2.5 Bugs

[vergeraiders]

Not sure if this is a bug or a feature, but if a refinery is shut down, workers for one are still listed as withdrawn from the workforce.

My ever so efficent cyber team reactivated a precursor fuel plant and messed up my finely balanced workforce that was just big enough running 4 factories to produce infrastructure.

Mike

[James Patten]

... messed up my finely balanced workforce ...

That reminds me of something - there ought to be a way to stop researching something once started.  I accidentally started research in a colony that wasn't prepared for it, and ended up with a severe worker shortage.  The only way out of it was to start pumping the colonists to the colony.  I couldn't figure out how to stop research, since there didn't seem to be a way to clear it.

[Steve Walmsley]

Not sure if this is a bug or a feature, but if a refinery is shut down, workers for one are still listed as withdrawn from the workforce.

My ever so efficent cyber team reactivated a precursor fuel plant and messed up my finely balanced workforce that was just big enough running 4 factories to produce infrastructure.

That reminds me of something - there ought to be a way to stop researching something once started.  I accidentally started research in a colony that wasn't prepared for it, and ended up with a severe worker shortage.  The only way out of it was to start pumping the colonists to the colony.  I couldn't figure out how to stop research, since there didn't seem to be a way to clear it.

In Aurora, workers are allocated to installations whether they are operating or not. This is partly for simplicity but partly because I don't want to allow workers to jump easily between working in a fuel refinery and a shipyard. In reality, you couldn't just keep temporarily closing down different sections of your industrial base, redeploying the workers and then a few months later switch them all around again.

I have considered changing factories to the same model as shipyards so instead of having construction factories, fighter factories, etc, so you would just have factories. You could then "retool" a number of factories to do a specific task, such as building shipyards or a particular model of fighter. One option in this model would be to close down factories to free up workers and if you did that, you would have to retool them once you needed them again to reflect opening up the factories and training the workers. All new factories, including those found in ruins, would start as unused.

Steve

[vergeraiders]

[quote="Steve Walmsley]In Aurora, workers are allocated to installations whether they are operating or not. This is partly for simplicity but partly because I don't want to allow workers to jump easily between working in a fuel refinery and a shipyard. In reality, you couldn't just keep temporarily closing down different sections of your industrial base, redeploying the workers and then a few months later switch them all around again.
Steve[/quote]

I was wondering if that was the reason.

[quote="Steve Walmsley]
I have considered changing factories to the same model as shipyards so instead of having construction factories, fighter factories, etc, so you would just have factories. You could then "retool" a number of factories to do a specific task, such as building shipyards or a particular model of fighter. One option in this model would be to close down factories to free up workers and if you did that, you would have to retool them once you needed them again to reflect opening up the factories and training the workers. All new factories, including those found in ruins, would start as unused.

Steve[/quote]

I think I like that idea, a lot. I also kind of think it may balance fighter and missile races better if all of the production came out of one pot. Though figuring out exactly how much fuel production is worth how much mine production is worth how much factory production is worth how much shipyrad creation may be delicate .

Mike

[Randy]

I have considered changing factories to the same model as shipyards so instead of having construction factories, fighter factories, etc, so you would just have factories. You could then "retool" a number of factories to do a specific task, such as building shipyards or a particular model of fighter

Put me n the Opposed category. No real advantage to doing this, and a lot of extra micromanagement required. Much simpler to leave it as it stands

[Haegan2005]

Agreed.
[quote="Randy"
Put me n the Opposed category. No real advantage to doing this, and a lot of extra micromanagement required. Much simpler to leave it as it stands [/quote]

[vergeraiders]

Well there should be some way to solve my basic problem.

Just because a cybernetic team was lucky enough to reactivate a precursor fuel refinery, there no reason for my carefully selected construction workers, that I paid to ship to the colony, to suddenly decide they prefer to work in a refinery that I neither started production in or have any sorium on the planet to start doing so.



Mike

[Erik L (OP)]

Well there should be some way to solve my basic problem.

Just because a cybernetic team was lucky enough to reactivate a precursor fuel refinery, there no reason for my carefully selected construction workers, that I paid to ship to the colony, to suddenly decide they prefer to work in a refinery that I neither started production in or have any sorium on the planet to start doing so.



Mike

Making the basic assumption you are still shipping things like infrastructure to the site, have your freighters pick up the refinery on one of their trips. The workers go back to what they should, and everyone is happy.

[sloanjh]

Well there should be some way to solve my basic problem.

Just because a cybernetic team was lucky enough to reactivate a precursor fuel refinery, there no reason for my carefully selected construction workers, that I paid to ship to the colony, to suddenly decide they prefer to work in a refinery that I neither started production in or have any sorium on the planet to start doing so.

:-)

John

PS - I'm a little worried about the micromanagment aspects of retooling factories too.  I wouldn't be opposed to a "layoff N factories/SY/whatever" command coupled to a "rehire N" command that freed up workers then slowly recovered the capacity, i.e. "rehire N" increase the "active" factories by N over 6 months.  It would probably be pretty yuckky to code up, however, for something that I don't think comes up often and can be worked around in SM mode.

[Steve Walmsley]

Based on the general response, I'll forget the retooling factories idea. I might try and come up with something that allows you to shut down a particular section of industry but with some penalty involved to restarting it.

Steve

[MWadwell]

Based on the general response, I'll forget the retooling factories idea. I might try and come up with something that allows you to shut down a particular section of industry but with some penalty involved to restarting it.

Steve

What about imposing a time penalty to the workers - such as when you shut a factory down, the workers are considered as still in use for 30 days afterwards (and so only after the period, are they available for other uses)?

[Kurt]

Steve -

During a recent battle, I got a large number of error messages when missiles started hitting planetary targets.  The error was:

Error in Planetary Bombardment
Error 3265, Item Not Found

I entered through the errors, and the bombardment results seemed right.  I suspect that you've changed something, and that the combat results routine is looking for something that is no longer there.  

Kurt

[Kurt]

Steve ?

I seem to have run into a bit of a problem, either in my understanding of the game or a bug.  Probably a bug, but we?ll see.

The situation is as follows: A group of FAC?s launch missiles at a group of four cruisers.  The missiles are launched at 167,000 km?s, and travel at 18,000 kps.  The cruisers are armed with three dual 12 cm laser turrets each, each of which have a ROF of five.  I calculated things out and realized that the cruisers should be able to get in two point defense shots with their lasers, once at approximately 77,000 km?s and the second time at point blank range.  Accordingly, I set the ship?s fire control to area point defense 8, so that they would engage targets out to 80,000 km?s.  

The first course of fire against the incoming missiles went off okay, although there was something strange.  The four cruisers have a total of twelve double turrets, for a total of twenty-four lasers.  They fired as planned, but only two of the three turrets on each ship engaged, strangely enough.  While it is possible that this is due to an error in setting up the fire on my part, I don?t think it was as I set up one ship and copied its fire control settings throughout the fleet, then hit the open fire button for the entire fleet.  Still, it is possible that I set that last turret on each ship to something different.  

At any rate, after this course of fire, I reset the fire control for the entire fleet to point blank 1, and hit the open fire button for the entire fleet.  This time none of the lasers engaged, not even the turrets that hadn?t fired in the first round.  The notation in the Event Update screen noted for the first two turrets on the first cruiser as follows: ?Twin 12cm C4 Near Ultraviolet Laser Turret recharging.  0 power in capacitor.  8 power required to fire.?  None of the other ship?s turrets are listed as even trying to fire.  

The ship design is as follows:

Code: [Select]

Tharsis Montes Flt II class Escort Cruiser    8000 tons     783 Crew     1214.4 BP      TCS 160  TH 320  EM 780
2000 km/s     Armour 1     Shields 26-400     Sensors 32/0/0/0     Damage Control 0-0     PPV 33
Replacement Parts 10    

Nuclear Pulse Engine  (8)    Power 40    Efficiency 0.80    Signature 40    Armour 0    Exp 5%
Fuel Capacity 150,000 Litres    Range 101.3 billion km   (585 days at full power)
Gamma R400/16 Shields (13)   Total Fuel Cost  208 Litres per day

Twin 12cm C4 Near Ultraviolet Laser Turret (3x2)    Range 96,000km     TS: 12800 km/s     Power 8-8     RM 3    ROF 5        4 4 4 3 2 2 1 1 1 0
PD Fire Control  (3)    Max Range: 96,000 km   TS: 12800 km/s     90 79 69 58 48 38 27 17 6 0
Gas-Cooled Fast Reactor  (2)     Total Power Output 28    Armour 0    Exp 5%

Missile Sensor, Small (1)     GPS 12.8     Range 128k km    Resolution 0.2
Ship Sensor, Small (1)     GPS 2560     Range 25.6m km    Resolution 40
Thermal Sensor, Small (1)     Sensitivity 32     Detect Sig Strength 1000:  32m km


One question occurs immediately ? what does ?Power 8-8? mean.  Eight units of power in eight seconds?  If so, what does ROF 5 mean?  

Looking at the tech report screen, the 12cm C4 NU Laser has the following stats:
Power: 4
Recharge Rate: 4
Max Rate of Fire: 5 seconds

The class design screen shows that the ship has a power requirement of 24, and has a power generation capability of 28, and none of the ships were damaged, and all had fuel.  

If I did something wrong, I can?t understand what it would have been.  It is always possible that I don?t understand something that I think I understand, of course.  Otherwise, the problem may be in the recharge calculations, or in the turn sequence.  Do weapons recharge after firing, or before?

Kurt

[Erik L (OP)]

One question occurs immediately ? what does ?Power 8-8? mean.  Eight units of power in eight seconds?  If so, what does ROF 5 mean?  

I've always interpreted the power statement to read "8 required, 8 charged/5 seconds" (in this case).

[Kurt]

One question occurs immediately ? what does ?Power 8-8? mean.  Eight units of power in eight seconds?  If so, what does ROF 5 mean?  

I've always interpreted the power statement to read "8 required, 8 charged/5 seconds" (in this case).

That is what I thought as well, but based on this ship's performance in battle, it doesn't appear that that interpretation is correct.  Unless something is wrong, of course.

Kurt