, aside from selecting a destination, is there a
specific "fire a mineral packet now" button?  I couldn't see one.
Other than that, I'm really pleased with the accessibility here.  I've yet to
run into anything I genuinely can't use, the System Map being an obvious
exception.  Speaking of that, I'm not quite sure why task force training would
require waypoints?  I'd love to keep it on if possible: it seems quite
realistic.
Anyhow, that's all for now.  Thanks for all the feedback and advice.
Yours,
Zack.
 

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Re: Aurora and the blind newbie
« Reply #7 on: July 03, 2010, 05:45:12 AM »
Quote from: "zkline"
With a bunch of automated mines on surface, do I need people there to load the
driver and fire it?  Also, aside from selecting a destination, is there a
specific "fire a mineral packet now" button?  I couldn't see one.
Nope.  Just make sure that you've got a driver at the destination, otherwise it's "The Moon is a Harsh Mistress" time :-)  BTW, the packets are shipped as part of the 5-day economic cycle.
Quote
 Speaking of that, I'm not quite sure why task force training would
require waypoints?

Because that's the way the game emulates the TF commander saying "okay, now I want all of you to go over there".  The waypoints are put in (and removed) automagically by the game whenever it generates a new (random) destination for the TF is training.  Note that there seems to be a sporadic bug that showed up a year or two ago - sometimes this automatic process breaks.  It seems to have something to do with the auto-process generating the first waypoint in the game - IIRC the problem goes away if you generate one yourself.

John
 

Offline Steve Walmsley

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Re: Aurora and the blind newbie
« Reply #8 on: July 03, 2010, 06:00:27 AM »
Quote from: "zkline"
The question I have is: what am I missing without access to the "map" portion of
the system map window?  I think tactical combat might be problematic, unless a
way exists to judge relative distances and directions textually.
It's a testament to the game's quality that this is my only concern.  I want to
thank Steve and everybody else for supporting such a remarkable free program.
Any advice, tips, or whatever would be greatly appreciated.  I am happy
to try to answer any questions about accessibility you all might have.
Hoping to hear back soon, and thanks in advance.
The map displays the current location of your fleets, any contacts and any bodies within the system. While you could work out relative positions by issuing orders and seeing the distance on the task group window, that would be very tedious. I guess the ideal situation would be some type of optional coordinate display for fleets, contacts and system bodies so you can judge their relative positions. Does your screen reader pick up anything from the F3 map window at the moment beyond the buttons and sidebar view or would those coordinates have to be on one of the other windows?

Steve
 

Offline Caplin (OP)

Re: Aurora and the blind newbie
« Reply #9 on: July 03, 2010, 06:50:48 AM »
Hi Steve,
Nice of you to drop by...  I hope Vegas treated you well, and once again thanks
for a great game.
Unfortunately, the system map is problematic.  I can pick up a lot but making
sense of it is difficult.  At the moment I haven't got any ships out there, so
am only picking up Sol's native bodies.  Still, there is no rhyme or reason to
the way my screen reader lays them out.  It seems vaguely grid-like, but beyond
that I've no way to understand it.  I can read the labels anyway.
Some kind of coordinate display would be very nice, along with possibly a way
to specify destinations using them--but I think that last is much less
important.
Of course, I have yet to experience many aspecs of the game, so we'll see how
my impressions and ideas grow over time.
Great to hear from you.
Yours,
Zack.
 

Offline Steve Walmsley

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Re: Aurora and the blind newbie
« Reply #10 on: July 03, 2010, 07:09:55 AM »
Quote from: "zkline"
Unfortunately, the system map is problematic.  I can pick up a lot but making
sense of it is difficult.  At the moment I haven't got any ships out there, so
am only picking up Sol's native bodies.  Still, there is no rhyme or reason to
the way my screen reader lays them out.  It seems vaguely grid-like, but beyond
that I've no way to understand it.  I can read the labels anyway.
Some kind of coordinate display would be very nice, along with possibly a way
to specify destinations using them--but I think that last is much less
important.
I can add coordinates to the end of the labels of the planets, fleets, etc.. The trick is going to be finding the balance between useful information and overload. Aurora tracks everything in the game on a ten centimetre grid with the system primary as 0,0. When you are talking about distances of billions of kilometers, the coordinate system involves fairly long numbers. Perhaps a good balance would be to display coordinates in thousands of kilometers or perhaps tens of thousands. Using 10k km units, in my current game that would give Earth coordinates of 12900, -7575, while Saturn is at -93486, 107779. I could use a similar system for fleets and contacts. Would something along those lines be practical?

Steve
 

Offline Caplin (OP)

Re: Aurora and the blind newbie
« Reply #11 on: July 03, 2010, 07:18:58 AM »
Hi Steve,
Certainly practical.  I can understand the problem of information overload.  
I'm not even far in at all and already grappling with it.  A system along the
lines you outline would be a compromise but a good one in my opinion.  
I'm particularly intrigued by the fact that I'll be able to get not only a
better idea of where the enemy is, but be able to track him as well.  
I look forward to seeing the day when this system is implemented.  I do hope it
isn't too much of an effort for you.
You've made my day, and I definitely appreciate it.
Best,
Zack.
 

Offline Steve Walmsley

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Re: Aurora and the blind newbie
« Reply #12 on: July 03, 2010, 07:44:56 AM »
Quote from: "zkline"
Hi Steve,
Certainly practical.  I can understand the problem of information overload.  
I'm not even far in at all and already grappling with it.  A system along the
lines you outline would be a compromise but a good one in my opinion.  
I'm particularly intrigued by the fact that I'll be able to get not only a
better idea of where the enemy is, but be able to track him as well.  
I look forward to seeing the day when this system is implemented.  I do hope it
isn't too much of an effort for you.
You've made my day, and I definitely appreciate it.
Best,
Zack.
I have added a new option to the Display 2 sidebar entitled "Show Body/Fleet Coordinates". This adds coordinates in 10k kilometers units to the end of the labels for every star, planet, moon, asteroid, jump point, lagrange point, wormhole, fleet, missile and contact in the system. This is up and working for v5.20. Once that version is out, see how it works out in practice and then I can add coordinates to other areas as necessary.

Steve
 

Offline Dark

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Re: Aurora and the blind newbie
« Reply #13 on: July 04, 2010, 09:51:42 AM »
Hi.

As another photonically challenged person i've been looking into this and my findings are pretty much the same as Zacks, ---- though I suspect the columnization of the system map is slightly different owing to my screen reader (I use Hal a different on from Zacks).

I've not got as far into the game myself, just trying to get used to many of the property sheets and other control options which are used for assigning officers etc, though I'm not yet involved enough with the game to suggest any ways in which these may be improved as yet.

thanks a lot for adding the coordinates system though, that will make the map a good deal more useful and make it possible to far more easily understand the relative position of system bodies.

As Zack said, there is absolutely nothing like this accessible at all, which makes it a really amazing prospect if the various kinks can be worked through.