Author Topic: Questions Not Worth Their Own Thread: C# Edition  (Read 74262 times)

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Offline nuclearslurpee

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Re: Questions Not Worth Their Own Thread: C# Edition
« Reply #1725 on: May 08, 2021, 09:42:59 AM »
I'm putting together a xenoarchaeology expedition and I want to make sure I get the commander bonus.

I have two formations:
1) XENO -- Contains 872 tons of xeno units, with 4.0 total Xeno points.
2) SHQ1 -- Contains a single 22-ton static unit with 1000 HQ capacity.

I create a hierarchy with the XENO unit beneath the SHQ1 unit.
I have a commander with a Xenoarchaeologly bonus.
Where do I assign him? The SHQ1, because it has the HQ unit, or directly to the XENO?

The best approach is to put all of the elements into a single formation. Without any HQ element the XEN formation will not gain any benefit from a commander.

Is there a way to self destruct missiles?  Accidently put 4 navigation buoys on a single jump point

Not easily. The best solution would be to have a separate player race, spawn in a PD ship with SM mode, and shoot the missiles.
 
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Offline skoormit

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Re: Questions Not Worth Their Own Thread: C# Edition
« Reply #1726 on: May 08, 2021, 10:02:58 AM »
I'm putting together a xenoarchaeology expedition and I want to make sure I get the commander bonus.

I have two formations:
1) XENO -- Contains 872 tons of xeno units, with 4.0 total Xeno points.
2) SHQ1 -- Contains a single 22-ton static unit with 1000 HQ capacity.

I create a hierarchy with the XENO unit beneath the SHQ1 unit.
I have a commander with a Xenoarchaeologly bonus.
Where do I assign him? The SHQ1, because it has the HQ unit, or directly to the XENO?

The best approach is to put all of the elements into a single formation. Without any HQ element the XEN formation will not gain any benefit from a commander.

Whale crap.

Suppose I design a new formation that contains the same xeno units plus the HQ unit.
Is there a way to combine my existing XENO and HQ formations into a formation of the new type?
Or am I going to need to build the new formation from scratch?
 

Offline nuclearslurpee

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Re: Questions Not Worth Their Own Thread: C# Edition
« Reply #1727 on: May 08, 2021, 10:40:03 AM »
You can drag the HQ elements to the XEN formations and delete the empty ex-HQ formations.

Or you can use the replacements/series system to do this which has the side benefit of getting things set up correctly for any future replacements needs.
 

Offline db48x

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Re: Questions Not Worth Their Own Thread: C# Edition
« Reply #1728 on: May 08, 2021, 04:42:48 PM »
Your intuition is correct. The brigade will suffer slight penalties with this command structure while the regiments are suffering over 50% penalties I believe. This design is not good, and if this is what the NPRs are being given maybe Steve needs to revisit the auto-designer at some point as the NPR does not need such a handicap.

That’s not quite correct. These units will “suffer” only from slightly reduced bonuses.

if the largest HQ in a formation has a rating less than the formation size, the effectiveness of the formation commander's bonuses will be reduced by (HQ rating / formation size).

The screenshot shows a hierarchy with a total size of 58,794t and an HQ capacity of 50,000t. A commander with a 20% bonus would still be providing a 17% bonus to all of the troops in his brigade. Not a huge concern. The regiments meanwhile get 7/15ths of their commander’s bonus; that’s about half the bonus applied to about twice as many troops. They also get 25% of the 17% bonus given by the brigade commander (so another 4.25%) for a total bonus of 13.2%.

All of these troops are going to perform better than a formation that lacks an HQ or lacks an assigned commander. It’s better to have an extra regiment underneath the brigade and go over the HQ capacity a bit than to leave that regiment out of the hierarchy where it cannot get as many bonuses.

Also note that there is another wrinkle; the numbers like HQ7 and HQ50 can be ambiguous. Some values for the HQ capacities can be abbreviated to the same short form; always double–check by selecting the formation HQ element and looking at the long form in the description.
 

Offline db48x

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Re: Questions Not Worth Their Own Thread: C# Edition
« Reply #1729 on: May 08, 2021, 04:59:27 PM »
I'm putting together a xenoarchaeology expedition and I want to make sure I get the commander bonus.

I have two formations:
1) XENO -- Contains 872 tons of xeno units, with 4.0 total Xeno points.
2) SHQ1 -- Contains a single 22-ton static unit with 1000 HQ capacity.

I create a hierarchy with the XENO unit beneath the SHQ1 unit.
I have a commander with a Xenoarchaeologly bonus.
Where do I assign him? The SHQ1, because it has the HQ unit, or directly to the XENO?

The best approach is to put all of the elements into a single formation. Without any HQ element the XEN formation will not gain any benefit from a commander.

Whale crap.

Suppose I design a new formation that contains the same xeno units plus the HQ unit.
Is there a way to combine my existing XENO and HQ formations into a formation of the new type?
Or am I going to need to build the new formation from scratch?

Once you fix this formation by drag–and–drop, go back and design another HQ unit with a larger HQ capacity, say 50,000t. Assign your XENO formations to your HQ formation’s hierarchy, and then assign commanders to all of them. The commander of the upper–level HQ will give 25% of his bonus to all the formations he commands, and more bonuses is more better.

Also, I think you will find that you will want a lot more than 4.0 Xeno points on a planet at once. 4.0 Xeno points gives you a nominal 4% chance to decipher some ruins every year. That’s pretty low. I think you’ll find that after about 17 or 18 years, you’ll still have a 50% chance of not yet having finished the project. With 100 Xeno points, you’ll hit the 50% mark after about 8 months.

The good news with small formations is that you can make a lot of them :)
 
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Offline Stryker

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Re: Questions Not Worth Their Own Thread: C# Edition
« Reply #1730 on: May 09, 2021, 02:24:41 AM »
I'm having problems with my point defense missiles.  I've got res 1 fire control and sensors, size 1 missiles and launcher's, the fire control is set to 5 missiles per salvo, but the only way they will fire is if I assign a salvo as a target and open fire.  In vb6 you didn't have to do that.  You just assigned your missiles to a fire control and set the control to the number of missiles per salvo and they would fire automatically.  What am I missing?
 

Offline Zap0

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Re: Questions Not Worth Their Own Thread: C# Edition
« Reply #1731 on: May 09, 2021, 02:59:31 AM »
Are the missiles being detected by your res 1 sensor in the increment before impact? If they're fast enough to cross through your detection envelope before they're detected, your defenses can't fire.

More likely:
Do you have the race firing them set as hostile? That appears to be a requirement now.
 

Offline Stryker

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Re: Questions Not Worth Their Own Thread: C# Edition
« Reply #1732 on: May 09, 2021, 03:14:23 AM »
Are the missiles being detected by your res 1 sensor in the increment before impact? If they're fast enough to cross through your detection envelope before they're detected, your defenses can't fire.

More likely:
Do you have the race firing them set as hostile? That appears to be a requirement now.

No they are neutral, so that might explain it.  I'll set them to hostile and try again.  Thanks.
 

Offline db48x

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Re: Questions Not Worth Their Own Thread: C# Edition
« Reply #1733 on: May 09, 2021, 05:22:58 AM »
Are the missiles being detected by your res 1 sensor in the increment before impact? If they're fast enough to cross through your detection envelope before they're detected, your defenses can't fire.

More likely:
Do you have the race firing them set as hostile? That appears to be a requirement now.

No they are neutral, so that might explain it.  I'll set them to hostile and try again.  Thanks.

It’s a lot less confusing if you put your reply outside the quote, after the  [/quote] tag.
 

Offline nuclearslurpee

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Re: Questions Not Worth Their Own Thread: C# Edition
« Reply #1734 on: May 09, 2021, 08:28:16 AM »
Your intuition is correct. The brigade will suffer slight penalties with this command structure while the regiments are suffering over 50% penalties I believe. This design is not good, and if this is what the NPRs are being given maybe Steve needs to revisit the auto-designer at some point as the NPR does not need such a handicap.

That’s not quite correct. These units will “suffer” only from slightly reduced bonuses.

if the largest HQ in a formation has a rating less than the formation size, the effectiveness of the formation commander's bonuses will be reduced by (HQ rating / formation size).

The regiments are 15k tons with HQ7, so they will suffer over 50% penalties by the exact rule cited - but the regimental commanders are the most affected, not the brigade commander.
 

Online Density

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Re: Questions Not Worth Their Own Thread: C# Edition
« Reply #1735 on: May 09, 2021, 01:51:55 PM »
Quote from: nuclearslurpee link=topic=11545. msg151365#msg151365 date=1620566896
Quote from: db48x link=topic=11545. msg151346#msg151346 date=1620510168
Quote from: nuclearslurpee link=topic=11545. msg151248#msg151248 date=1620398833
Your intuition is correct.  The brigade will suffer slight penalties with this command structure while the regiments are suffering over 50% penalties I believe.  This design is not good, and if this is what the NPRs are being given maybe Steve needs to revisit the auto-designer at some point as the NPR does not need such a handicap.

That’s not quite correct.  These units will “suffer” only from slightly reduced bonuses.

Quote from: Steve Walmsley link=topic=8495. msg110196#msg110196 date=1538934331
if the largest HQ in a formation has a rating less than the formation size, the effectiveness of the formation commander's bonuses will be reduced by (HQ rating / formation size).

The regiments are 15k tons with HQ7, so they will suffer over 50% penalties by the exact rule cited - but the regimental commanders are the most affected, not the brigade commander.

I believe db was reading "penalties" as meaning "less effective than without an HQ and officer" where you meant it as "less effective than a sufficiently-sized HQ and officer".  You're both saying the same thing in different ways.
 

Offline ChubbyPitbull

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Re: Questions Not Worth Their Own Thread: C# Edition
« Reply #1736 on: May 11, 2021, 10:54:13 AM »
Redesigned my ground elements based on everyone's feedback, thank you!

Second ground question, how does upgrading unit types work? I believe I read somewhere that if you put unit types in a series, the game will automatically replace obsolete units in old series with the non-obsolete series, or something along those lines?

For example, I designed an Infantry unit at the start of my game, and built a large amount of Infantry regiments with 1300 or so of that infantry. However, since then my racial armor and weapon techs have improved, so I designed an Infantry Mark 2 that is the same as the infantry unit, except now it has the advances in my racial armor/weapon tech. I created an "Infantry" unit series, added the "Infantry" and "Infantry Mark 2" designs to it, and marked "Infantry" as obsolete.

However, my unit formation Infantry Regiment templates still use "Infantry," and I can't edit the templates since they're in production. How do I have my existing Infantry Regiments start the process of upgrading their "Infantry" to "Infantry Mark 2s?" I'd like to do the same for the rest of my formations as well as I also had other unit types and armored formations I want to upgrade with the newest racial armor/weapon techs.
 

Offline nuclearslurpee

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Re: Questions Not Worth Their Own Thread: C# Edition
« Reply #1737 on: May 11, 2021, 10:59:43 AM »
There is no automatic upgrading functionality in the game at present. The unit series feature presently only works for unit replacement, that is, replacing losses or otherwise making up a shortfall in the unit template. However, the series system is configured to automatically use the most up-to-date version of a unit series to do the replacements. This means that if you have an "Infantry" series with a Mark 1 and Mark 2, an infantry formation built to a template with the Mark 1, and a replacement formation built with Mark 2s, the replacement formation will replace Mark 1 casualties with Mark 2s without you having to change the template at all.

I do hope Steve eventually reworks ground units to use the Series system more integrally as it has a lot of potential to automate formation design and upgrading, but for now this is what we have.
 
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Offline ChubbyPitbull

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Re: Questions Not Worth Their Own Thread: C# Edition
« Reply #1738 on: May 11, 2021, 11:09:04 AM »
There is no automatic upgrading functionality in the game at present. The unit series feature presently only works for unit replacement, that is, replacing losses or otherwise making up a shortfall in the unit template. However, the series system is configured to automatically use the most up-to-date version of a unit series to do the replacements. This means that if you have an "Infantry" series with a Mark 1 and Mark 2, an infantry formation built to a template with the Mark 1, and a replacement formation built with Mark 2s, the replacement formation will replace Mark 1 casualties with Mark 2s without you having to change the template at all.

I do hope Steve eventually reworks ground units to use the Series system more integrally as it has a lot of potential to automate formation design and upgrading, but for now this is what we have.

Thank you once again for the help and incredibly quick response? So as far as this goes, if I make a new formation "Infantry Regiment Mark 2" that uses the "Infantry Mark 2" units, if a base "Infantry Regiment" formation takes losses they will be replaced with "Infantry Mark 2s" as well?
 

Offline nuclearslurpee

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Re: Questions Not Worth Their Own Thread: C# Edition
« Reply #1739 on: May 11, 2021, 11:38:01 AM »
There is no automatic upgrading functionality in the game at present. The unit series feature presently only works for unit replacement, that is, replacing losses or otherwise making up a shortfall in the unit template. However, the series system is configured to automatically use the most up-to-date version of a unit series to do the replacements. This means that if you have an "Infantry" series with a Mark 1 and Mark 2, an infantry formation built to a template with the Mark 1, and a replacement formation built with Mark 2s, the replacement formation will replace Mark 1 casualties with Mark 2s without you having to change the template at all.

I do hope Steve eventually reworks ground units to use the Series system more integrally as it has a lot of potential to automate formation design and upgrading, but for now this is what we have.

Thank you once again for the help and incredibly quick response? So as far as this goes, if I make a new formation "Infantry Regiment Mark 2" that uses the "Infantry Mark 2" units, if a base "Infantry Regiment" formation takes losses they will be replaced with "Infantry Mark 2s" as well?

Replacements are only taken from a formation which is marked "Use for Replacements" with the checkbox in the ground forces window. However, if you were to mark the Mark 2 regiment as used for replacements, and a Mark 1 regiment needed replacements due to combat losses, the Mark 2 infantry would be used to replace those losses.

Reference Steve's dev post here: http://aurora2.pentarch.org/index.php?topic=11593.msg140370#msg140370
 
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