OOC: small amendment to the encuragement of debate

[Detjen (OP)]

OOC: I wanted to throw this ooc first because I feel this is such a small matter it might not need full ic devotion, and we could "pretend" it was already there,  but what about an abstain option in the vote?  It wouldnt ruin the Yes/ no option voting as a person intending to abstain would most likley simply not vote.  by having abstinations we could kinda get an idea of the size of our senate and how many people might be reading but not voting, either because they choose not to vote or because they dont like either option.  an abstination would nto win the day it would still have ot be yes or no.   if you feel this issue is big enough to warrent IC proposal I will do that, but I was hopeing to squeese it in.

[areyoua]

[ooc]I would agree with this, but if there start to become too many abstentions such as having them make up >50% of the total voters than it should eventually be change. I would also like squeeze in another edit I just noticed now, in the 6th line from the top the text just says "Concerned that their format may have a negative effect on" it should say "Concerned that their format may have a negative effect on debate" but I got distracted when I wrote it and then moved on to he next line. This actually doesn't change anything, but would go a long way into making the bill seem more formal.[/ooc]

[ardem]

Concerns or non factual comments should not be included in laws is my opinion, but all amendments regardless of how small or large should be voted on to divert from the format would lessen the impact of the senate, this is why the author, must spend time to understand what he has penned.

Personally I felt many of the lines were not legal, but still voted for it to pass, as I felt it was necessary so there was atleast some format to follow.

Senator Winston

[areyoua]

Well, it seems I have been convinced. Senator Winston make a good point on the importance to follow protocol, so therefore, I must retract my support for this change unless it was put in bill form.

I would also ask which lines were illegal in the resolution.

George Payne
Infrastructure Minister

[ardem]

Sorry Senator Payne, I did not mean to suggest the lines were illegal, I meant to say the format they were presented did not seem to be a legal way of penning the law.

Examples would be 'Concern about time spend on debating' I would not specify this as a legal way of phasing something as it can not be quantified or is tangible. You want your bills that pass, able to stand up in a supreme court, you do not need a lawyer to shred your bill apart, it become personally, very messy.

I have been though the legal system once myself, it is another world of course, I lost, the matter was over fact that if a person leaves their car park on my driveway I cannot have it, towed then crushed at the nearest chop shop. An unfortunate mistake on my behalf.

[Sheb]

Should we form a comitte to re-write the law in a more legal language? While we're at it, we could also re-write the Charter and include that law in it.

[ardem]

Fortunately not without a bill to pass it. What is written stays written until such time it is changed.

[Father Tim]

[ooc]OOC: I'd hate to see everything re-written in legalese, especially since I believe our Senate includes a couple of non-native English speakers and we could lose them entirely if we get too far into the jargon.  I think it should be up to the proposing member (ie the writer) how much 'legal language' they put into their bill. [/ooc]

[Detjen (OP)]

OOC: no problem then just thought Id try it    as for the leagalese I agree to a bit, we can write formaly without getting overboard.  I belive the charter should defenatly oversee a re-write all sorts of omissions or new ideas, that could be adjusted into it.    so lets just try not to get TOO Formal with our writing :p  nothign wrong with making it nice at least   if any non english speakers do start having troubles in understading us,  please ask,  I would hate to lose anyone simply cause of the writing.